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Wondering if I'm always unpopular because I'm autistic?

138 replies

remembranceday212 · 14/11/2024 17:21

A couple of people said they thought I was autistic recently which was a total shocker.

Having looked into it a bit it does kind of make sense. I'm not going to pursue a diagnosis because frankly it's no one else's business.

I've done well at school, Uni and work, so it hasn't held me back as such.

But the bit I'm not coping with is just not fitting in with any group, and not 'getting it'.

I just never get what people are talking about in groups- and need things explained to me really clearly before I get it. By which point the conversation has died or completely moved on.

Just feeling sorry for myself really. Just feel really lonely, and would love to be included. I come across as really friendly, but after a short while people move away from me.

OP posts:
PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 11:31

Interesting about ADHD @BertieBotts I'd need to read up on it.

@DesertGecko We sound very similar with the humour/eye contact/empathy.

Tarantella6 · 15/11/2024 11:26

eightIsNewNine · 15/11/2024 10:36

I'm sometimes wondering whether the NTs really share the code (as much as they think) or whether they think/pretend they understand each other, but if their interpretation of the clues got verified they would be way off quite often.

My theory is that ND people see seeking precise understanding as a part of mutual respect, while NT see value in a smooth flow even when they don't understand a word.

I agree with this. I don't think I'm autistic but dh would disagree 😁 but yes I absolutely value a smooth interaction with no awkwardness far more than understanding every nuance the other person is trying to communicate. This could be because I'm not generally super interested in what they think anyway.

If someone is giving me an instruction I will check and double check I have understood correctly. But the rest of the time who cares what they think 😅

dancinfeet · 15/11/2024 11:21

hi OP- I could have written your post I feel exactly the same way. I have lots of acquaintances through work but only one actual friend and I also find it hard to join in group conversations, I seem to be a conversation stopper rather than a conversation starter. In secondary school I was bullied because I didn’t know how to fit in to any social group- one group of girls would make a joke of one day talking to me and being super friendly and the next day turning their backs and telling me to go away. I spent every single morning of secondary school wondering if anyone would speak to me that day or if I would commit some mysterious faux pas that would mean that everyone would shun me.
As an adult I have learned to avoid social situations, it’s easier to say I don’t like pubs and decline invites rather than suffer the excruciating embarrassment of being invited along but then ignored in the corner all evening, and any attempts to join in group conversations shut down. It’s easier to convince myself that I don’t like other people than it is to face their rejection after a sincere attempt at friendship. I hear you, it’s a lonely place to be.

FancyRedRobin · 15/11/2024 11:20

My husband recently received a diagnosis of ASD, just after our child.
He tastes this book "looking after your autistic self"

PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 11:14

DesertGecko · 15/11/2024 10:29

Ohhh ok thank you, my English is very mixed up from being raised in a few different countries even though I was born in England 🥴 I’m also small so similar comments, people are not very original! Actually when I say people it’s always men. I actually always wanted one of those dogs, but I thought maybe they’re too big for me…and then we ended up with the world’s largest Labrador anyways. A lady in the park once let me hug hers, like a big white fluffy cuddly soft toy 🥰 (I didn’t pester her to hug her dog she offered of her own accord 😅) Hugging stranger’s dogs in the park, now who sounds batshit?!

Men, yes, always men have to say something to a woman with a massive dog. I wonder if it threatens their masculinity in some way? I've had men say "that dog's too big for you" but also been told "that's a man's dog" by macho type builders. It was sometimes almost a flirtatious banter in my younger days, and I'd retort back something sarcastic about men having poodles or toy breeds, but I don't say much now I'm an old hag.

It's not so much the size that's the issue with Pyrenean dogs, it's the fact that it's a guarding breed, so they're very independent and stubborn which makes them hard to train, and their recall is non existent 😨 They have a loud bark and they shed fluff constantly, so not an easy dog for most people to live with. But they are lovely and people do like to cuddle them, it's not really batshit if the owner says it's okay 😊

Jellycats4life · 15/11/2024 11:13

I think it’s a bit simplistic and disrespectful of people with autism to imply they don’t have friends, and it’s autism to blame.

