To be beginning to think there is some sort of bot presence here starting threads doing down the UK?

Believe me, you’d find walking around many parts of Athens an absolute death trap. Unless you lived in the extremely posh areas.@NewGirlinClass I can only find one or two decent shops for clothes in the city in which I live in the U.K., and do online shopping. Cracks in a pavement are nothing.

Was in Greece for a few weeks. Christ, you have to watch EVERY single step as the pavements are full of rubble, open holes where drain covers should be, rubbish everywhere and so many dilapidated buildings. Don’t get me wrong. Weather brilliant, fruit and veg massive and cheap, food cheaper, people friendly. Eating out cheap. There is A LOT of poverty in Greece.
Healthcare crap, stinking fumes from bashed up cars, mopeds and vans. Graffiti everywhere, a lot of metro trains covered in graffiti. Chaotic streets, gypsy kids galloping about, Albanian kids begging on buses and trains, someone trying to sell you something with every 5 steps you take. Mafia from Bulgaria, Russia………
Contrast with uk. Streets clean, and ordered. Can walk without breaking feet, toes, or legs.
Nice architecture in many places in U.K..No graffiti (not where I live, anyway) no rubbish. No street dogs. No electric scooters; Europe is not some utopia. The Greeks complain about Albanians. The Turkish complain about the Greeks. The Romanians complain about the Hungarians. My sons were in Germany for the Euros (football) and many people they encountered (from many different nations) did not have nice things to say about Serbia. Other son works in Sicily. Again, speaks about dangerous streets, mafia, crumbling buildings, loony drivers, begging children, abject poverty. Yes, Britain has its fair share of issues, but it’s really not that bad.
I’m interested in some of the Scandi countries, Denmark is a sensible place, with a much more equal society, their political system tends to work well. I personally love many that I’ve met from The Netherlands. Norway, I find the lifestyle and people to be very good. Food and drink prices through the roof though.
Look. Boris has gone (thank god) and be selective where you get your news and media offerings. British folk are particularly good at moaning, would win gold medals frequently if it became a sport.

Personally I've always felt that the Soviet era infiltration by Burgess, Philby etc went much much deeper and across the social classes, leading to a huge number of people who seemed in the 60s and 70s when they reached positions of responsibility, to attack the UK from within, attacking the monarchy, the legal system, the way we have 2 chambers elected and unelected, the police, the forces etc.
This has grown and whilst I can see in many cases why people feel the way they do about the house of lords for example, the relentless attacks and the inability to actually discuss issues seems strange.(Personally I am reconsidering my position on the house of lords having been for many years an advocate, the fact that someone who writes musicals about cats gets to decide the future of the country seems wrong! )

🙄 Let's not compare apples with oranges. How about comparing with other northern European countries? The UK is disgusting in comparison. It has definitely got worse in the last twenty years.

I've definitely seen a ramping in the last few months. The Starmer hate has been particularly OTT. It feels like managed smearing, rather than opinion giving.

Haha! Burn! 🔥

Went into my nearest big town yesterday. Bus was very uncomfortable as the road surface was so damaged, Pavements uneven and cracks everywhere. (I walk with a stick).
Shops crammed with people sorting over some nice clothes but only a few sizes on offer. So I shall have to buy on line.
A pub and a cafe were not dirty but neither were they polished and shiny clean.
Yes I moan because all of those things could have been improved with some effort and not huge amounts of money. I feel many people are only doing the minimum that is acceptable, few are making the effort to be exemplary.

Very very well said!!

The negativity and navel gazing and self criticism is one of the worst parts of British nature but I think it’s much more prevalent online than in real life. A vocal minority dominates and tries to manipulate facts, bring others down. Good to be conscious of this and rise above it.

Yes. In addition we have prepayment certificates so that even if you need multiple medicines to manage a condition, the total cost is capped to less £10/month on an annual or £11.50/month on a three month certificate. It saves me a fortune.

