To think the term 'childfree' is as bad as 'childless'

if you wouldn't be happy to say "immigrant-free" or "Jamaican-free" or "disabled-free"

It's a ridiculous comparison because there is no default responsibility for immigrants, Jamaicans or disabled people who might be in your life, so you are not 'free' of anything by their absence or burdened by their presence.

It’s not a positive trait, no, it’s a completely neutral trait. Like having children. It’s neither positive nor negative.

Crowing? Where's the crowing? I don't get it. What would be better for you? How could this be less upsetting and offensive for you?

Self awareness is a very positive trait.

I don’t understand what you mean, are you saying that because women choose not to have children they’re excluding a vulnerable group?

If you think being a custodian to the next generation of people is too burdensome for you, it’s not a positive trait imo.

This is exactly how it sounds to me. Crowing about the exclusion of a vulnerable group.

Maybe people who do have children and are currently feeling a bit fed up with them could describe themselves as child-ridden.

There’s nothing about being childfree that there is to be smug or crow about to parents who love being parents because what we have isn’t what those parents want. Alternatively parents can’t be smug and crow because they haven’t got anything childfree people want.

The only way either group could be smug and crowing is if I went into spaces for regretful parents to talk about how great my life is without children, or if parents went into spaces for childless women to talk about how amazing it is to have children and what kind of people would ever do that!

I am so happy for my friends who love being parents and are great parents, they’re happy for me that I don’t want children and live in a time and place where that is possible. No one is crowing!

Yea I'd only double down on that joys of being childfree with a parent if that parent started saying "but aren't you missing out/who will look after you in old age" etc.

Ie I'd be a dick and talk about burdens if they were being a dick first and pitying my life.

I tend to assume most people who have kids enjoy it overall (or convince themselves they enjoy it) so they don't see it as a burden. It would be to me. Same as looking after a big dog.
But not a cat. Cats aren't a burden so much!

Who's smirking? Who's crowing? I have never experienced anyone with no children doing either, or lording it over me as is being suggested on this thread.

If you feel that taking responsibility for another human being 24 hours a day, physically, emotionally and mentally for at least 18 years, but lets face it, for the rest of your life, is not a burden or a bind on some level then good for you, your medal will be waiting for you with St Peter when you meet him.

If you have weighed up your options and decided that children are not for you, or, as in the case of my sister who does not have children and feels a world of pain about the fact, you can self describe your choice/situation as you like and nobody needs to lose their hair about it because, parents, this one is not about you.

I have nothing to do with kids day-to-day and that’s fine with me, none of the family kids live nearby & my friends mainly have older / adult kids (I think).

I’m currently working on a blanket for my cousin’s next baby though, plus a quarter-size version for the baby’s big sister so that when Mum’s wrapping the baby up, she can wrap her teddy up too. Cousin is happy so I’m happy for her, because I can see that while kids would be a burden to me they’re a joy to her.

I think childfree is fine, it says it all, if you see kids as a burden and obligation (which they bloody well are sometimes) then yeah you would consider yourself free for not having them. Don’t think people should feel bad about not wanting kids and being relieved and happy they don’t have them. My SIL is very happily childfree, she’s lovely to my DC but she just doesn’t want any (probably relieved when we leave) and is very happy with her life. Nothing wrong with that.

I don't think your argument makes sense. I freely admit that, if I had been misguided enough to have children, they'd probably have been removed from my by social services. I don't mean that I'd have deliberately hurt them, but my mental health issues would make it impossible not to neglect them in the same way I sometimes neglect myself. Children would be a negative thing for me, and even more of a negative for the children themselves - I don't see anything wrong in acknowledging that. It doesn't mean I think others who want them shouldn't have them.

Here's a thought: don't ask people you're not close to if they have kids. It's none of your business really, and if they do (and want you to know!) it very often organically comes up in conversation anyway.

