Wrap around care for those who don't work??

I’m an old bint. Things that we might call wrap around care now were just that @SunQueen24. Enough supervision that we didn’t break ourselves/someone else/stuff, connect 4 and some scrap paper and felt tips, no particular developmental activities. Mum worked, we had to go. And I loved it, had a hoot with the other pre-latchkey kids, chatting, making our own entertainment. No mums should give themeselves a kicking about using such basic services. For many (most?) kids it’s more than OK.

Agree. My DH knows one of the SLT at my children’s school and he complains about the schools afterschool provision. I view it as supervision rather than enrichment, my kids are happy to go for a few hours a week but complain if they have to stay until 5:30.

The snack is biscuits then either a hot dog/pizza or wrap with ham at 4.45 when the others have gone home. If they have that they won’t eat tea and I do begrudge the UPF shovelled into them. I’d be happy to pack a snack but of course they wouldn’t chose that over pigs ears, eyes and arseholes which they both love.

If I use breakfast club I give them breakfast first as it’s all sugary cereal and more UPF.

I don’t dislike the club - but it’s not ideal. It’s to fill a gap in childcare for me, if that’s your child’s lifeline things are far from optimal at home.

I can see why it feels like a favour to the parents and it probably does have some benefit to them, but that’s a by product of helping the children.

Yes but again, and I'm not sure how to word this in a simpler way, it isn't a perk for the parents. It is to give children who are statistically more likely to struggle and less likely to thrive a bit of a leg up.

It isn't childcare. It isn't to do the parents a favour. It's to ensure children are sufficiently supported and provided for.

@SoiledMyselfDuringSomeTurbulence It’s terrible, same across social care, TAs - women's work’ across the board. A huge cultural shift is needed. It seems this thread is split between those who feel the state needs to step in (tax payer burden and all that goes with that) and those who feel that parents* are responsible for their children and the state should not be providing as much as it does.

*Let’s be honest here, when we say parents it’s mothers. A generalisation to which many can give examples of exceptions, but really they are that, exceptions. We are talking about women’s work here whether we are paid money to do the work of care or we are provided for by a man in paid work.

edit to say - bloody love the user name 😆

The decline in the number of childminders really is terrible. Sector has halved in the last decade!

@StandingSideBySide so you begrudge unwell and disabled parents more respite by accessing before/after school care?

I'm not referring to picking up kids from the same school I'm referring to parents of send children with children in multiple schools.

It is actually very difficult to get away with not working on benefits. I imagine she will be hounded soon unless she has disabilities etc.

My son has his teeth brushed at nursery but I still do it as well!

Its really clear from this thread that a lot of people have an utterly fantastic , idealised view of what wraparound care is actually like. Referring to good hot meals, decent role models, enriching activities etc

The staff at ours are grumpy poorly paid ladies with low "cultural capital" themselves. They offer a "snack", there's no decent food! They have to walk the kids half a mile to another site in all weather as the club isn't run on school site. The kids run riot, they don't have great resources. The children are tired. The main thing the kids like is playing with their friends.

Compared to the middle class kids being taken home by grandma or a part time working parent, having an hours downtime before being taken for flute lesson or scouts, or going to a nice childminders where they get a home cooked meal as part of a family, after school clubs are not ideal.

I'd far prefer the government to incentivise more people to become childminders.

It is possible to be in receipt of free school meals and also be working ft.

What, because once you are on fsm you get it for a few years even after your finances improve?

But afterschool club could be great, lots of enriching activities, keeping kids active and moving, especially in the winter, knowing they were warm, safe, having fun & giving them experiences that possibly I couldn’t afford if I didn’t work, I’d be very happy for my child to get those opportunities.

Have you been in a typical afterschool club? They are not like this. "Enriching activities? As if. At best they do a bit of seasonally themed crafts. Lots have access to tv & computers and use them. Food provision is typically poor and they have a low number of adults to kids. They are under constant pressure financially because good childcare costs a lot. It is a huge struggle to staff wraparound because its only a few hours a week at a time few want to work. The staff are often anyone with a pulse & a DBS check. Good ones will try and get kids to do homework or reading while they are there. Actual good quality activities after school like sport, drama or music can cost easily double what wraparound does.

