Child wants to live with the father she hardly knows so she can go to university a year early

So he doesn't even really have her in the holidays? My ex lives in the same area and dcs go for holidays. Tell her she needs to start going to him for all holidays to see how she gets on, mine have always gone for the whole 6 weeks holidays as well as April and every other Christmas.

My 13 nearly 14 year old hates going for so long now he's older and wants to cut it down to a week every visit. She might find out she doesn't like it after all

Does he have PR, OP? This is key. If you were unmarried at the time she was born you, as baby's mother, would have had to have granted this as you say he is not named.on birth certificate.

I think that this is probably the answer. Let her go to Ireland for a while in the summer and see how she gets on. Ireland is quite different to the UK and she may find that she doesn't like it or struggles to fit in or that life with her dad just isn't what she expected.

My Ds Birth father is not on his birth certificate. He left the area when I fell pregnant. He knows about my DS but has never met him or paid a penny....
BUT when my DH wanted to adopt him (25yrs ago) we legally had to provide name and last known address because, if they could find him, we had to have his permission for the Adoption to go through as he still had parental rights.

It still pisses me off now we had to do that and why he should have had parental rights!!

The ‘year earlier’ is a red herring; most Irish students will have turned 18 if not 29 by the time they start uni (eight years in primary, usually six in secondary.) It’s not like she is talking about a highly vocational reason to go to school in Ireland, like a ballet school or conservatoire. Would you send her for the Easter break or part of the summer to do a course, eg acting or language?

This would devastate me OP. I have no advice. But I absolutely get the physical wrench you're facing.

Some of the replies here are genuinely odd to me.

No, of course you shouldn't send her to live with him. It's not a dilemma, it's out of the question. She's only 14 and your child. You raised her.

This man is her biological father, but basically a stranger to her (and you). What do you really know about him? You haven't properly spent time with him in 14 years and your daughter hasn't either. He abandoned you and the child, just seeing her a few times and paying some money hardly makes him a proper father, did he even pay the full child support you were entitled to? He wasn't a regular part of her life, she hardly knows him. I'm not saying that he's an awful person, but clearly not a proper father figure.

People saying that she doesn't have a good relationship with her siblings and that you should let her go likely don't know many teenagers. It's normal at that age to be annoyed by your siblings and rebel against your parents. She's a teenager! That doesn't mean that she doesn't love her family. The grass is always greener on the other side, many teenagers would probably tell you that they'd love to live with a new, cooler family, but that's not what it's really like. It's very likely that he feels guilty, but has no idea what he is getting himself signed up for and that she had this dream of everything being perfect, when it probably won't be.

I'm not saying that he's horrible or anything, he's probably a nice person, but he's not a father figure and never has been. Of course he deserves a chance, but sending her to live with him is way over the top. They should go on holidays, get to know each other and if she wants to live with him for a year when she's 18 or go to uni there, that's great. But not at age 14, to a biological father she hardly know and away from her siblings.

She needs to stay with you at this young age and do her GCSEs - say you’ll discuss her leaving when she’s 16 and hope that she’ll have built her friendship group by then and have changed her mind.

The leaving certificate is very different to GCSEs and A levels. At 14 she would have missed too much to sit the junior Certificate with children her own age. Junior Certificate is 3 year course with the exam normally sat around 15. The Leaving Certificate is a 2 year course normally sat around 17-18 depending on whether the child has done transition year.
In Ireland the Leaving Certificate is comprised of 7 subjects. The core subjects are English, Irish , Maths and a foreign language. Then the students normally pick 3 other subjects of their choice.
each subject has two levels, a higher level and an ordinary level. The equivalent of an A+ at higher level gives you a 100 points and the same at ordinary level gives 60 points. With Maths if you get over 50%(I think) at higher level you gain an extra 25 points.
University acceptance in Ireland is a points based system. The maximum amount of points you can achieve is 625( art portfolio courses and medicine are slightly different) and only 6 subjects are counted towards points.
For university all students apply through a system called the CAO. The students rank their choices 1-10. Based on the points nationally the courses are awarded to the students with the highest points. There is no interview system and also no clearing system.
Leaving Certificate subjects in Ireland are difficult, with many students getting outside one to one classes in some subjects (grinds) especially in higher level Maths.
Many schools do after school study for two hours each day and students would typically do another 2 hours possibly more after that if they are looking to achieve high points.
If you have a google you should be able to see past papers for some of the leaving certificate papers to give your child an idea of what to expect.