I think it’s short sighted and offensive to not only dismiss one of the fundamental aspects of autism (social-communication issues) AND the lived experience of people in this thread, all because you see your young son having friends.

Autism isn’t necessarily a death sentence for friendships and relationships but, in my experience, it’s one thing to maintain friendships when you are together all day every day at school/college, than it is out in the world as an adult.

WasThatACorner · 15/11/2024 11:13

OP, have you considered looking at techniques that other people are using to cope with the particular areas where you are struggling?

You don't have to have a diagnosis to be able to identify areas you would like to work on and do some research online to see how other people manage those same issues.

There are people on Instagram etc who do little communication videos that my wife (who is autistic) finds really helpful. Little things like that might help you to 'get' what other people are talking about.

I would also say, open yourself up to friendships with people who have a similar communication style to you or are different but enjoy yours. Maybe the people you are trying to click with just don't fit for you?

loveydoveyloon · 15/11/2024 11:12

AutisticHouseMove · 14/11/2024 18:08

I had years of people asking me if I'd considered I might be autistic before I was diagnosed. I didn't really know anything about it the first time it happened.

I won't pretend some of those weren't being dicks but most of them were well meaning.

I very rarely tell anyone.

But, yes, I have come to the conclusion that it is largely why I am unpopular.

How do you go about a diagnosis? How did you approach it with your GP?

I had an appointment I was going to go and speak to them but cancelled because I don't want to walk into the GP and tell her i think I may have ADHD or autism - or both and she just laughs at me or dismisses it.

(I did online tests with my son who definitely has ADHD and I scored higher on both tests - would explain why I never keep friends, never fit in, have always felt 'odd' compared to everyone else)

DesertGecko · 15/11/2024 11:07

PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 10:45

@BertieBotts
Thank you, this is fascinating in many ways and I hope it's okay if I save it for my own reference (I promise I will not quote you anywhere).

I definitely do the waffling on/long answers. But the reason one of our GP's thinks I'm chronic anxiety not ND, is my use of humour. I do self-deprecating, black humour, sarcasm, irony. Americans never ever get my humour, they take it literally; as you point out here. I learned this on Ravelry when a US mod banned me (and a felow European poster) for a joke about a cat 🙄 I also make eye contact, and in conversation I do ask about someone's kid, dog, ailment. So I'm not quite typical although possessing many autism traits. I do empathy but I think it's a myth that ND people don't... I think, as you say, it just gets lost in translation, as it were.

This humour thing is bollocks…we’re not androids. I know a lot of funny autists. Their humour may be different (dry / dark / offbeat etc). Eye contact you can learn to do as a social norm although I don’t love it and don’t always know how long to hold it for. And yes I can ask reciprocal questions about other people because I have learned to make small talk…although I hate small talk.

BertieBotts · 15/11/2024 11:05

eightIsNewNine · 15/11/2024 10:36

I'm sometimes wondering whether the NTs really share the code (as much as they think) or whether they think/pretend they understand each other, but if their interpretation of the clues got verified they would be way off quite often.

My theory is that ND people see seeking precise understanding as a part of mutual respect, while NT see value in a smooth flow even when they don't understand a word.

They definitely don't, as seen in most of AIBU.

Just look at any collection of threads on a given day - a huge proportion of them will be people reading hidden meaning into something that somebody else has done or said, and then all the responses argue about what the hidden meaning was, usually most agree that there must BE a meaning, which is fascinating.

It's a really good point about precision being valuable and therefore a sign of respect. I think you're right about this and I hadn't really thought about it before.

@PyreneanAubrie this sounds similar to an ADHD profile where there is overlap between both. I can follow NT communication, though I miss a lot of subtext and may only pick it up later, but I get enough subtext that it works 90% of the time, and as eight pointed out, approximate communication works with NT communication so this is normally fine. I definitely don't struggle with communication (in a NT world) as much as most people who are diagnosed autistic tend to.