Most people I know (including me) use childfree as a term to try and stop the follow up questions. I don't know anyone who wears it as any kind of badge of honour/personality trait, and I don't know anyone who uses it outside of the context where they're being asked directly. Sure, some childfree people are weird about it (breeders etc) but they're just, well, assholes. The majority of people without kids (in my experience) just don't want to talk about it!

This thread is bonkers and has got worse since my original comment. Never have I ever had to use the term child free or childless anywhere other than on here. I don't like either term as well as they seem very much a choice and a non choice. It's more complicated than that for some people.

If I am asked I say I don't have them, if I'm probed I say they just never happened because that's the truth. I don't hate children, I don't think they're a burden (no matter what some people think and I've had people take children away from me because they assume I hate children because I don't have them). In fact I had always been the one everyone thought would have children, I had the dream of children and the happy married life with parties in the garden. It just wasn't meant to be.

I left it too late and I married an abusive narcissist so subconsciously took the decision I wasn't going to let a child have him for a father, by the time I plucked up the courage to leave I was 40. I had a scare when I was 44 and I would have taken whatever happened (and I know the guy would have stepped up).

I do not have children.

I am 46 and single. It absolutely breaks my heart that I didn't get that chapter in my life. It's not like "this year we can't afford a holiday so we're staying home and maybe next year" or "I'm in a job I hate but I'm saving up to retrain and when I do I'm find something better".....this is not temporary, it will be my life forever. It has affected me deeply, I've had counselling to deal with this and come to terms with it. I am past the daily crying. I am past having to turn away when I see babies in prams, or avoiding baby showers, or temporarily blocking friends who over-share baby photos. Its still hard though and always will be. I'll always wish I had children.

I have 100% had to teach myself, through gritted teeth, to see the plus points about not having children. I enjoy my life and appreciate that I benefit from freedom that parents don't. I did not choose my life, but I'm still going to make damn sure I enjoy it. I would now much prefer to refer to my situation as "child-free", just because it connotates that positive spin that makes me feel every so slightly less shitty about missing out on children.

As I like being on Mumsnet and would like not to get banned I will refrain from saying exactly what I think about you and your patronising assumptive "nonparent" label. I will just politely say it both offends and enrages me.

So saying “I don’t want kids” is unacceptable? You can only say you don’t have them?

I think the term childfree is gross, and often - not always, obviously, but often - goes along with terms like brats and derogatory attitudes toward children in general.

I admit I may be biased, I see a lot of child abuse in my line of work. While those parents undoubtedly should not have had children, or not gotten together with partners other than their kids dad (perps are often step parents or boyfriends), by and large the idea of children as a nuisance and a burden just hits different when you see some of the results of attitudes like that. Including torture, non-accidental deaths and homicides of children.

I'm with the poster who says if you wouldn't say "xyz-free" you shouldn't use it when it comes to children. The "free" part connotes a negative inherent in the idea of a child, and children are some of our most vulnerable members of society.

It's very simple.

It is tl differentiate between a choice and not a choice. Childfree, childless. Different issues, outlook etc.
I mean, it's really not some complex thing to grasp. 🤷

If parents find it offensive and deregatory to parents, a status that IS a default in life btw, that is simply their derangment. Really.

Not that I will make sure to tag few of you on any thread where parent says they will have childfree weekend and so on, so you can witchunt people using the deregatory term tp eliminate it😉 Happy to help

Link them.

The -free seems to imply liberation from the idea of children

Hallelu! It implies exactly that. It expresses exactly that.

Yet another one post 'talking point' OP...

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻. This sums it up perfectly.

It’s as though wanting, becoming, and enjoying being a mum or a parent, should be a shameful experience, going by so many vile posts.

I visited Mumsnet because in its website explanation, it says it is about parents pooling knowledge together. I have a child and shock and horror, enjoy being a mum and sometimes, like to see if other mums think or have similar experiences to me.

Lately, there have been excessive threads and posts, insulting people who have children.

Exactly. I don’t have children because I absolutely do not want that obligation - as I see it. So yes, I am free from burden and therefore happily describe myself as child free.