Page 2 | Is this sexist?

WillLiveLifeAgain · 2024-10-20T06:01:11+00:00

I work for a small but very successful building contractor. I cover everything office based, all accounting, logistics, transport, HR - a very varied role. I am also the only female in the firm. This is relevant. I’m regularly required on site for progress reports and client meetings. I have a great relationship with the team of builders. We banter but it’s respectful. One thing that irritates me, one or two of the team usually ask me if I’ve brought the biscuits/ice creams when I visit sites. Full disclosure - for client meetings I usually organise refreshments and make the tea for the meeting attendees, ie client, architect, my boss, etc. The building team don’t attend. I’m very happy to do this as part of my role. AIBU to feel the comments from the team are sexist and they wouldn’t say this if a man was in my role?

Crazyeight · 20/10/2024 08:36

My guess is they would say the same thing to a man in your role but they would do so to mock him as a male in what they perceived to be a woman's role and therefore it remains mysoginistic (oh look at steve he's getting the tea cups out like a little lady).

It might not be a huge act but it is sexism and a power play that undermines how competent you are perceived to be.

purplebeansprouts · 20/10/2024 08:36

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:33

Thanks. I am senior, second to the Director. I deal with all of the finance, contracts, health and safety, customer service. As a woman I also make tea for meetings. There’s less senior men attend the meetings but I make the tea.

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Why do you make the tea? Sorry I think I've misunderstood. Is it your role to make the tea? If it's not just make a joke and say oh I think its someone else's turn I've been doing it 3 years!

Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:33

5128gap · 20/10/2024 08:31

Unfortunately I think the 'sexism' is inbuilt into your roles as you are in a traditional female job involving provision of support and domestics, while they are in the traditional male manual roles. I think in this case rather than asking for food because you're a woman they are referencing what they see you do in your job. Tbh if you were a female senior they probably wouldn't ask and if you were the male apprentice you'd be sent on food runs, so I think you'd struggle to make sexism stick here. Doesn't mean you can't assertively have a word and tell them to stop though if it bothers you.

Thanks. I am senior, second to the Director. I deal with all of the finance, contracts, health and safety, customer service. As a woman I also make tea for meetings. There’s less senior men attend the meetings but I make the tea.

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5128gap · 20/10/2024 08:31

Unfortunately I think the 'sexism' is inbuilt into your roles as you are in a traditional female job involving provision of support and domestics, while they are in the traditional male manual roles. I think in this case rather than asking for food because you're a woman they are referencing what they see you do in your job. Tbh if you were a female senior they probably wouldn't ask and if you were the male apprentice you'd be sent on food runs, so I think you'd struggle to make sexism stick here. Doesn't mean you can't assertively have a word and tell them to stop though if it bothers you.

Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:30

I think some women need educating on sexism in the workplace but take your point.

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ClytemnestraWasMisunderstood · 20/10/2024 08:29

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:22

@ClytemnestraWasMisunderstood because, as this thread has shown it’s a minor issue. By challenging it I’d look like a trouble causer/raging feminist. I’m neither, I just wish there wasn’t any differential between me and the team. But that’s like wishing inequality didn’t exist and that isn’t going to happen.

But unless people call it out, it will continue.
Telling other women about sexism will not

Redruns · 20/10/2024 08:29

Umbrella not sure, I think it's usual for the "visitor" to bring biscuits I.e. you're not permanently based on site.

I used to do a job in a bank that involved visiting lots if offices. I and others in my role, male and female, would often take biscuits.

Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:27

DustyAmuseAlien · 20/10/2024 08:22

If this is the worst of the sexism you are experiencing I am really happy to hear how much the world has progressed. It's not necessarily the case that they would treat a man in the same role differently - your rile clearly includes greasing the wheels of sociable good relationships between the clients and the builders and making tea for and providing biscuits for clients is part of that which either a man or woman could do. So if team members are aware of this they might well banter about fancying a biscuit - I would say you're better off working on some sarky put-downs

How about "When you are bringing in half a million pounds of business to the firm Charlie, then you might be worth a jaffacake, but until then you sort your own"

Edited

It’s not the worst sexism I’ve faced. Does that make it better? If I’ve had comments about how great my tits look today does that make this issue worse?

