If you have a cat you have to stop it scaring and eating birds

To be fair, you have made a very cogent point here @daleylama . If cats do indeed start indiscriminate killing of the human population I will reconsider and possibly buy a bell

No way will I be putting a collar or a bell on my cat (that I don't have yet). Do you know anything about collar injuries? Besides that, a bell would be torture for a cat - how would you like a bloody bell ringing every time you move?

First, check your facts regarding the decimation of the bird population. Maybe apply that thinking to the human population. Your attitude and opinion is arrogant , entitled , and uninformed.

If the bird species are not being rendered extinct, or indeed anywhere close to extinct, what is the problem? The ecosystems in urban areas are entirely artificial anyway.

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20 pages of ignored posts

This! Astonishing how wilfully ignorant/ "could care less" some cat owners are regarding the damage that an unbelled cat can do. Belled they will still try, but give the wildlife a fighting chance FFS! (Or stop thinking you're an 'animal lover')

How do you do that though? I'm pretty sure all my indoor/outdoor cats came in to poo, due to the evidence in the litter tray, but I don't know how you would train them? We gave our stray tuxedo boy a litter tray for what was meant to be a couple of nights indoors after he was neutered as a teenager!

When we removed the litter tray, the little get just peed on the floor where the litter tray had been, so we had to reinstate it!

I grew up rurally, and we had cats as pets not to control the rodents.

Now that I live in suburbia, my cats are indoors, but I have had cats before who had outdoor access.

The miserable tuxedo stray who couldn't mew when he came to our door aged about 8 and lived to be over 20, literally never caught anything. The birds in the garden that took flight when another cat came in actually ignored him.

The gorgeous ginger stray who rocked up onto our windowsill with the biggest set I have ever seen on a cat (we soon had the vet see to that!) cornered a rabbit once with his partner in crime (of whom more later!) but didn't do anything to it and they were both ignominiously grabbed by the scruff of their necks and removed from the situation! He brought us an empty cigarette packet, a cheese wrapper and a used teabag.

Our beautiful blue tabby, who we inherited when his hateful owners moved house and left him behind, was a partner in the above-mentioned rabbit scenario. He also cornered a baby robin once, and we took it to a vet who took in waifs and strays but it sadly died. He came home a couple of times with a nice freshly cooked chicken breast, which he devoured on our patio, and another time with a pork chop. I knew he was inclined to go in neighbours' open windows but I never found out where he got the lovely food! I remember one Christmas Day when he sat on the windowsill for hours because he could smell the turkey cooking, but when I passed him some out the window, he fell off the windowsill in his excitement and couldn't find the turkey!

@eightIsNewNine of course it isn't as simple as that and it very much is in a cats nature to look for prey

What a ridiculous statement

If a cat is an outdoor cant always keep them in when it suits, sone will not use a litter tray

There is no way to train a cat to go against it's nature/instinct. Cats are great at training humans, but good luck getting a cat to do what you want it to, when it doesn't want to comply.

Not all cats will wear collars. Some are fine with them, we have one that absolutely won't. I still have the scars and the memory of her mouth bleeding when she had her lower jaw trapped under a 'safety' collar.

Not all cats will accept an indoor only life. 2 of ours prefer it, one turns feral when contained. Yep, it's the same one who refuses to wear a collar.

I imagine you are probably the type of person who believes pets should be fed on vegan food, despite the numerous risks to their health.
And in regards to cats being an invasive species, so are dogs (especially the newer breeds that have multiple health issues) and there is a list on of invasive bird species, which funnily enough the spread is better contained with hunting both from other animals and humans. And just to add the cherry in top, you do know humans are technically an invasive species yeah?
Yes, some cats prefer indoor life (some will fight against it), yes you can get bells and collars. But cats are very good and removing collars and although you can probably get the into a form of curfew routine, you cannot stop nature entirely.
Some cats like mine are too scared of their own shadow to hunt, some I've had in past have been very effective mousers. And as for cat poo, there is around a dozen cats that live down my street, yet it's mostly others cats that poo in my garden (don't get me started on the numerous dog owners who leave large mounds of poo in streets, or better yet bag it up and hang it in a tree like a hobo Santa stocking!). So yes we can help with bells, but you cannot stop a cat hunting any more than you can stop a bird flying south for the winter

I have two cats. When they were young only one of them went after the birds. The other one wasn’t bothered at all. If I saw the other cat with a bird I took it off him and he got a good telling off (the cat……not the bird). Now both cats are 17 they can only dream about catching birds.

