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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think Kemi and Nigel will likely win the next UK election after making a pact of some kind and fighting on an immigration / identity politics platform?

446 replies

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 14:54

Especially after Trump’s win today.

labour has a tiny lead at 27% today (6th nov, politico.eu polling )

tories have 27. Reform has 19.

so that’s a possible 46/27 which gives a right wing team up more MPs than Labour has now. (OFC in any pact they won’t get all those votes)

this Labour majority is paper thin. Everyone hates Keir.

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flipdiddle81 · 06/11/2024 19:17

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 19:15

I just badly chopped some sweet potatoes if it helps

arent your family looking at you wondering why the heck you have been tapping away on your phone…. All day. 113 now!

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 19:17

BIossomtoes · 06/11/2024 19:03

What reduced the number of Tory votes was the country’s absolute determination to get rid of them. There was a lot of tactical voting with many people voting for the party most likely to beat them. That’s why the LibDems went from 11 seats to 72.

No it wasn’t. Have a look at the per seat numbers and total votes and you’ll see the Lib Dem share went up and tories down mainly because of reform coming in.

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MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 19:16

Shakeoffyourchains · 06/11/2024 19:06

And yet you've managed to reply to numerous other posts include another of mine.

But I'll ask again and happy to wait for an answer; why, if immigration is such an issue, is the conversation focused around asylum seekers, who make up the less than 5% of total migrantion, and not legal migrants, who make up 85% of it? And if you don't think it has been racialised, why is the discourse around the cultural impact focused on Islam when the majority of legal migrants to the UK are Indian (Hindu), Polish (Christian), Pakistani (Muslim), Romanian (Christian) and Irish (Christian)?

Because I don’t believe Islam is compatible with the culture which I am so attached to. Thought that was obvious. Especially not the form that comes with illegal immigrants.

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MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 19:15

flipdiddle81 · 06/11/2024 19:08

you have posted 109 times today

maybe time to give your eyes a break and concentrate on… dinner?!

I just badly chopped some sweet potatoes if it helps

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MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 19:11

Shakeoffyourchains · 06/11/2024 19:02

And I've provided an explanation as to why I think they are.

If you're not going to elaborate on why you think they're not then there's not much point to this.

No you haven’t. You just said “yes they are”.

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flipdiddle81 · 06/11/2024 19:08

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:58

Mainly that I’m tapping in between getting homework done and cooking dinner to be honest

you have posted 109 times today

maybe time to give your eyes a break and concentrate on… dinner?!

Shakeoffyourchains · 06/11/2024 19:06

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:58

Mainly that I’m tapping in between getting homework done and cooking dinner to be honest

And yet you've managed to reply to numerous other posts include another of mine.

But I'll ask again and happy to wait for an answer; why, if immigration is such an issue, is the conversation focused around asylum seekers, who make up the less than 5% of total migrantion, and not legal migrants, who make up 85% of it? And if you don't think it has been racialised, why is the discourse around the cultural impact focused on Islam when the majority of legal migrants to the UK are Indian (Hindu), Polish (Christian), Pakistani (Muslim), Romanian (Christian) and Irish (Christian)?

BIossomtoes · 06/11/2024 19:03

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:59

I don’t know what news you’re reading or what stats you’re reading - but Reform got 20% of the vote, people wanting more right wing policies is what split the Tory vote and let Labour win. Labour have hardly any support.

What reduced the number of Tory votes was the country’s absolute determination to get rid of them. There was a lot of tactical voting with many people voting for the party most likely to beat them. That’s why the LibDems went from 11 seats to 72.

Shakeoffyourchains · 06/11/2024 19:02

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:47

But you see - many people think the policies that you think are far right - are not far right.

And I've provided an explanation as to why I think they are.

If you're not going to elaborate on why you think they're not then there's not much point to this.

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 19:01

Summernightsinthe21stcentury · 06/11/2024 18:48

Ok so say that. This country is not just English, and not very Christian any more, I believe.

It’s culturally Christian. I’ve not stepped in a church for religious reasons for 43 years but I’m culturally Christian and live in a culturally Christian country. It’s that culture - near impossible to define but I know it when I see it, that I want to protect and keep enjoying.

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MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 19:00

Torktork · 06/11/2024 18:51

She won’t be the leader by then. Farage is a different matter.

Ok cool - why won’t she be?

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MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:59

T33p33 · 06/11/2024 18:52

How? The electorate has just showed loud and clear how little they want the far right.Farage has got what a couple of seats and the Tories have so few in parliament she can barely form a cabinet. Kemi is also doing a great job of alienating key voters whilst showing how vile her beliefs are-autism, SEN, decrying maternity rights and belittling others breaking glass ceilings isn’t exactly making her popular with women.

I don’t know what news you’re reading or what stats you’re reading - but Reform got 20% of the vote, people wanting more right wing policies is what split the Tory vote and let Labour win. Labour have hardly any support.

