Considering sending my child to a predominantly South Asian school

OP’s situation is not yours! You have basically described the exact opposite experience. OP is not considering a school with a diverse intake.

Hi OP,
I live in a very white area. I'm white. I can tell you I have no school mum friends made through either of my children. I work etc and they were all friends before the kids started school.

I really don't mind, I have friends with children who we see etc. But just to give the other perspective that even if your child went to a different school, the community may not be welcoming still! Or you may not have mums lining up to be friends.

I would be concerned about the language situation, if dd feels excluded. However, you sound full of enthusiasm. I wonder if it might be an option to perhaps ask the school what the main language spoken tends to be... and perhaps learn some? I think this goes a long way. Good luck!

@Stripedfrog “when you get a school which is not diverse and where the group has self selected into a single culture and language that is not of the home nation, it’s pretty difficult as the white English speaker to become a part of that”

Difficult for anyone to become part of that, and difficult for anyone to get out of that. The forces you’re describing could almost be designed to result in permanent segregation. It seems like a terrible dynamic to plant in a country.

Many of them don’t see integration into the U.K. culture as a good thing.

Don’t be daft - I made loads of friends when my kids were at primary. They’ve nearly left school altogether now but those parent friends are still a key part of my social circle. It’s absolutely fine to be involved at primary - it’s only on MN where it’s considered a crime 🙄

In answer to this, I think it comes down to two things, speaking specifically here about England and drawing on experience of schools (we have moved about and DS has been to a few!)

• one is if there is diversity across a number of cultures and religions then that seems to largely work well as there is no one group that prevails. A common language has to be found and is usually English. People who self select this diverse group wish to mix and maintain that diversity.

• or the prevailing group is white British and those in a minority or minorities have to fit in with that culture, speak the language etc, but are welcomed by the majority group and included. If they are self selecting as a minority who wish to be a part of what’s on offer within the mainstream culture of the country then they want to assimilate and be a part of things.

Language is massively important. It’s not unreasonable to expect a minority group to speak the majority language. But the clash comes if the majority language doesn’t match that of the host nation and children cannot access the social side of things in a school in their own country.

So when you get a school which is not diverse and where the group has self selected into a single culture and language that is not of the home nation, it’s pretty difficult as the white English speaker to become a part of that.

(edited as posted too soon!)

SE Asian or SE Asian Muslim? Your experience will very widely depending on whether they are predominantly Hindu or Muslim. I have nothing against either religions, but in my experience, Muslims tend to be more religious and have cultural lifestyle aspects that are dictated by the religion. They are not academics obsessed.
Hindu people in the UK are much more likely to be inclusive, but you’ll see they are usually competitive with academics.

My children go to a school where 70% of the children are from ethnic minorities - African origin and Asian mostly. Their primary school was also very diverse, although a majority were white children.
We've never had any issue with our children being excluded or not having play dates. At primary school, despite the majority being white, my son seemed to gravitate towards the Asian children. His group of friends were Muslims, Hindus and a Chinese boy. He was always invited to birthday parties and playdates by them.
We do live in an area where everyone mixes. I don't know if it's different in other areas.

OP this is me! I was worried about this too!
My DD goes to a school where she is one of two white kids in her class.
The other parents are from a mix of South Asian and a bit of Arab nationalities and a few African. It's very diverse.

The parents all speak English, they're 2nd generation so we're born and brought up here. Some mums wear a veil, some headscarves, some nothing.

There's a class WhatsApp group, there's been playdates, birthday parties and I'm not good at making friends but if that's your thing I know that it would happen. They are all very very friendly. I have been over to a few of their homes for a cuppa and chat. There is one mum who I see quite regularly and she is a good laugh!

The school has an active PTA. They have things on for Xmas as well as other religious festivals like Eid and Diwali.

I have found it an eye opener and was ashamed of how my prejudices before DD started here.

This is such a depressing thread. It feels like the whole modern experiment is fundamentally doomed, regardless of what we tell ourselves. We can’t build a proper society if large parts of it are going to self-segregate and then keep perpetuating it.

I would ask though: is it only particular configurations where you find this sort of exclusion? I’ve never had an impression of majority white schools being cliquey against outsiders, but maybe that’s not always how it feels?

A hundred per cent this. Children want to blend in, be the same. It's not kind to make them be in a minority if you don't have to.

I have a good friend whose “South Asian” she’s Chinese but was born in Malaysia if you want to be specific. She would happily do play dates chat to other mums etc but they do have a very pushy approach to education. She teases me over my “very relaxed” approach and I tease her for being a “tiger mum” any after school activities would not be allowed to clash with daily often twice daily private tutoring music lessons playing three instrument is normal ballet classes homework language lessons I could go on. She’ll cheerfully admit it’s a very “South Asian” things.

Schools that have a range of different cultures in them are great and that tends to work pretty well, but being a minority in a school that has one dominant culture is quite tough and not something I would want for my child if I had the choice. It depends what the ratio in your child’s year group is and if the other children are all from the same part of South Asia with the same language and same religion. If the parents on the show round were not speaking English then I would not expect to be included much beyond polite greetings.

It is sad. I presume they do realise the kids will effectively be separate and that's exactly what they want. They are very conservative in the roles of male and females and I presume they regard the culture of the UK as undesirable.
I realise there are numerous cultures within the UK and it's not all one thing, but the strength in that is the mutual familiarity and blending which gives cross cultural interest. But not all groups want that.