Sorry that’s so long but just to give an idea of the school system. If you have any questions please ask.

I have experience of both systems of schooling/ exams. Granted it was some time ago since I completed it but the Leaving cert is much harder and more intense process in my view- 6/7 subjects and have to do either honours or ordinary levels - honours usually required for university . Majority of subjects are exams based, mock exams do not count, very little coursework ( and only in few subjects) count towards grades . So all exams focussed, a lot of pressure to perform on the day.
my relatives who did the UK system had a much more balanced experience in my view, we often shared experiences and work in crossover subjects. They were so glad not to be doing leaving cert and I was jealous of their experience. University experience has been mentioned by others so won’t add to that. We had some students join us from post GCSE and they found it a challenge.
regarding the age , primary school in ROI is 8 years and secondary 5 or 6( if doing Transition year) so realistically the overall age is much the same as the starting age for primary school can be later in ROI, a lot don’t start until 5years in my experience.
if she is keen I’d ensure she is fully aware of the differences and her expectations are balanced and get a good understanding of the points system.
you have my full empathy, this is a difficult time- would she consider spending a summer with her father first in order to see what “ life” is like? If they live anyway rural it could come as a shock if she’s used to cafes, cinemas , entertainment etc all close.

Lots of students in Trinity are from the North or the UK. Often people who didn't get into Oxbridge also apply for/get Trinity. So, it would not be unusual to apply with A-levels.

This would be an option for her at 18, he could get to know her during the summers, between now and then.

No mother who left her newborn would be called a decent mum.

Agree completely with this, I have a 13/nearly 14 year old girl and the friendships are both everything and a big source of drama. It feels like we her family are sort of neither here nor there 🙄. So I would certainly be digging into that - the fact that she has no qualms about moving away from current friends means there may be something going on there that is motivating her to want to move.

Honestly OP all you can do is explain your reservations but ultimately support her. But make it clear she is welcome back at any time if it doesn't work out. I think that's the smartest way to deal with it to preserve your relationship x

I would tell her that before she gave up all her school friends, you would really like her to consider the decision for longer. Statistically, 12-14 is the hardest age for kids to change schools. I also don't think that this is about her future career at all. It sounds like she wants to follow in the footsteps of older relatives and likes the idea of a fun experience living away from home. However, i do think that she's too young and would be limiting her options. I would agree that once she's done her GCSES, she could go there. If she's after a bit more of an adventure/is desperate to grow up, could she part board at school or go off to a summer camp?

How is her friend group? People have been focusing on the family unit but the drama levels for 14 year olds are off the charts. Could she want to restart/reset how she is perceived by her peers? I certainly did. One to check.

Partly because if she was enjoying her time with her school friends, I don’t think a girl who doesn’t have some grand ambitious plan for her life would be so keen to leave school for uni at 14.

How many posters have said, "in her best interests". Who gets to determine what "best interests" are? It's hugely swayed by one's own thoughts and emotions.

I'm sorry OP because this must be very painful for you.

I feel like with teenagers the most productive way is to listen, really listen, to what they say. Why does she want to go? How does she imagine it will be?
Break it down into bite-sized chunks ie. what her room at her Dad's is like, what sort of lifestyle does Dad live? What will her commute look like? Will she feel able to text/call you at any time?

If, theoretically, she did go, will you ensure she knows she is welcome home for weekends and holidays? Or, indeed, to return?

Don't fret over things like her changing her mind and coming home then that being unsettling/missing her place, that would be a natural outcome and extremely good learning for her.

The best way to keep her close is to keep talking and listening, and to allow her to stuff up on some things. Her desire to move may seem to you like a poor choice but maybe it isn't? Maybe she is hankering for the Dad attention she has missed so far and imagines this will make her feel better? It probably won't, she'll probably return dejected by what a crap dad he is but as painful as that may be, perhaps it's what she needs to go through?