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MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:58

Shakeoffyourchains · 06/11/2024 18:54

I never said he wasn't scum. He wasn't an asylum seeker though and neither his motive nor his religion have been made known to the public yet. The CPS didn't name him as he was under 18, as is the established protocol, and the public are not generally made privy to all parts of an investigation so I'm not sure why you think this means you can't trust the government.

Are you implying that the response was justified because the public wasn't immediately told details about the perpetrator or that it would have been justified if it turned out he was a Muslim and/or asylum seeker?

It's interesting that you've seized upon that specific part of my PP and ignored the direct questions I put to you. Any particular reason for that?

Mainly that I’m tapping in between getting homework done and cooking dinner to be honest

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Shakeoffyourchains · 06/11/2024 18:54

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I never said he wasn't scum. He wasn't an asylum seeker though and neither his motive nor his religion have been made known to the public yet. The CPS didn't name him as he was under 18, as is the established protocol, and the public are not generally made privy to all parts of an investigation so I'm not sure why you think this means you can't trust the government.

Are you implying that the response was justified because the public wasn't immediately told details about the perpetrator or that it would have been justified if it turned out he was a Muslim and/or asylum seeker?

It's interesting that you've seized upon that specific part of my PP and ignored the direct questions I put to you. Any particular reason for that?

T33p33 · 06/11/2024 18:52

How? The electorate has just showed loud and clear how little they want the far right.Farage has got what a couple of seats and the Tories have so few in parliament she can barely form a cabinet. Kemi is also doing a great job of alienating key voters whilst showing how vile her beliefs are-autism, SEN, decrying maternity rights and belittling others breaking glass ceilings isn’t exactly making her popular with women.

Torktork · 06/11/2024 18:51

She won’t be the leader by then. Farage is a different matter.

username7891 · 06/11/2024 18:50

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:47

No, Northern European Christian root cultures.

You don't believe anyone born in this country who doesn't have N European roots or is Christian is part of English (you mean British) culture?

Summernightsinthe21stcentury · 06/11/2024 18:48

Ok so say that. This country is not just English, and not very Christian any more, I believe.

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:47

Summernightsinthe21stcentury · 06/11/2024 18:47

So just English then 😂

No, Northern European Christian root cultures.

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Summernightsinthe21stcentury · 06/11/2024 18:47

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:45

It literally does.

and I don’t think he’s racist. I think he believes English culture is worth standing up for and defending. Clearly a lot of people think the same. You do you OFC

So just English then 😂

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:47

Shakeoffyourchains · 06/11/2024 18:39

No, not anyone I don't agree with, just those espousing far right views or policies. Can you give a specific example of where you think this might apply?

But you see - many people think the policies that you think are far right - are not far right.

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blackbird77 · 06/11/2024 18:46

I doubt Kemi will even last a year.

Also, people forget that in the General Election we just had, Reform (headed by Farage) got approx 4 million votes which is the almost identical number of votes that UKIP (also headed by Farage) got in the UK General Election 10 years ago. So number of voters for Farage or that kind of political sentiment have stayed virtually the same. No “dramatic surge” in that direction in this country so much.

Also, in the General Election we just had, Labour won very many seats in Tory heartlands (breaking that “Blue South” wall). Some of those counties had been historically conservative forever.

I think in this country, people’s political sentiments on their social and fiscal axes don’t align as much as people in other countries. There is a huge chunk of the population over here that is socially liberal but fiscally conservative and a huge chunk of the population that is socially conservative but fiscally liberal. Probably almost just as many as who are conservative on both and liberal on both. Nothing goes down clean lines anymore. Leftists aren’t the same thing as liberals and conservatives (small c) aren’t the same thing as being right wing. America is much more binary along lines whereas our voting populace is probably a little more dimensional and it’s harder to predict where things might be in 4-5 years time culturally. A week is practically a lifetime in politics, let alone 4 years.

MumtananoBay · 06/11/2024 18:45

BobbyBiscuits · 06/11/2024 18:37

Op, the poll provided does not prove 'everyone hates starmer.'
Where I live most people would rather commit suicide than vote for Farage or even the Tories. Barely anyone voted for him in the actual election.
And yes, Farage is racist. What is it you like about him?

It literally does.

and I don’t think he’s racist. I think he believes English culture is worth standing up for and defending. Clearly a lot of people think the same. You do you OFC

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EasternStandard · 06/11/2024 18:45

Summernightsinthe21stcentury · 06/11/2024 18:43

I think we used to have safe and legal routes for asylum seekers, but now unless you are from the Ukraine, Hong Kong or Afghanistan there is no legal way in unless you satisfy the earnings rules etc for the 90% of the other immigrants. Unlikely for those seeking asylum on day 1.

Edited

How many would you have to say yes to and how many countries to meet the demand?

Summernightsinthe21stcentury · 06/11/2024 18:43

EasternStandard · 06/11/2024 18:35

I know people believe this can be done but no country will do this. It's not feasible, you won't meet the demand

I think we used to have safe and legal routes for asylum seekers, but now unless you are from the Ukraine, Hong Kong or Afghanistan there is no legal way in unless you satisfy the earnings rules etc for the 90% of the other immigrants. Unlikely for those seeking asylum on day 1.

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