I find autistic communication tends to make sense to me too, though I might get occasionally frustrated when someone fixates on a small detail or is overly pedantic about terminology. Not because I think it isn't important, because often I totally agree that it is, but sometimes because I can fall into the trap of thinking someone is being obtuse or just simply being a bit impatient and wishing they would get on with it Blush I find autistic thinking is sometimes a bit black and white and can sort of draw a border around an issue where the person seems to want to pretend that the issue never interacts with anything else whereas I feel more like everything is connected, and it's the connections and interactions and contradictions which are fascinating to me.

Lazydaisy991 · 15/11/2024 11:05

I'm 45 and pretty sure I'm autistic. My mum actually said it a few years ago, said there wasn't the awareness there is now when I was younger but looking back and reading up on it I realise I probably am. I don't really have any friends, have my dh and kids one of which has adhd. I can be very to the point with people, I can't dress up what I'm trying to say and people often don't like how direct I am. I suspect this is why I have a lack of friends. I just find people hard work.

Guyforkz · 15/11/2024 11:00

I’m the same OP. Pretty sure I’m autistic, with an embarrassing special interest in why people do things and their thought processes and feelings. I mask this so hard in public though. NT seem to think less about these things and just understand what’s going on.
I’ve never really fitted in so I totally understand how much it hurts.

DesertGecko · 15/11/2024 10:49

Secradonugh · 15/11/2024 10:38

It's completely dependent on the people around you. If say you are 50 or older, had to move around multiple schools because they just thought you were difficult, had no one explain to you why you found it difficult until you were in your 30s and could only seek advice from then onwards, then that's completely different from a child with autism who is allowed to be in mainstream schools and interact properly with other kids. Age is a huge factor because society wasn't helpful. The challenge of autism / ADD and ADHD isn't the people who have it, it's been society learning better to integrate.

This is very true. The younger generation are raised in a society that better understands and accepts neurodivergence. It’s a far different experience in that way for them, thankfully. I think people of my generation and older grew up with intense social anxiety / bullying and end up a bit misanthropic/suspicious of others. Masking is tiresome and gets old after a while, but many people don’t feel ‘safe’ to be ourselves around. Well anyways that’s my viewpoint.

PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 10:45

@BertieBotts
Thank you, this is fascinating in many ways and I hope it's okay if I save it for my own reference (I promise I will not quote you anywhere).

I definitely do the waffling on/long answers. But the reason one of our GP's thinks I'm chronic anxiety not ND, is my use of humour. I do self-deprecating, black humour, sarcasm, irony. Americans never ever get my humour, they take it literally; as you point out here. I learned this on Ravelry when a US mod banned me (and a felow European poster) for a joke about a cat 🙄 I also make eye contact, and in conversation I do ask about someone's kid, dog, ailment. So I'm not quite typical although possessing many autism traits. I do empathy but I think it's a myth that ND people don't... I think, as you say, it just gets lost in translation, as it were.

Secradonugh · 15/11/2024 10:38

JustinThyme · 15/11/2024 10:34

I think it’s a bit simplistic and disrespectful of people with autism to imply they don’t have friends, and it’s autism to blame.

My DC has a great group of friends. It took him time to find his tribes a as it does for many people, ND and NT alike - but he’s sociable and popular. He also is unlikely to be able to live independently, but that’s ok. We work around it.

Autism isn’t a death sentence for friendships and relationships, for goodness sake. It can explain why people find some types of interactions challenging, but it’s not a foregone conclusion that the OP can’t have friends.

