Age 56. Can't be arsed at work anymore.

But they seem absolutely fine with ageism as they think those of us who don’t pander to the emperors new clothes ideology should just retire - making ageist assumptions

@ClaireduLuney I'm just exhausted at 43 and maybe I'd be feeling less resentful had I not have had to work harder and be louder than any man to progress. I am not even that high in my company, just somewhere senior in the middle, but even now in bloody 2024 I witness young male grads entering the workforce and my manager, a man, is praising them as though they are the best thing since sliced bread. He doesn't even recognise that yes, they are enthusiastic (just like female grads) but they are still learning a basic job.

I once got really offended when he suggested I start involving one of those in my quite senior role after this young man had been with the company for just over six months and was already seeking a promotion. There would have been women or even more experienced men in the team that would have been much more suitable to begin learning my job simply because it would have been a natural progression from the experience they had already built up. Another young man, who is always unhappy with whatever job he's in, got a promotion to quite a senior level with not much to show for other than making noise. Of course he's now still not happy, but he also struggles to see that you probably aren't going to deputise for the CEO within 5 years of entering the workforce.

I am just tired of having to proof myself more than any man to be listened to and just be taken seriously, whilst fending off mansplainers and the constant hidden sexism at work. I'm tired of the politics, which I am having to play harder and better than a man, because I have to anticipate yet another man throwing me under the bus by 'subtly doubting my expertise' and undermining me in meetings. I suppose I have become this kind of stern and 'aggressive' woman at work, but it was either that or being walked over until the end of my days at about half my salary.

I don't think it is depressing. Neither do I think I owe it to woman of the past to climb the greasy corporate ladder. Sex Equality is not yet achieved.

I don't think the point is that women don't want to work. Is that the system of CPD, promoting people for "innovations" that does not do anything new but sometimes give more work to people, over managing, etc. is just turning people off. This is mostly a women site, so you are hearing from women, but I am on the same age bracket as op, feel the same way as her, and all my male colleagues at similar age bracket also feel the same. We have been doing our job well for 20 years, but now, new blood with no experience and some questionable ideas have changed things, so there is so much red tape, the actual work is lost.

So Edith you don't like:
People not being respectful and kind or causing discomfort to others.
Being called a ‘guy’ (‘you guys’)
Sexism
Ideology
Not receiving equal pay
Sexualised dress codes
Sexual harassment.
Not being treated with respect and fairness

Hooo boy you need to do some research and find out about some (not all, but a very significant proportion) of the people who are identifying as transgender, and their attitude to women and their discomfort, fairness, respect and what you should wear as a woman. Guess what – it's not very feminist.

They have names for you that are a whole lot worse than "guy" I assure you.

What about when males are counted as women just because of "what they like to be called" and their higher pay is counted as women's pay and actual females get ignored and obliterated? What about when the same thing happens to sexual offending statistics? When actual females can't compete in sport because of what males want to be called, allowing them to dominate? Oh, all that's already happening.

If you are female, gender ideology is not your friend.

I don't think it is depressing and negative. I think it's a little bit of dark humour, a bit tongue in cheek but mostly grounded in reality.

Me having a slightly cynical view of my firm's approaches to various initiatives, does not equate to me not valuing the opportunities I have had as compared to my grandmother and her generation. It's an oddly narrow lens you're applying.

Not everyone has the same opportunity to change and choose. I have a close friend with a child who has additional needs and will require life-long care. She works a small number of hours a week, around her caring responsibilities, for a supermarket. I'm not sure she'd welcome a lecture about how she's letting down the sisterhood by not trying to stand up her own co-operative, and not maximising the chance to enjoy her "career". She's got bigger things to worry about - the job is a job, it's a means to an end.

Quite. What a negative thread. I got made redundant at the age of 63 at the start of the pandemic. I didn’t want to stop working or give up my income so I found another similar job. During my job seeking phase I am aware that I was discriminated against a couple of times, but that meant that those were companies whose values didn’t align with my own. I’ve moved again since, and been promoted in my current company even though I’m now past retirement age. No way am I giving up whilst I’m fit, capable and earning an excellent salary. I have ample free time to pursue my interests and I love working with a wide group of people from a variety of age groups and locations. I retrained for a completely different field in my 40s when my children were less dependent. If you don’t like what you do, do something else. It’s sad to write yourself off in your 50s and unless you’re rich enough to retire without drastically reducing your circumstances you’ll live in a smaller world and get old before your time.

I think you're being rather naive. Women cannot be anything they want to be. Nor can men for that matter, but the restrictions on women are greater. The vast majority of us end up being whatever we are able to be based on our ability (to some extent) but mainly our circumstances and life chances. Its ridiculous to suggest that we could all have satisfying careers be floating around in space or running the country. How many astronauts and prime ministers ard required compared with office workers? There are only so many of the exciting opportunities to go round, and we still compete with men for those on the backfoot.
The majority of the population has to be engaged in the uninspiring but essential grunt work that's actually required and people will pay us to do. Within that I believe we can make the best of it with a positive attitude, and the OP appears to have done this for decades, but now has some not unnatural positivity fatigue.
Women on here are telling you their reality. Don't patronise them with myths about the world you think we should be living in when we can tell you from experience it's not like that.