I can think of 1000s of things people do all the time that inadvertently (or purposely) kill millions of wildlife every single day. I wonder how overrun with rats and mice we would be without cats.

*My point is that if an owned pet kills wildlife it isn't a "nature" it is a specific human killing the wildlife through their pet.

If you choose to have a cat and let it "roam" you are choosing to kill the birds as if you did it yourself. Simple as that.*

Do you know how difficult it is for a cat to actually catch a bird? I've had 3 cats over 30 years and I can count the number of birds they've caught on one hand. Cats are land animals and mainly catch rodents. I suspect that most of the birds they manage to catch are the elderly/sick/weak ones.

Do you eat food that has been grown with pesticides? If so, you might just as well have killed the birds yourself. Simple as that.

Mine said “sod off! At least I don’t cook them after! “

If you choose to have a cat and let it "roam" you are choosing to kill the birds as if you did it yourself. Simple as that.

My two cats have not killed any birds this year afaik. One is useless and the other won’t go outside unless it’s over 25 degrees centigrade; and I keep them in at night.

They are both rescue cats from a feral colony, so they already existed, and no doubt would have fed themselves by hunting. Hence why one barely goes outside, as she’s had enough of the big outdoors and is only too grateful for an endless supply of food in a warm house.

Of course, the humans are the issue here

My point is that if an owned pet kills wildlife it isn't a "nature" it is a specific human killing the wildlife through their pet.

If you choose to have a cat and let it "roam" you are choosing to kill the birds as if you did it yourself. Simple as that.

And as a result they are quite overpopulated. It isn't "a nature" to have so many cats endangering the birds. It is humans not understanding the scale aspect of their decisions.

Which animal is the most over populated in the world; destroying the environment with global warning; building new housing and roads; building factories, which dump their waste products in the air and water systems, using up the world's finite resources, because we want new clothes/technology/decor in our houses, not because we need it; but because its the latest fashion....Its not cats!

The best bird nesting site in our county (green belt) had a school built on it, because agricultural land is the cheapest. Ditto, we have one of the rarest habitats in the world, nearby and a large company wants to build hundreds of houses on it, all for profit.

IMO, posters are using cats as scapegoats because its easier, than telling people, we should change our lifestyle, reduce our populations and live a sustainable way. Its humans that cause the most destruction of animals' homes, leaving them with nowhere to live. Why have bee and hedgehog populations crashed in the last few decades - its not because of predation by cats? Go to Africa and consider how all the big mammals have declined - and domestic cats are an irrelevance there.

You don't see the difference? The fox is 100% part of the wildlife. It fends for itself and it's numbers are regulated by the ecosystem (or authorities if needed).

Cats are fed and protected by humans, having a totally safe place when they want it, getting veterinary care if something goes wrong. They prey on wildlife as if it was a safari and than go back to their cosy homes. Totally unfair.
And as a result they are quite overpopulated. It isn't "a nature" to have so many cats endangering the birds. It is humans not understanding the scale aspect of their decisions.

This. I've seen the almost immediate effect of cats on bird life.

This!

I love cats and birds. I have two indoor cats by necessity (one is blind) and in the past have gad outdoor cats but never would again. As well as the destruction they cause to wildlife which is already struggling, they are at risk of being runover or otherwise hurt by horrible people when they roam. I now think all cats should be indoor unless they have a secure garden.

Iconic Mumsnet post 😂

Also, these cats are so unreasonable. One whole bird should be able to feed the cat and its entire family for a week

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