Oh OP this is so tough! And of course she doesn't know him, not really, so of course you'll worry. If you don't let her go she could become incredibly resentful. I would let her do as she is asking but make it very clear that she can change her mind at any point, and don't let her leave feeling that she has made her bed and has to lie in it. Teens can be stubborn when they're trying to assert independence and if it doesn't go as she hopes she needs to feel she can tell you and come back

I would set aside your worry that it will affect her relationship with her siblings negatively, it may not, staying put might.. it may improve things, you just can't know there and I don't think its a reason to stop her.

I suspect there is a strong element of 'the grass is greener' and I think you stand fuck all chance of explaining this to her, she's at the age where she needs to see for herself, go there, live there, see how it is in reality rather than just a few days here and there during holidays which are very much 'fantasy land'.

The more you dig in and say no and propose reasons it won't work, the more she is likely to dig in and refuse to admit defeat... so I think you have to act like this is a great idea and she's welcome to investigate it.

If it all works out as she has planned, great, I can't see how that could be a problem.

If it DOESN'T work out, you need her to be able to say 'sorry this went tits up and I need to come home' and she can't do that if she feels there will be an element of 'I told you so'...

And yes, it might all go tits up as PPs have said, but then you are there for her.

I knew my mind when I was thirteen. I went to school in Ireland (Wicklow). Lots of children change schools in the UK when they are 12/13 also.

There are a lot of thing for you to unpack here, OP. It's about her heritage, her father, his/her Irish family, your feelings, your history. And then it is about actual schooling and university.

There's nothing wrong with going to another country and following their schooling system. She can come back and visit you in the holidays.

I really empathise with your feelings - something similar happened after DS's dad died and my son wanted to go and live with his birth mum. He was attracted by the idea of being surrounded by people to whom he was biologically related. It was a kick in the teeth for me after raising him as my own for 10 years but I could not stand in his way and I facilitated the move, and when it all went tits up a year later I was there to pick up the pieces and bring him back home.

Obviously a different situation for your DD but if I were you I would try to see this desire for her to spread her wings as a positive thing - she obviously feels secure enough in your love to try this and I do think it could give her opportunities for growth. Children who have moved countries always seem to me to have more confidence and often find it easier to make new friends and build networks.

My concerns would be - is he married now or has a long term partner, or is he very close to sisters/cousins/his mum who would provide a female role model and emotional support to the typical teenage girl, who would understand the ways that girls need to be supported?

I'd also want to make sure that she was running TO something and not AWAY from a situation. EG have there been fallouts with local friends, is there a subject at school she really hates and thinks she could get away from, is there conflict between her and her siblings and/or stepdad?

Could some sessions of family counselling help with this? And maybe individually for her, to make sure she's clear in her own mind the reasons she wants to go and think about the risks versus benefits and how she will cope with any unexpected problems when her mum is so far away.

I don’t think it’s a good idea to go to uni early.
Tbh I think lots of people go to uni too young anyway.

She will be around people who are partying and she will be too young to get in but also emotionally young too, which would worry me a bit.

But I would be tempted to let her try it but let her know that she can always come back at any time.
I would try and encourage her not to go early though.

I understand why you feel so sad but try and turn it around that actually he owes you and it’s now his time to step up and help her like you have.

If he’s a decent man, how come he’s not had regular contact with her?

@lanthanum

She needs to be very careful that she keeps her options open. If she goes and lives in Ireland, she might lose eligibility for home fees at UK universities

no she won’t - ROI and UK have reciprocal education agreements, she’ll be treated the same as a UK citizen for the purposes of fees no matter how long she lives in Ireland.

she may lose her ability to receive a maintenance (but not a fee) loan

I'm astonished by all the replies that seem to think that 14 years olds are perfectly capable of rational adult decisions. 'She's her own person', someone said. She's 14. She's under all kind of social and school and friendships influences. She feels grown-up but she's still child and she needs a strong, loving parent to hold her on course. I think back to when I was 14 and kicking against my parents (which is what teens are supposed to do, it's called individuation) and of course if some pleasant man who had fathered me had offered me the chance to go and live with him and stick two fingers up at my mum I would have loved the idea. It would have been a disaster. Good parenting often involves saying no firmly. The parent is the adult, the teen is the teen and the adult is in charge.