The reality is loads of people regard "school hours" as a sort of holy grail that must be respected, its a massive barrier to a lot of people that prevents them seeking full time, better paid work.

By made wraparound free/the norm, over time, its pretty obvious they are trying to align the hours they want people to work with the time "school" runs.

Its not about providing "cultural capital"!

Meanwhile in reality most wraparound clubs are quite crap, the ones in my leafy area struggle for staff so have high turnover etc and there's nowhere near enough capacity - often only 30 places for a school with over 200 kids.

The poster I referenced was talking about the parent being unwell or disabled and needing respite. Not other situations

Apreciate your comment re different situations do occur. Aware of school time differences as I had to hang around for 40minutes in between picking up the youngest two and my eldest at the same school.

@WinterBones yes

if the child is a young carer then breakfast club/ afterschool club might be respite for them!

But an unwell or disabled parent might struggle getting up to prepare breakfast or drive the kids to school and may need a rest after school?

@StandingSideBySide and breakfast and after school club can be an extension of that respite. Do they get respite whilst their child is at school? Maybe, maybe not. Lots of families have more than one send child, one may not be at school, they may require different pick up, drop off times and that's the only way everyone can be at school on time. I spend a significant chunk of time in meetings and doing paperwork and looking another send young person so no school time isn't always respite.

We really cannot judge other people's lives from the outside. That is why children are getting free meals including breakfast and after school. Quite right too. I am more than happy for my little bit of tax (I'm a pensioenr so no longer pay very much), to contribute to that.

I do not get why anyone is annoyed about it. How does it impact their life? Not everyone will take up the offer anyway, it's not enforceable, just available. It t wasn't around when mine was at school and I worked but, had it been, I wouldn't have even noticed who had it and who didn't. Not my business.

we are talking about kids at school here.
So the respite is whilst they are at school isn’t it.?

Holiday clubs are another matter.

@StandingSideBySide

Agree, however this thread is about breakfast clubs and after school clubs not holidays clubs ( although others have brought up the subject )

Breakfast and after school club can be respite. Not everyone has access to holiday clubs either, especially if they're disabled

Even the most conscientious people can have complicated lives

Yes. This. I've been single for many years with an abusive ex, multiple jobs, a chronically ill and disabled child and am also an only child with a dementia-ridden mother. I don't broadcast my troubles - it's just life after all - and you wouldn't know there was 'background' just by seeing my back in the playground.. Sometimes I don't remember to send in a charity donation, forget annown clothes day, or my son gets a haircut later than he should.....and there are those who tut, look down their nose or pass a loud comment when I'm within earshot.

Try walking a mile in someone else's shoes. Or, preferably, just keep your mouth shut.

Agree, however this thread is about breakfast clubs and after school clubs not holidays clubs ( although others have brought up the subject )

Some parents don't work because they are unwell or disabled. They may need the respite.

To be ‘a few’ is more than 2 (a couple) less than 4, and less than ‘several’ which I always think of as 5 - 7 which is less than a dozen. I’m sure I learnt that at school back in the day.

I also think idea of free wrap around childcare will have loads of benefits to lots of children, whether their parents work or not, and no matter how many hours, so I’d be pleased if this can be pulled off by schools because obviously there are funding implications.

I do work full time, not sure I’d bother with breakfast club if I didn’t work because I’d want my kid to have porridge etc for breakfast rather than cheap cereal.
But afterschool club could be great, lots of enriching activities, keeping kids active and moving, especially in the winter, knowing they were warm, safe, having fun & giving them experiences that possibly I couldn’t afford if I didn’t work, I’d be very happy for my child to get those opportunities.
And even though I do work, I don’t begrudge any kids having better childhoods if it’s possible. I’m nice like that.

It is possible to be in receipt of free school meals and also be working ft.