I understand your point of view. But I hold a different one. I want women to be valued in the workplace. I don’t want them to have to hide their gender to be treated with respect. I don’t want to be considered ‘one of the guys’. I’m proud to be a woman.

And for those who prefer gender to be ambiguous as a way of combatting gender discrimination, then that’s surely an argument for respecting people who prefer to use they/them.

Anyway, I won’t derail this thread further by discussing workplace expectations on clarifying pronouns. I was purely pointing out that that people in their 50s have had to battle (and are still battling) discrimination and discomfort at work, including age discrimination, which is perhaps one reason why so many women feel so unhappy and under-valued at work as they get older.

Everyone’s entitled to their personal opinions on gender. But in a workplace, it’s best to treat customers/clients with respect, by addressing them how they prefer. And it naturally should extend to staff. I don’t think using pronouns on emails should be mandatory, any more than using titles (Mr, Mrs, Miss, Dr, Baroness etc). But if it saves someone from having to explain to me (and everyone else) they prefer they/them etc, then I do it voluntarily to be inclusive.

Can you just quit?

I do exactly this too! Honestly I think the average age at my work is about 25 and at over 20 years older than that the internal eye rolling I do on a day to day basis is excessive 🤣

This thread is so depressing and negative.

Women wanted equality and to be more than 'housewives' and mothers or have mundane factory jobs.

We got that. More women than ever go to university.

You can be anything you want, within your own limits.

Women go into space, become PMs, leaders in industry, you name it.

Yet most of the posters here are wanting to do anything but work, even some in their 30s and 40s.

If you hate you work or enough aspects of it to want to stop, you're in the wrong job. Time to maybe think about what you'd really like to do and set the wheels in motion for that?

If you hate the 'culture' of the workplace, why not get into a position where you're making that culture and change it?

Exactly.

Quiet quitting, OP. Or leave earlier if you can afford it at all by looking at the budget and cutting down on some things. YANBU at all.

And #bekind only seems to work in one direction

This. Female people's boundaries, spaces, language etc imposed on by the wishes of males. As ever. Same old same old.

I completely agree. As a woman who would be vanishingly unlikely to assumed to be anything else, to have to publicly declare that I wish to be referred to by the pronouns that have always been used for my sex is completely unnecessary. Therefore there would only be one reason for me to do this, which would be to make a public declaration of support for gender ideology.

I find the argument about making other people comfortable disingenuous and manipulative. I do not have to support gender ideology myself or join in with what for me would be a piece of farcical theatre (telling people to refer to me, an obvious woman as she) in order to support and further the comfort of those who do believe in gender ideology. All I need to do is respect their right to hold that belief and allow them to state their own pronouns if they feel there is a risk others may use ones they don't want. I also find the constant inference that not believing in gender ideology is old fashioned and conservative offensive. It's a blatant attempt to associate these views with negative ageist stereotypes, when in reality the young people who believe in gender ideology are in a minority. They are just rarely in positions of sufficient power to feel they can admit it if its embedded in the culture.

Yes, but @Gettingbysomehow , I stood in a shop years ago listening to a nurse saying exactly the same thing about the handwashing initiative. Some innovations and CPD are bullshit, some badly explained or negotiated, and some are vital, eg updates on new knowledge. Like everything, it depends.

And #bekind only seems to work in one direction

Nope, not doing compelled speech and that's what it is. Many of us are old enough to say fuck that to 'be kind' when that translates as 'do what we want'

I'm in my 60s and always go the extra mile for my patients and I dsmned well know what I'm doing after 40 years but I do not need management adding unnecessary work to my day so they can get promotions for their "innovations".

As a 41 year old I respectfully disagree. I have changed jobs a few times, and I even took a major career tangent a decade ago which fixed things for a while. I am at he point where I know with 100% certainty that, unless there are serious issues with the job/workplace/salary, that changing jobs fixes nothing. It is simply a band aid.
I can say with 100% confidence that I have never bought into the bullshit that comes down from above in a big organisation. I have my annual PDR coming up and I am already thinking about ways to politely phrase the fact that I don't care about the organisations strategy and how my objectives for the next year fit into it. The annoying thing is I am also a manager so I have to keep up a certain level of pretence so that my team don't think I've lost the plot, plus I really need the money so I am basically just playing the long game.
One of my team who is late 50's even said to me when I took on her management that she is literally just here to work (and she is a good worker) and doesn't have any interest in CPD or pretending to care about PDRs. I had to stop myself saying I feel exactly the same way! Instead I just acknowledged that she was entitled to feel that way and I'm fine with it as long as she does her job.

How depressing for everyone. How did you feel about people like you when you were young and fresh? Maybe you could do with a new challenge.

Hopefully you are learning g from all this and putting enough (not minimum) money into your pension!

Im in a law firm. Egos everywhere.

It’s not unknown for older women to harass young men in the workplace

This thread might help

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me?page=1