STEM v social science degrees

STEM might improve employability but at what cost? A lot of engineering jobs are crap, saying that as an engineer, starting salaries are not that great and reading specs, drawing things in CAD, doing 8D’s, 5y’s FMEA’s all day can be a grind, even if you are STEM minded.

Agree. I’ve found it very difficult to find jobs in my scientific sector. I could do a PhD to increase what’s available to me, but even then the pay wouldn’t be good and the jobs lack stability.

If I could do it all again I’d probably do engineering.

Of course but the OP seemed to think that her DC was good at STEM.

Yes, but even then...if that doesn't go along with some genuine interest and desire to work in a stem field, they're unlikely to thrive at uni and may not end up very employable. My dd like yours has done a ' 4-year masters course in a STEM subject at a top tier uni.' ... she got a job offer on the back of a summer internship without needing to do any applications or interviews but that wasn't just about being good at stem, it was about attitude and - let's use the word - passion for the field.

At least a couple of her friends were good at stem, started stem degrees ... found it wasn't really for them, switched courses and seem to have wound up employable. Sticking to the stem subject might well have served them less well.

There's no one simple answer to this question.

How can you get a U in maths and thrive in economics/investment banking? Asking out of curiosity. It reflects, no doubt, my poor understanding of these subjects but even with my very basic level of knowledge, surely having a pass at maths a-level would be a help ?

He should do what he loves without too much steering from anyone. I did social science (I’m a sociologist) and I work in a STEM field as a social scientist in clinical research. If he wants to be an academic, yes, realistically there is probably more money and job security in STEM.

But that’s if he loves it and is willing to make the sacrifices for an academic career. 20 years in, me personally, I’m taking my PhD and walking because I’m tired of the drama of academia. I loved what I did for those 20 years though because it was my passion and I enjoyed it.

Let him figure out what he loves. I can’t recommend a gap year to decompress and travel enough too. There’s so much pressure on teenagers to decide everything at like 16. I had no idea what I wanted to do in secondary school. I actually had no idea in uni either! It took a year travelling and working abroad after uni for me to finally figure it out. Thankfully, I studied something I enjoyed and it was enough of a springboard with work and volunteer experience to get me where I wanted to go.

DD (19) is doing an engineering degree and our main advice has been: firstly, play to your strengths and secondly, where do you see yourself in five years, even ten years?

DD is strong in Maths and Physics as well as English, so she could have gone in various directions. But, she sees engineering as a good base degree that will give her several career options. She’d like to do an MBA after she’s got some work experience.

Earning potential is another factor for her.
DD is self aware enough to know that she has champagne tastes! If she wants a high standard of living, she needs to earn well. 😂

Depends on general interest and knowledge though. In your example I’d definitely get more marks on history question - can recall facts from gcse and A level history plus general knowledge v I can recall zero gcse maths other than my absolute hatred of it. I could definitely have had a good stab at dc’s history/politics/RS recently she was surprised how much I knew when looking through her text books. You’ll also pick up points for structure of arguments.

i did science a’levels and have a science degree from one of the best uni’s.

jobs pay shit. I left science first for the nhs because it paid better, now I am in a field which does not require a degree and is not science related, and yes, it pays better.

if you want a high paying field science is not it.

A level maths is extremely challenging.

Of course but the OP seemed to think that her DC was good at STEM.

Have you ever done U.K. maths A levels?
There are plenty of people who can't do even quite simple maths.

I'm not sure that maths having one correct answer makes it 'easy'. I've generally found numeracy levels in the general adult population here to be pretty terrible.

Of course they can go wrong with STEM if it doesn't suit them.

Depends what you mean by 'easier'.

There are many kids who simply cannot do A level maths, let alone FM; I'd guess most with a reasonable degree of literacy could make some sort of stab at an English lit question but only the best would be able to do it well.

You can probably find out from universities what jobs their graduates go into.

You can't go wrong with a STEM subject though as far as employability is concerned.

DC1 just completed a 4-year masters course in a STEM subject at a top tier uni. They applied for 3 jobs, got interviewed for 2 of them and was offered 1 of them .

I think forcing to take stem A levels when humanities minded is a recipe for disaster (one of dc’s friends did really badly - it’s a big jump at A level especially if you hate it)
Just my recent experience with dc’s cohort but top grade A level students more likely to choose PPE, Law with politics, HSPS at Cambridge not straight politics.

OP, you could listen to the ‘let him do what he enjoys’ crowd or be honest and steer him towards what will give him better chances.

The ‘do what you enjoy’ narrative has resulted in legions of media studies grads in the last two decades working on or close to min wage and wondering where they went wrong. They were lied to. Not all degrees are equal. Most social sciences degrees are pointless and a waste of cash. And now that some of that cash comes from the students and their families rather than the endlessly deep taxpayer pocket, it’s even more criminal to encourage to do these Mickey Mouse degrees.

It depends on their interests and aptitudes, of course.

It may be fair to say that there are some subjects which are certainly worth doing at a high level, but may be less appropriate for a middling student on a mediocre course.

I suppose its more focused on what career they are interested in and them doing a degree with enables them to do so.

For what it's worth DH and I are split - I always did STEM and my career has been linear with positions and earnings.

DH did politics at uni and hasn't been linear and he's had to retrain (in a STEM masters subject) in order to move into the career he wanted as the minimum requirements are a Bsc. It's obviously much more of a juggling act and takes longer to do a degree when also working.

DS's experience when applying a couple of years ago was that pure politics was seen as a bit lightweight. He ended up applying for a triple honours instead.