It's completely dependent on the people around you. If say you are 50 or older, had to move around multiple schools because they just thought you were difficult, had no one explain to you why you found it difficult until you were in your 30s and could only seek advice from then onwards, then that's completely different from a child with autism who is allowed to be in mainstream schools and interact properly with other kids. Age is a huge factor because society wasn't helpful. The challenge of autism / ADD and ADHD isn't the people who have it, it's been society learning better to integrate.

eightIsNewNine · 15/11/2024 10:36

BertieBotts · 15/11/2024 10:13

The double empathy problem is useful to read about - basically, autistic people typically struggle with neurotypical social expectations. NT communication involves a lot of assumption, subtext, context, implication, missing information which you're expected to fill in (because it's "obvious") etc, usually because it is considered rude to make a direct request, or because giving the "obvious" information implies that the listener is stupid, unfamiliar with the topic etc and may insult them or result in an explanation which is too long. (As I write this not in the correct order, I realise the irony of me explaining that ND explanations can be too long!)

Autistic people often miss a lot of this, or don't know what assumptions to make or what information to fill in, not because they are stupid or unfamiliar with the topic, but because it can be difficult to assimilate parts of things out of context. They can take people overly literally. There is also a lot of (in NT communication) what I tend to think of as social code, which is non-literal, and where you're adding little extra things to interactions in order to communicate an underlying piece of info about your feeling or the relationship between you - it might be something that means "this was a lot of effort, please appreciate it" or "I don't want to overstep boundaries" or "we are just the same, you and me" or "remember, I'm the one in charge" or "I want this interaction to end now/soon".

Because in real life communication, those will rarely be literal but things like self-deprecating humour, or references to pop culture, or even total inversions of the literal meaning (oh it's no trouble at all!) or sometimes nonverbal e.g. tone or body language, they can be difficult to pick up on for autistic people who often prefer a more direct communication style, and may struggle to make sense of something taken out of context (e.g. a pop culture reference). And/or they may come across as pointless (talk about the weather) so may be ignored, or alternately they may be taken much too seriously where a NT person would recognise that it's just social lubricant and not pay attention to the words themselves but note the meaning, usually subconsciously.

This kind of thing led to a medical belief for years that autistic people "don't have empathy" simply because they don't respond in an expected way to NT social cues and/or don't pick up on subtle clues that the other person might be bored, irritated, upset, uncomfortable etc.

This is a very specific, NT-coded model of empathy. So it's incorrect to say autistic people don't have empathy, just because they don't automatically pick up on and perform the social rituals that we tend to code as empathetic.

So OTOH, you could turn this around and say NT people struggle to empathise with autistic people and/or struggle with autistic communication style. NT people use unclear communication and don't get straight to the point or explain what they mean. They may get annoyed at questions they feel are intrusive or unnecessary. They may be unaware of signs that an autistic person is becoming uncomfortable, anxious, or confused about what is being communicated to them. But nobody suggests that NT people don't have empathy.

Autistic people tend to communicate much more easily with other autistic people, because they don't usually do all of that social coding stuff unless they have picked up on the fact that other people do it and repeat it almost rote - it often feels a bit out of place to NTs, usually because they have picked up on a rough context where this happens but not the subtleties of exactly when. Autistic people also often give a thorough and exact explanation, which can come across as too specific or too long to NT people, but is usually welcomed by other autistic people. And they may be more likely to be direct in requests, which again is clearer to other autistic people and usually not taken offensively. Clarifying questions are also welcomed in autistic communication, whereas autistic to NT clarifying questions are sometimes mistaken for being one of the "socially coded" type interactions and taken as a dig at the original person's instructions/authority or seen as a way that the questioning person is trying to get out of following the instruction.

When NT people communicate with other NT people they can usually follow the other person's social codes and context unless there is a barrier such as differing cultural norms (because social codes are extremely culturally specific) - culture shock is a great example to look at this, because for example if you take two cultures which seem similar but the communication norms are quite different, e.g. British/American - the first time one interacts with the other, you get the American wondering if they have upset or offended the Brit, or assuming the Brit is a nervous kind of person because a Brit will often make a lot of self-deprecating jokes, this is our way of demonstrating respect, by reassuring the other person that I don't think I'm better than you. And our level of friendliness towards acquaintances is much more understated. Then the other way around, the Brit may wonder if the American is trying to manipulate or trick them, or think that they are an arrogant sort of person, because the level of friendliness Americans tend to display towards acquaintances is much more obvious and can come across as fake or disengenious to Brits, and because in American culture, confidence communicates competence and trustworthiness, whereas in British culture confidence can look like superiority. Once you get used to this, you can then "read" the person more easily.

