Page 2 | WINTER FUEL PAYMENT

cobden28 · 2024-10-21T09:29:03+00:00

A couple of days ago I received the official letter from the DWP telling me I'm not going to receive the Winter Fuel payment this year because, although I am within the required age group, I'm not in receipt of the listed benefits. I am 69 years of age. On the same day I also received notifiication from my energy supplier of the amount of my next Direct Debit monthly payment and a request to submit my meter readings. I've contacted the energy supplier and arranged for them to send round a meter reader, so they can't be in a position to dispute the readings oobtained. Then once I get my billing sorted i'm going to have to work out how to cut my energy bill. My proposed method is to turn off the central heating and only use the gas fire in the living room for heating - I feel uncomfortable if a room is too warm and the gas fire chucks out lots of heat anyway.

saraclara · 21/10/2024 21:56

saraclara · 21/10/2024 21:51

I'm 68. It was 5.5% of school leavers that went to uni when I left.

Show quote history

In the interests of accuracy, I just researched higher education access, so to include teacher training colleges and polytechnics (which later became unis) and it becomes a more respectable 14%.

saraclara · 21/10/2024 21:51

Superworm24 · 21/10/2024 21:14

It's still the minority who go to university. Currently it's around 35 percent but was more like 20-25 when I left school.

Show quote history

I'm 68. It was 5.5% of school leavers that went to uni when I left.

rainydaysandrainbows · 21/10/2024 21:20

Some of the comments on here are horrible, and pretty much make out every pensioner is loaded and selfish and if they're not loaded well they didn't work hard enough or have got other benefits that mean they're not worthy of sympathy. As someone who's a hell of a long way from retirement but has family impacted by the loss of the winter fuel payment these comments make me feel really uncomfortable.

Superworm24 · 21/10/2024 21:14

MontyDonsBlueScarf · 21/10/2024 16:09

Perhaps it would help you to feel better about it if you consider that the retirement age inceased from 60, for women, in 2010. For men it was already 65. So the only pensioners who could claim their state pension at 60 are women currently over 74, born before 1950. These women would typically have left school at 15 at a time when only 4% of the population went to university. They had already been working for 7 years by the time they were 22. They did an 'extra' 7 years at the start of their working lives, compared to today's workforce where the majority didn't start work till after university or college. Perhaps that balances out the 'extra' 7 years that people now have to wait for their pensions.

Show quote history

It's still the minority who go to university. Currently it's around 35 percent but was more like 20-25 when I left school.

QueenOfHiraeth · 21/10/2024 21:11

Driedonion · 21/10/2024 20:05

How about this- there’s some sort of central point where pensioners who are well off can donate their winter fuel allowance, should they wish, to someone who is struggling.
Maybe it could be done via the food banks somehow and be converted into supermarket gift cards that could be put in with the food bank goods. It could be divided 3 ways maybe to help more people?

Unfortunately many of those who don't need it and brag about it keeping them warm on their cruise or in Tenerife, etc would not donate it anyway.
I know some wealthy pensioners who brag about legal ways to avoid tax, etc and am sure that they would not donate even if a starving, freezing orphan was right in front of them!

GiantHornets · 21/10/2024 20:42

Driedonion · 21/10/2024 20:05

How about this- there’s some sort of central point where pensioners who are well off can donate their winter fuel allowance, should they wish, to someone who is struggling.
Maybe it could be done via the food banks somehow and be converted into supermarket gift cards that could be put in with the food bank goods. It could be divided 3 ways maybe to help more people?

Again, why should the government/tax payer give out money so that the affluent can donate it to charity?

itsgettingweird · 21/10/2024 20:16

The ones falling through the gap in the case I questioned above are those above £218 who don't get the full state pension.

itsgettingweird · 21/10/2024 20:15

So you get pension credit if you're on less than £218 a week.

Does the credit take you up to £218 or the state pension of £222?

Because if it's £218 you get £3/4 a week less than those on state pension.

