To think the term 'childfree' is as bad as 'childless'

It makes 'having children' the default, and 'not having children' abnormal

Umm, isn't that true, otherwise the human population would be decreasing instead of increasing

I would think 'I have children/ don't have children' is simple

Speaking very personally I use childfree over childless because I’m trying to put a positive spin on the fact that no one will call me mum, that I won’t ever get to hold my own baby, that I won’t know that love, that I won’t see a whole person I created grow, that no one will remember me with love when I’m gone.
Sorry if the use of 4 letters upsets you so much. I’ll sit quietly with my cat.

I don't use the term 'childfree' to identify myself (I'm more childfreeless 🤔) but it's such a handy term to use in order to find other women in the same boat and to feel less alone. I really don't think anything should be read into the word beyond that.

Have you tried relaxing?

Sure, some adults are awful too. Doesn't mean I'm gonna treat them badly or like their right don't matter.

You respect kids but describe them as awful? 😂😂😂

I find there are far more awful adults that kids tbh.

Well I mean, kids are generally a little bit awful. I mean...did no one else grow up around them? They're like adults only worse xD Occasional nice one here and there.

Also, if you have a problem with the term childfree implying kids are something negative to be avoided...I'm curious - do you think bringing a child into the world and- forcing the child to attended over a decade of their life in school with no say or personal autonomy about it, is any better?

Because if so, it's like a worker in the prisons complaining about someone being a bit snide to the inmates.

Childrens rights cease to exist when we need somewhere to leave them so we can work.
And everybody just allows it. Because it makes their life easier.

I don't much like kids, but i respect them enough not to bring them into a world where they don't actually have the same rights you and I take for granted.

Just pointing out the irony.

This.

MN proves, once again, that people can get in a froth over absolutely anything.

Fave alternate to my previous one. However, maybe we are due for change.

"i don't have kids"
"oh why? So sorry "
"why? I never wanted them so it's ok"
"oh! But what about the love, the life purpose? Who will take care of you later in life?" 😱

The latter being the favour argument. So I propose change from childfree to purposemadecarerfree

Last time I said that I got a barrage of
“oh you mustn’t leave it too long, you need to hurry up”
”Why don’t you have children?”
”is something broken” (hahahaha 😐)
”come on, you must have them soon!”
”how many do you want”
”is it you or him?” (Hahahaha 😐)

Short of next time saying “my uterus and ovaries are a pair of cunting fuckers and after years of debilitating ivf treatment and multiple losses I’ve made the decision to stop trying and move on from that part of my life so have been both childless and have now chosen to be childfree” I’m just going to stick to a term I’m comfortable with.

I don't understand why a description that people use to describe themselves affects you?

Childfree women often do feel they’ve escaped the drudgery of child rearing that’s expected of them. We spend many years convincing family that we don’t want children and are happier without them.

Why should it not be celebrated as a life choice. Having children isn’t a neutral decision. It’s celebrated so the alternative deserves to be too.

Children are valuable and good whether or not they are wanted,

When I say I am childfree I mean that I am free of my own children, not of anyone else’s that already exist. My hypothetical children are not valuable or good to me - that is why I haven’t brought them into being.

Childfree people aren’t talking negatively about existing children, and us having a term that reflects our choice is not going to lead us into a dystopian hellscape where children no longer have value to anyone including their own parents.

Many childfree people work with or are very close to children in their lives. We don’t hate kids because we don’t want our own.

Am I disparaging men by not wanting any kind of romantic relationship with one? Is being a lesbian a route into a dark future where men are no longer valued by anyone because I personally do not want one in my life? This is how silly your argument sounds to me.

Humans are not intrinsically valuable - look at the way we have collectively damaged, irreparably, our planet! We have less value than the tiniest insect in the universe because we destroy, we do not create.

There is no other category of human I am expected to have by default. There is no other type of human that people consistently ask me if I have them. Nobody says, 'Oh, you don't have Asians? Is that because you can't have them?'

It's the same with dogs. Nobody presumes I physically can't have a dog if I say I don't have a dog.

Maybe if people stopped being so interested in whether or not other people have children and why they don't if they don't, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Maybe if we all just made it a bit easier for women to just say 'no' in answer to the ubiquitous question, without insisting on knowing the ins and outs of a duck's arse about why, nobody would have felt moved to create different terms.

I don't want to talk about not having children. It's none of anybody else's bloody business why I don't have them.

If you don't like the possible answer, don't ask the question in the first place. Problem solved.

I don’t think it’s up to us what labels people give themselves.
Some people who don’t have children but want them will call themselves “childless” and people who don’t have them and don’t want them will call themselves “child free”. Those people get to chose their own labels, it’s nothing to do with you or your feelings.

It's not describing them in a negative way to say you haven't chosen to have them. It's normal, it's fine and it's a choice. It might not be a choice you have made but it doesn't make it wrong and it isn't saying children aren't valuable to someone else.

Bringing adoption etc into it is below the belt. Do you honestly think we don't hear it all the goddamn time.

I don't have a problem with child free at all. However, if you look hard enough, you can find fault/offense/take issue with just about any phrase I guess.

I’m 62 and no kids.
I couldn’t care less if I am called childless or child free.
you clearly haven’t got enough to worry about

Yep. Or have you thought about adoption (yes, we were turned down) or surrogacy (I believe this is child trafficking) or fostering (this is nothing like being a parent) or, or, or, or.... Like you've never fucking thought about it for more than a second.

Wankers.

‘My cousin tried for 11 years to have a child, she had 5 rounds of ivf and nothing worked then she went on holiday to Spain had three cocktails and got pregnant with twins! Now she has 12 kids, why don’t you try it’.

Oh god. That one gives me the absolute rage.

It's deeply problematic when we start ascribing worth and value only to those who are wanted. This kind of thinking has led humanity down some very dark paths. It also has terrible emotional repurcussions for the many children who are in care, with no prospect of adoption or reuniting with their parents.

It's fine to not want to have children. It's not fine to describe children, as a demographic, in a negative way because they are not wanted. Children are valuable and good whether or not they are wanted, because they're human beings.