Our experience is a different in that this was a high school but I've moved my DD out of both school and area as one of 5 white kids in her year group. Predominantly Bengali / Pakistani area. I'd think very carefully OP.

Wonderful school academically but socially abysmal. Starting with low level exclusion, 1st and 2nd gen kids. Her peers either weren't allowed to mix with white kids or simply didn't do non family social stuff. No invites, everything we offered declined. By year 8 it became bullying. Criticism for eating during Ramadan, her clothing, her blonde hair. Boys making sexualised comments about her appearance, her lack of religion etc. her confidence was on the floor. School intervened but we had very little recourse - when it's everyone it's hard to sanction. 3 months in new area and I have a different child. Diversity is extremely important to us, but true diversity, which this wasn't. A good friend has just moved his (black) daughter from the area for the same reason, and she is also thriving in her new school.

I know this thread isn’t yours. In your place, I absolutely would move my dd. She would have felt so isolated in this situation being an only child with no local family. As is she has a diverse mix of friends and one of her besties, who is Muslim, is allowed out but her parents are more strict and she doesn’t go to parties in the evening for example. Dd is 16 btw and there are so many parties at this age now that pubs are for over 18s.

As for the op, we live near a minority white city and idk what it is like in the city schools in some areas as my friend’s ds attended a city school in a majority white location. Our village is mixed albeit majority white and in my experience the kids and parents integrated well, attended birthday parties and so forth. A number of the kids were also mixed race (indian / white) and integration was high including with muslim parents where, for example, their mum grew up in India as the mum speaks perfect English having attended university. The only kids, who weren’t allowed to integrate were Plymouth Bretheren.

What you are describing with your dd being one of very few white kids, I would wonder how well she and you are able to integrate (I’m meaning out of school times). If you’re wanting personal friendships, coffee dates and play dates, I would make discreet enquires if you are able about how it currently works with the children currently at the school. At primary age, social and soft skills are very important. Any academics can be caught up through parental or private tutoring.

Is there a middle ground?

It seems there are only two extremes- either they don't go out on weekends, speak their own language, no parties/playdates and probably best not to be 'right on' and try to fit in

or

wear a mini skirt and go pole dancing

I’m mixed race and would not send my DC to a school that was a majority of any ethnic group other than white British, the majority group of the country. I don’t think it’s a positive thing, and I definitely would not be focused on trying to immerse myself in SE Asian or any other non British customs and culture in order for my child to fit in at school and for me to make mum friends in the UK.

We have gone from a predominantly white school to a predominantly se Asian school and I prefer this school. No negative interactions at school, in the classroom or in the playground. The classroom seems to fly through classes much more productively without the constant interruptions of the few usual suspects. The school grounds are always nice and tidy at the last school areas such as the toilets were always being vandalised.
The parents are all friendly but yes, in a more distant way. But they really encourage their kids to be good people and sadly that was often not the case at the prior school. The students and families seem a lot prouder of the school. I really wanted to get my kids away from the rougher kids especially before high school.
The only downside is less social invitations.

I think it depends which ethnic group and what generation. I’m 2nd gen and I don’t care about race or religion and will speak to whoever is standing next to me. Always seem to have weekends booked up with parties and playdates as do my asian siblings. So I wouldn’t assume it will be very conservative. I had playdates when I was a kid and my parents were happy to drop me off.

Most second gens primarily speak in English so if the parents were mainly speaking a different tongue then yeah I would expect it to be quite conservative. Playdates just aren’t a thing in many cultures so it’s not that people are necessarily against them, they just don’t know about them. If you decide to send your child there you may have to be very proactive on the social side.

The first gens I know who make a big effort to join in tend to be from professional backgrounds and are making an effort to integrate or to make sure their kids have the same experiences as other kids. It really does depend. I would never ever send my child to a school which looked like the families were quite religious though.

Honestly I would never proactively make a choice for my child that puts them in a minority, unless there is a very strong reason for it. So if all of the other schools around you get terrible results (for example) I would explore it further, but if there are other decent schools close by with a more mixed/diverse make-up I would pick one of those - especially given the parents weren't speaking English on the tour, that's a red flag for both your child's and your experience.

My friend has her 2 girls at a 98-99% S Asian school where the main religion is Islam. She loves the school and the teachers that side is all excellent. But she hasn't been able to make any friends. No playdates . No birthday parties. I feel sorry for her that she doesn't have any company to even chat to at the school gate and the girls are happy enough but never see anyone outside school time or during the holidays which is lonely. The trick would be to have your child in activities outside school I think so they can hopefully make some friends and you can too. She has found the parents don't want to be friends: they have their community already. The school also voted to close at 1pm on Fridays so they could all get ready for mosque. Makes it tricky for my friend who works.

I wouldn’t send my child, I wouldn’t want them to be in the minority if I had the choice. The fact that the parents weren’t speaking in English would also put me off, especially seeing as you want to be involved/ make friends with the parents.

I would want to know more about the particular groups that are attending the school before making a decision.

Does the predominant culture skew more towards equality of the sexes and a strong push for academic success? I went to a school with a large cohort of students whose parents were immigrants with this philosophy. It was a good school ethos.

does the predominant culture skew more towards one where there is sexism in the name of religion or culture? This is already so hard to fight on a general cultural level, regardless of race, religion, or family tradition. I wouldn’t want to put my child in a school where it would be concentrated and the ideas reinforced.

I found the children mixed well during school time but there very few playdates, birthday party invitiations or after school activities as the other children mostly socialised with extended family like cousins and second cousins.