So the WFA doesn't take you much over the same as those on state pension are receiving in pension.

Before you add the rise!

saraclara · 21/10/2024 20:07

Driedonion · 21/10/2024 20:05

How about this- there’s some sort of central point where pensioners who are well off can donate their winter fuel allowance, should they wish, to someone who is struggling.
Maybe it could be done via the food banks somehow and be converted into supermarket gift cards that could be put in with the food bank goods. It could be divided 3 ways maybe to help more people?

There are energy banks. I gave my first WFA to one.

There's not enough publicity around them though.

Driedonion · 21/10/2024 20:05

How about this- there’s some sort of central point where pensioners who are well off can donate their winter fuel allowance, should they wish, to someone who is struggling.
Maybe it could be done via the food banks somehow and be converted into supermarket gift cards that could be put in with the food bank goods. It could be divided 3 ways maybe to help more people?

PandoraSox · 21/10/2024 20:04

VirginiaGirl · 21/10/2024 19:56

Definitely worth investing in a heated throw or 2 if you don’t already own one. I love mine!

Yes, they are well worth it.

VirginiaGirl · 21/10/2024 19:56

Definitely worth investing in a heated throw or 2 if you don’t already own one. I love mine!

EasternStandard · 21/10/2024 19:54

QueenOfHiraeth · 21/10/2024 18:43

@EasternStandard If you read the full thread it seems that being "a pensioner with a disability" may not automatically mean dire straits.

I'll save my sympathy for those who really need it and stand by my assertion that the number of pensioners who will genuinely suffer and cannot claim help is relatively small

Show quote history

Well you can’t have looked at Age UK’s statement then so it’s really only fabricated rather than reality.

As for the op what a group to target, do people A/S other posters who have more than one benefit?

BIossomtoes · 21/10/2024 19:50

ssd · 21/10/2024 18:28

In actual money terms, how much do you have to get in income to stop you getting WFA?

Does anyone know?

The amount of a full state pension, ie £220 a week.

thepariscrimefiles · 21/10/2024 19:46

NewName24 · 21/10/2024 16:35

What is more of a scandal is that they are spending millions of ££ sending out individual letters to everyone!

I mean, it's hardly been a secret there has been this change, has it?

Pensioners have always received letters about the winter fuel payments. These letters provide information about eligibility and how to apply for Pension Credit and other benefits. These letters are providing useful information and there will always be older people who don't go online or on social media or watch the news.

Under one of the recent Tory governments I used to receive an annual statement of how much tax I'd paid and where it was spent. I didn't need this information and considered it a waste of money. I wouldn't call it a 'scandal' though.

QueenOfHiraeth · 21/10/2024 18:43

PandoraSox · 21/10/2024 14:27

Well I very naughtily AS'd OP. She says she is not exactly struggling but not in the lap of luxury either. So, not sure what her game is here.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/money-matters/5001343-retirement-at-55?reply=136460514&utm_campaign=reply&utm_medium=share

Edited

@EasternStandard If you read the full thread it seems that being "a pensioner with a disability" may not automatically mean dire straits.

I'll save my sympathy for those who really need it and stand by my assertion that the number of pensioners who will genuinely suffer and cannot claim help is relatively small

ExtraOnions · 21/10/2024 18:37

Shakeoffyourchains · 21/10/2024 12:06

Presumably they're required to notify everyone so I doubt they've much choice in the matter but, it might be fun to try and work it out.

There's about 7.8m people affected by the cut.

To send each a letter you'd need:

7.8m stamps (1st class at £1.35)
envelopes
7.8m envelopes (pack of 5000 for £125)
15,600 packs of 500 sheets of A4 paper (around £9 a pack on average)
3,200 ink cartridges (around £24 on average).

So, (7.8m x £1.35) + (1560 × £125) + (15,600 x £9) + (3,200 x £24) = £10,942,200 for materials.

Then you'd need to print and send them.

