Nervous/anxious/scared about the Autumn budget 2024

So no 90 day rule ? (that applies to us plebs only obvs). So a Tory Brexit consigns vast majority of the UK to the UK, whilst high earners can flounce off whenever ? Great.

Ummm…apart from the WFA (which doesn’t ’go for pensioners, though I agree the threshold is too low) and t( public sector pay rises (which were based on independent review bodies’ recommendations) none of that has happened yet. It might, in the budget. Maybe some, maybe all, maybe none.

Edit: I’ll give you the bus cap, too - but the Tories were set to remove that completely, and the devolved nations don’t have it anyway.

You seem torn between not wanting more Tory type financial decisions and hating any suggestion of anything more traditionally Labour. It’s all a bit odd

Wait for the budget, eh?

@BIossomtoes But do they even want to work? Many discard their documents before arriving, making it difficult to identify them. How can we expect to integrate people into the workforce if we can’t verify who they are?

It is going to be terrible for lots of people, particularly those with savings - in other words those who worked hard and did not spend every penny will be hit - those who did the right thing.

This is what really irks me. The implication that anyone who doesn't have savings has been workshy and reckless with their money. It is this mentality, largely perpetuated by Tory voters, that needs challenging.

It stands to reason that those with a softer financial cushion bear the larger weight in bad times, because they largely benefit the most when times are good. And it's not the politics of envy to say such a thing. I value hard workers from all walks of life. But when you have an economic situation like we've got in the UK at present, something has to give. And in all likelihood, everyone will have to give something. Pensioners with their universally applied WFA, parents with the two child benefit cap. It's shit. I wish Labour could come in and announce loads of things that will immediately make the lives of people wealthier, happier, less stressful, more hopeful. But that was never going to happen.

I just hope that the sacrifices are equitably applied.

Now that’s an answer! Love it!

i don’t see ultimately how anything proposed in the budget is solving any of this aside from the greater borrowing for infrastructure projects (which I actually agree with as a Keynesian believer).

increasing taxes actually looks to just depress everyone and disincentivises. Struggling to see how this would work. Personally I’d probably try and cut taxes particularly to small businesses to try and spur entrepreneurship.

How long have they got then ? Tories had 14 years, Labour 4 months ?
Do you understand the horrendous state of the economy and the overall country’s infrastructure ? You do realise that to invest in public services we have to sacrifice something otherwise we’ll lose them ?
Are you aware of some of the good things that have gone on particularly in the form of legislation behind the scenes ?

It’s not that difficult to move to the EU if you have skills people want.

This is bizarre, you're better off not pushing people off than this

Of course you can. Work sponsorship visas are simple.

Maybe we should just allow asylum seekers to work so, not only are they not costing us anything, but they’re paying tax.

What are labour doing about illegal immigration - this is costing the tax payer millions per day. For me this is why the country is on its knee’s. I’m sorry but unless this government get a grip on this then no amount of increase in tax will make this country better.

Probably got ways and means for ‘high fliers’. I’m not sure though but wouldn’t be surprised.

I voted Labour and so far I am not impressed.

They have managed to:

• go for pensioners
• scare vulnerable, disabled people who now fear they will lose the little money they get from the state
• fail to keep the bus fare £2 cap (although buses are more likely to be used by the lower paid and are a lifeline for people in rural areas)
• leave small business with the real possibility of having to make some of their staff redundant, or at least put a freeze on pay rises, if the budget increases their national insurance contribution.

Meanwhile they:

• are still allowing utility companies to fleece us
• have failed to announce any measure to make big corporate companies and wealthy individuals pay their fair share of tax
• have failed to look at reforming MPs' expenses so that they are not getting all their bills and housing subsidised by the taxpayer while the average worker struggles
• are watering down their long awaited reform to workers' right
• agreed public sector pay rises that we can't even afford.

Basically I did not vote to get the Tories 2.0 in power.

Blaming the Tories for everything is also getting really old as an excuse.

If Labour wanted to do what's best for the country they would also accept that we can't afford to prop up foreign aid and the war in Ukraine endlessly while we have people in this country who don't have money to eat proper meals and keep warm.

Do better Starmer.

Ahhh the loyalty argument.