The double empathy problem is about how autistic people and NT people fail to understand each other properly, though understand each other much better. And the fact that in these interactions, it is only the autistic person who is accused of not having empathy and expected to change the way they communicate in order that NT people won't misunderstand them.

I'm sometimes wondering whether the NTs really share the code (as much as they think) or whether they think/pretend they understand each other, but if their interpretation of the clues got verified they would be way off quite often.

My theory is that ND people see seeking precise understanding as a part of mutual respect, while NT see value in a smooth flow even when they don't understand a word.

JustinThyme · 15/11/2024 10:34

I think it’s a bit simplistic and disrespectful of people with autism to imply they don’t have friends, and it’s autism to blame.

My DC has a great group of friends. It took him time to find his tribes a as it does for many people, ND and NT alike - but he’s sociable and popular. He also is unlikely to be able to live independently, but that’s ok. We work around it.

Autism isn’t a death sentence for friendships and relationships, for goodness sake. It can explain why people find some types of interactions challenging, but it’s not a foregone conclusion that the OP can’t have friends.

Gettingbysomehow · 15/11/2024 10:33

A good friend I work with is autistic. She cannot make friends at all. She's ok with me because im very laid back but people just dont get her sicially or at work.

PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 10:29

eightIsNewNine · 15/11/2024 09:25

How disappointing. All those words about a study about liking or disliking "autistic people" and in the end they mention they haven't included a single ND woman in the sample.
I'd thought that the fact that ND demonstrates itself differently in women is known by now, but once again, nope.

Thanks for the link anyway, I don't want to shoot the messenger, it's just sooo annoying, another default men.

I dunno, it's weird because I think I'm pretty good at masking my autism/anxiety, but then even when I think I'm being normal, my chap will sometimes tell me I was being "a bit odd". I think anxiety makes me come across as self-absorbed, because I'm so busy worrying about what I'm going to say next, that I don't always take in what the other person says. But there's probably more to it than that.

My mother didn't know anything of autism but said I was often described as "a strange child" or as being "quaint" like a pixie or a changeling. She herself would word it as "you were not quite like other children". But although I have two male cousins who are neurodiverse, in the 60's/70's nobody was aware of it in girls. I did fairly normal stuff like dolls, and later, as a teen, pop music but I was still never invited to friends houses or to parties. So clearly, there is something that singles us out, even when we're not aware of it.

It was only as an adult that I realised some of this. Even when I tried to fit in I was always an outsider. It's still the same; on my street there are 7 women of similar age to me, they socialise, go for walks with their dogs etc. in twos or threes, they spend ages chatting on the street, but I'm lucky if I get a hello. Three of them are a bit nicer to me since the jubilee street party, because I explained to one of them that I wouldn't be attending due to autism/anxiety. Now they seem to make a little more effort to be friendly, but I'm still an outsider, even though I've lived here the longest.

Sorry for waffling on about myself again😳

DesertGecko · 15/11/2024 10:29

PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 10:09

Yes, she is that breed - they are Pyrenean Mountain Dog here, Great Pyrenees in the US. Oh yeah, I can identify with that with your XL Lab! I'm quite little so I get told "you could put a saddle on that and ride it" almost every day- if I had £1 for every time someone has said that in the last 47 years I would be a wealthy woman 😁I've had 8 of these dogs and I love them... but I do waffle on about them far too much, it has to be said. I know, it's another ND trait 🙄

Being called lovely makes a change from the old MN chestnut "batshit". Been called that a few times on AIBU 😜 My dog is lovely and I'm sure your XL Lab is too; see we could gel over big dogs at least!