It takes about 0.05kWh to print an A4 letter so and average kWh costs 22.36p so:

7.8m × 0.05kWh = 390,000kWh x £0.2236 = £87,204 in electricity.

And let's say staff are paid on average £13 p/h and can process 30 letters and hour:

7.8m ÷ 30 = 260,000 hours x £13 p/h = £3,380,000 in staff costs.

That makes the total somewhere in the region of £14,409,404.

Now obviously that's based on an assumption that the government are pay average consumer prices for materials and electricity, which is unlikely, but then I've probably forgot to factor in some hidden costs so it should balance out.

So a one-off cost of £14.5m to carry out their responsibilities in terms of notifying people in order to save, according to the government anyway, £1.5bn.

Should also say maths is not my strong point so there's a good chance I've made a pig's ear of something in the above.

It won’t cost anything like a that

Letters are printed, and put into envelopes by machine .. so staff costs are practically zero.

There are no “first class stamps” - there is a fulfilment contract in place, so the cost is less than a stamp

Costs of envelopes and paper / ink is much less expensive than quoted, due to bulk printing contracts.

Changingplace · 21/10/2024 18:34

ssd · 21/10/2024 18:28

In actual money terms, how much do you have to get in income to stop you getting WFA?

Does anyone know?

According to this you get pension credit if you’re on an income of less than £218 a week.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gv632d05lo.amp

EasternStandard · 21/10/2024 18:30

QueenOfHiraeth · 21/10/2024 17:34

@EasternStandard I think the number of people who will genuinely be in need is relatively small and know there is help available for them.

I do not think most of those complaining are justified in their over-entitled outrage and, yes, I do grin at that
There was something, either on here or in the media, that an organisation had a lot of pensioners attending asking for assessment to claim extra help as they "needed" support due to the withdrawal of this payment. The majority of those assessed were no eligible as they had an income in excess of £2k per month with no mortgage/rent to pay from it. There is a lot of greed at play here

I think the number of people who will genuinely be in need is relatively small and know there is help available for them.

It’s not small hence Age UK releasing a statement about the real hardship many will face, including exacerbating conditions and increased risk of falls. Have you read up on that?

The op is a pensioner with a disability - of all the groups to get pleasure from seeing hit by cuts it’s not great.

ssd · 21/10/2024 18:28

In actual money terms, how much do you have to get in income to stop you getting WFA?

Does anyone know?

wiesowarum · 21/10/2024 18:25

PinkiOcelot · 21/10/2024 13:30

Why all the arsey responses on this thread?!

I just see folk being honest.

HeadNorth · 21/10/2024 18:05

NewName24 · 21/10/2024 17:04

So, by that logic, there clearly is no point in sending them a letter, as they won't like the message, so won't be consoled by getting a letter about it.

Show quote history

The Government are covering themselves in the event of legal action. Which is very likely- wealthy pensioners with plenty of time on their hands may well attempt such nonsense.

MereDintofPandiculation · 21/10/2024 17:57

The £300 that Stammer has robbed us off would have helped loads of us too. Only £200. Per couple, not per person. So that’s £100 you haven’t been robbed of and can put toward your bill

QueenOfHiraeth · 21/10/2024 17:34

@EasternStandard I think the number of people who will genuinely be in need is relatively small and know there is help available for them.

I do not think most of those complaining are justified in their over-entitled outrage and, yes, I do grin at that
There was something, either on here or in the media, that an organisation had a lot of pensioners attending asking for assessment to claim extra help as they "needed" support due to the withdrawal of this payment. The majority of those assessed were no eligible as they had an income in excess of £2k per month with no mortgage/rent to pay from it. There is a lot of greed at play here

saraclara · 21/10/2024 17:26

Here's the letter. And it follows up on their aim to get people to apply for Pension Credit if they haven't already, so that they DO then get the WFA. So it's a very valuable letter, and whining about the cost of sending it is just silly.
(Click on the images to un-blur them)