I agree.

I remember returning from.a holiday in Egypt and being so relieved that I could walk down the street without being stared at, sexually assaulted or has someone try to sell me something.

I've lived in 2 other countries outside of the UK and although it was a great experience I now value the UK much more.

We have a milder climate, more choices of food and other goods in the shops, better public transport, a fairer police and justicesystem (I saw a man being beaten with sticks by the police in an Asian country, and a friend was advised against reporting a crime as the perpetrator was an organised criminal in an Eastern European country).

The Asian country I lived in also had no free education system so many children didn't go to school. And no health care either unless you could pay.

And as someone else mentioned, women here are so much safer and have better life choices and freedoms than in many other countries.

This country is by no means perfect but I for one am extremely grateful to have been born British.

You wouldn't believe how many people in England don't know how much a prescription costs. Quite a lot of people think the real cost of the medication is the (massively subsidised) £10-ish they pay for an item. We were paying hundreds a month in prescription costs when we lived abroad. And we were not in America.

Yes, I think it's post-covid. I've been around these parts, on and off, stretching back to Gordon Brown, and this place has just become a doom and gloom cesspit of one post, new name, bellyaching thread starters.

We're the the 9th most unequal in terms of income of 38 OECD countries.

It's really difficult to work out where is better in terms of welfare, as factors like housing costs, wage related unemployment benefits & maternity/paternity pay differ.

But, using % of gdp to welfare is a reasonable guide to looking further into the differences. So that would include the Scandinavian countries, France, Germany, Italy, Spain, France, Belgium, Japan who all spend more as % of GDP on "social benefits".

So a few.

It has been the case since Covid regardless of Labour not being in, maybe it's more noticeable now to those who voted for Labour

1. I'm not sure if it's a particularly British trait but we do rather like to moan about stuff. We don't like boasting or self-congratulation. A lot of our best comedy is self-deprecating. Also, as people get older they often remember the past as better than the present.

1. Mumsnet is a weird place. Some threads I read and feel really happy that I have found kindred spirits. Others I wonder how so many people can share a view that I think is totally wrong, that I don't know anyone who behaves like that irl.

I've though the same thing in the last month or so. The anti Labour, far right and generally goady posts have really ramped.

It's all a bit Twitter, isn't it? It feels 'managed' and manipulative.

I think we’re also so used to having everything easy here that a bit of rubbish on the street = hysteria ‘the WHOLE place is filthy’

Yes, it's hilarious. I particularly liked ...everywhere is filthy ... except for my place which is lovely, because other people are generous with their time and caring of their environment - but they shouldn't to, which they do, but if they didn't - it really would be awful.

I mean talk about a glass half empty 😁

Africa is a whole continent OP.

Yes, some people have never travelled and it shows. Seeing other countries made me realize how lucky we are in the UK!
I think we’re also so used to having everything easy here that a bit of rubbish on the street = hysteria ‘the WHOLE place is filthy’. Classic mumsnet really.
I follow someone on Instagram who is living in the uk for the first time from the US, and going to all sorts of beautiful places, seeing the country through her eyes has really made me appreciate it more too!

Please list 🙂

Yes this.

And also why compare to countries where things are worse? Why not compare to countries where, on average, things are better?

Eg. France has a better healthcare system than the UK. Actually so do quite a few other European countries.

And the UK has one of the lowest state pensions in the developed world, and much worse and lower amount of money working age welfare benefits than many other European countries.

Of course there's a lot of good things and areas in the UK. But it's very dependent on where someone lives and their individual circumstances. Speaking about the problems doesn't necessarily mean "hating on the UK". It's more likely people struggling and who justifiably want a better deal.

The false economy of austerity has badly damaged both individuals - and the UK in general. That's been confirmed by various studies conducted by experts (although it doesn't take an expert to realise this). Hopefully the government will address the issues and repair the damage done - starting with an end to the false economy approach.