Ohhh ok thank you, my English is very mixed up from being raised in a few different countries even though I was born in England 🥴 I’m also small so similar comments, people are not very original! Actually when I say people it’s always men. I actually always wanted one of those dogs, but I thought maybe they’re too big for me…and then we ended up with the world’s largest Labrador anyways. A lady in the park once let me hug hers, like a big white fluffy cuddly soft toy 🥰 (I didn’t pester her to hug her dog she offered of her own accord 😅) Hugging stranger’s dogs in the park, now who sounds batshit?!

Secradonugh · 15/11/2024 10:21

remembranceday212 · 14/11/2024 17:21

A couple of people said they thought I was autistic recently which was a total shocker.

Having looked into it a bit it does kind of make sense. I'm not going to pursue a diagnosis because frankly it's no one else's business.

I've done well at school, Uni and work, so it hasn't held me back as such.

But the bit I'm not coping with is just not fitting in with any group, and not 'getting it'.

I just never get what people are talking about in groups- and need things explained to me really clearly before I get it. By which point the conversation has died or completely moved on.

Just feeling sorry for myself really. Just feel really lonely, and would love to be included. I come across as really friendly, but after a short while people move away from me.

Darling. Get a diagnosis, then you can seek counselling to help you in those situations. Too many autistics (especially girls) don't get diagnosed, so don't get to have the mechanism to pick up on the conversation. If "other" people know you have autism, then most of them will go out of their way to include you when you join a conversation as long as you aren't being rude / short.

BertieBotts · 15/11/2024 10:18

TheWayTheLightFalls · 15/11/2024 07:45

This is me too. Diagnosed earlier this year, so posted on the “Autistic MNetters Assemble” thread to introduce myself and seek advice… totally ignored. It hurt more than years of social exclusion in the real world!

I can get by fairly well in NT circles - I mask, and people often seek me out to lead groups etc, present at work. But I hate it.

Just saying with this one - there is enough overlap between ADHD and ASD and I do think this is a familiar experience for ADHDers.

BertieBotts · 15/11/2024 10:13

The double empathy problem is useful to read about - basically, autistic people typically struggle with neurotypical social expectations. NT communication involves a lot of assumption, subtext, context, implication, missing information which you're expected to fill in (because it's "obvious") etc, usually because it is considered rude to make a direct request, or because giving the "obvious" information implies that the listener is stupid, unfamiliar with the topic etc and may insult them or result in an explanation which is too long. (As I write this not in the correct order, I realise the irony of me explaining that ND explanations can be too long!)

Autistic people often miss a lot of this, or don't know what assumptions to make or what information to fill in, not because they are stupid or unfamiliar with the topic, but because it can be difficult to assimilate parts of things out of context. They can take people overly literally. There is also a lot of (in NT communication) what I tend to think of as social code, which is non-literal, and where you're adding little extra things to interactions in order to communicate an underlying piece of info about your feeling or the relationship between you - it might be something that means "this was a lot of effort, please appreciate it" or "I don't want to overstep boundaries" or "we are just the same, you and me" or "remember, I'm the one in charge" or "I want this interaction to end now/soon".

Because in real life communication, those will rarely be literal but things like self-deprecating humour, or references to pop culture, or even total inversions of the literal meaning (oh it's no trouble at all!) or sometimes nonverbal e.g. tone or body language, they can be difficult to pick up on for autistic people who often prefer a more direct communication style, and may struggle to make sense of something taken out of context (e.g. a pop culture reference). And/or they may come across as pointless (talk about the weather) so may be ignored, or alternately they may be taken much too seriously where a NT person would recognise that it's just social lubricant and not pay attention to the words themselves but note the meaning, usually subconsciously.

This kind of thing led to a medical belief for years that autistic people "don't have empathy" simply because they don't respond in an expected way to NT social cues and/or don't pick up on subtle clues that the other person might be bored, irritated, upset, uncomfortable etc.