No I don’t care.

Maybe go the other way about it - don’t publish speculation until the budget is out. It’s just worries people for no reason, and a lot of it is obvious nonsense designed to do exactly that.

So many, many reasons why this is happening but in a massively truncated nutshell:

Covid had a massive impact on forecast growth (there wasn't any) and the billions and billions spent on furlough/business support/testing/vaccine rollout. Some of it was well spent, some was appalling badly spent (hello PPE scandal). All of that combined created a vast hole in the budget.

A lot of long-term spending decisions are made on forecast (or simply assumed) economic growth. The UK economy has performed really poorly (for various reasons - some controllable, some not) and therefore growth has been minimal, netting HMT less money than it needs.

There are also a lot of working age people who don't work, and again that results in less money coming into HMT than one would expect based on demographics, so that's meant long term projections are wrong and there's less money than expected. These aren't necessarily people who are on benefits etc - they're often people who have just decided to pack in work earlier than they planned and are living off a private pension/savings etc.

Wages have stalled across all sectors while lots of costs (e.g. for medicines, for building supplies for schools, for contractors to work on roads, the cost of energy to heat public buildings) have spiralled. So there's about the same amount of money coming in, but a lot more going out.

Failure to invest in infrastructure for decades - under various governments - meaning that now huge projects are needed (e.g. RAAC remediation, hospital rebuilds, dangerously overcrowded prisons, poo in rivers).

Outright mismanagement in both the public sector and in the private sector that relies on public funding: HS2; train operating companies who cream off the profits then need to be bailed out by the taxpayer; PPE (see above); water companies doing similar to the train companies (see point above about poo in the rivers).

And there's the whole thing of very rich people paying comparatively little tax. E.g. Rishi Sunak (an extremely wealthy man) paid less tax than Keir Starmer (who's certainly got more than a few bob but not the eye-watering levels of Sunak). Such policies are meant to encourage investment in the UK to benefit everyone but there's not a lot of evidence that it really happens and mostly just benefits the rich.

There's much more, but that's a snapshot of why the economy is absolutely fucked.

Not in the EU you can’t.

That’s ok then. No loyalty to the people or country of the UK. Who’d have thought.

I’m hoping they step up with a plan to get those who aren’t working (excluding the disabled) contributing to the system. Taxes have their limits, and while income tax hasn’t risen yet, I’m almost certain it’s only a matter of time

If you work for a big international corporation, you can still move anywhere easily.

• Raise income tax across the board. The UK tax burden is lower than most other European countries. Interestingly, several Scandinavian countries (which is often mentioned) have a higher income tax burden amongst low/middle earners than here.

• Don't love the capital gains tax increase but would make sense to increase but needs to take account of inflation.

• Tax global, multi-billion revenue companies

• Introduce a small fee for using the NHS (with a ceiling for those who genuinely need to use the services frequently) - so many missed appointments, so many unnecessary appointments including in A&E.

• Tax gambling and increase taxes on cigarettes etc.

• Introduce a limit on rental increases.

• Introduce more strict policies around sick leave in the public sector - too many instances of abuse (people taking days off ill even when not unwell - was a thread on here recently which was eye opening but also heard similar from people who work in the civil service).

• Introduce a state pension that is dependent not just on number of years worked but how many hours you worked/what you earned. It doesn't make sense that someone who has worked 2 hours/week should get the same as someone who has worked full time.

• Make childcare cheaper so that more parents can work (which would raise tax).

I don't agree with taxing education. It's punitive, and goes against the grain compared with globally. It also doesn't make sense fiscally.

I think it is very naive for people to assume that a higher tax burden on businesses without clear incentives for economic growth in the UK won't lead to people looking at other options.

Especially if there is a lack of clarity over where the additional tax burden is going to be spent.

Maybe at some point a bit further into their tenure than 100 and whatever days though, don’t you think? Your post sounds like you think Labour have been in power for, say, 14 years…
‘No one is buying this shit show is their fault any more’??. What? They’ve only just got in. They’ve done very little yet. Whose fault do you think it is at this point?

Well it seems me and my brain cell are good enough to be taxed every which way, so I suppose we should be good enough for you.

Learn to show some appreciation.

Move then.