This is a very specific, NT-coded model of empathy. So it's incorrect to say autistic people don't have empathy, just because they don't automatically pick up on and perform the social rituals that we tend to code as empathetic.

So OTOH, you could turn this around and say NT people struggle to empathise with autistic people and/or struggle with autistic communication style. NT people use unclear communication and don't get straight to the point or explain what they mean. They may get annoyed at questions they feel are intrusive or unnecessary. They may be unaware of signs that an autistic person is becoming uncomfortable, anxious, or confused about what is being communicated to them. But nobody suggests that NT people don't have empathy.

Autistic people tend to communicate much more easily with other autistic people, because they don't usually do all of that social coding stuff unless they have picked up on the fact that other people do it and repeat it almost rote - it often feels a bit out of place to NTs, usually because they have picked up on a rough context where this happens but not the subtleties of exactly when. Autistic people also often give a thorough and exact explanation, which can come across as too specific or too long to NT people, but is usually welcomed by other autistic people. And they may be more likely to be direct in requests, which again is clearer to other autistic people and usually not taken offensively. Clarifying questions are also welcomed in autistic communication, whereas autistic to NT clarifying questions are sometimes mistaken for being one of the "socially coded" type interactions and taken as a dig at the original person's instructions/authority or seen as a way that the questioning person is trying to get out of following the instruction.

When NT people communicate with other NT people they can usually follow the other person's social codes and context unless there is a barrier such as differing cultural norms (because social codes are extremely culturally specific) - culture shock is a great example to look at this, because for example if you take two cultures which seem similar but the communication norms are quite different, e.g. British/American - the first time one interacts with the other, you get the American wondering if they have upset or offended the Brit, or assuming the Brit is a nervous kind of person because a Brit will often make a lot of self-deprecating jokes, this is our way of demonstrating respect, by reassuring the other person that I don't think I'm better than you. And our level of friendliness towards acquaintances is much more understated. Then the other way around, the Brit may wonder if the American is trying to manipulate or trick them, or think that they are an arrogant sort of person, because the level of friendliness Americans tend to display towards acquaintances is much more obvious and can come across as fake or disengenious to Brits, and because in American culture, confidence communicates competence and trustworthiness, whereas in British culture confidence can look like superiority. Once you get used to this, you can then "read" the person more easily.

The double empathy problem is about how autistic people and NT people fail to understand each other properly, though understand each other much better. And the fact that in these interactions, it is only the autistic person who is accused of not having empathy and expected to change the way they communicate in order that NT people won't misunderstand them.

PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 10:09

DesertGecko · 15/11/2024 09:54

Like a Great Pyrenees? People are scared of our dog and he’s a Lab 😂 Granted I call him an XL Lab because he’s huge (‘is that a horse or a dog /hyuck-hyuck-hyuck’ comments). I think you sound lovely 🧙‍♀️

Yes, she is that breed - they are Pyrenean Mountain Dog here, Great Pyrenees in the US. Oh yeah, I can identify with that with your XL Lab! I'm quite little so I get told "you could put a saddle on that and ride it" almost every day- if I had £1 for every time someone has said that in the last 47 years I would be a wealthy woman 😁I've had 8 of these dogs and I love them... but I do waffle on about them far too much, it has to be said. I know, it's another ND trait 🙄

Being called lovely makes a change from the old MN chestnut "batshit". Been called that a few times on AIBU 😜 My dog is lovely and I'm sure your XL Lab is too; see we could gel over big dogs at least!

DesertGecko · 15/11/2024 09:54

PyreneanAubrie · 15/11/2024 09:39

No 😆 Nothing like an XL Bully! She's a big white fluffy bear, but just "scary" to some people because of her massive size. I'm probably more scary tbh😏

Like a Great Pyrenees? People are scared of our dog and he’s a Lab 😂 Granted I call him an XL Lab because he’s huge (‘is that a horse or a dog /hyuck-hyuck-hyuck’ comments). I think you sound lovely 🧙‍♀️