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Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:24

@Completelyjo I think you just want a row but to answer some of the earlier posts and the ones that say “worse things happen”.

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DustyAmuseAlien · 20/10/2024 08:22

If this is the worst of the sexism you are experiencing I am really happy to hear how much the world has progressed. It's not necessarily the case that they would treat a man in the same role differently - your rile clearly includes greasing the wheels of sociable good relationships between the clients and the builders and making tea for and providing biscuits for clients is part of that which either a man or woman could do. So if team members are aware of this they might well banter about fancying a biscuit - I would say you're better off working on some sarky put-downs

How about "When you are bringing in half a million pounds of business to the firm Charlie, then you might be worth a jaffacake, but until then you sort your own"

Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:22

@ClytemnestraWasMisunderstood because, as this thread has shown it’s a minor issue. By challenging it I’d look like a trouble causer/raging feminist. I’m neither, I just wish there wasn’t any differential between me and the team. But that’s like wishing inequality didn’t exist and that isn’t going to happen.

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Completelyjo · 20/10/2024 08:20

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:00

calm down! I didn’t say your mountain molehill comment was misogyny did I?

Yes I understand what misogyny is, do you know what patronising means?

It might be a non issue to you, thanks for your opinion!

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Then which post was misogynistic? It’s not misogyny to disagree with you, I can’t see a single post that could be referred to as misogyny.

ClytemnestraWasMisunderstood · 20/10/2024 08:18

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:16

Just to be clear, I’m not saying this is the worst crime of the century. I’ve never said anything about it IRL.

I’m aware “worse things happen” - I had a sub contractor who regularly stared at my chest, squeezed by me, touched my arm/leg and this was much much worse.

I wanted opinion and I’ve had it, thank you. I will just get on with it and laugh with the rest of them.

Why won't you challenge it rather than laughing along with the rest?
Why is this such a difficult thing to do? Will you lose your job if you do?

Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:16

Just to be clear, I’m not saying this is the worst crime of the century. I’ve never said anything about it IRL.

I’m aware “worse things happen” - I had a sub contractor who regularly stared at my chest, squeezed by me, touched my arm/leg and this was much much worse.

I wanted opinion and I’ve had it, thank you. I will just get on with it and laugh with the rest of them.

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LlynTegid · 20/10/2024 08:10

I think it is, not sure what you can do if anything, and to be honest a lot worse seems to still be part of your trade in some places.

Coconutter24 · 20/10/2024 08:03

I don’t think it’s sexist and you don’t know if it was a man in your role they wouldn’t ask him, your just presuming there. If you normally take biscuits when you visit then they might just expect them each time if sorting refreshments is normally your role.

ClytemnestraWasMisunderstood · 20/10/2024 08:03

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 07:55

I fail to see how the fact there are far more problematic issues (which I have faced as a woman in a male dominated world) makes this a lesser problem.

Believe me I’m aware of some of the sexual harassment in the workplace and have experienced it in this role and others.

I’m not an extreme feminist and find some of the opinions on the feminist board a little over the top, but some of the opinions here are borderline misogyny.

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Borderline misogyny? Where? Which posts in particular?

Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 08:00

Completelyjo · 20/10/2024 07:57

In what way is stating that you are making a mountain out of a molehill misogyny? Do you even understand what misogyny is?

You often turn up to this location with biscuits, other times people joke where are the biscuits, it’s a total non issue.

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calm down! I didn’t say your mountain molehill comment was misogyny did I?

Yes I understand what misogyny is, do you know what patronising means?

It might be a non issue to you, thanks for your opinion!

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ClytemnestraWasMisunderstood · 20/10/2024 08:00

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 07:16

“Not the worst thing they could say”

No it’s not, but does that make it right?

None of the males in the company get asked this.

Well, say something then!
It isn't difficult.
If you know they would not ask the males this, call them out. Challenge them.
They are very unlikely to read MN, so how else are they going to know?
I worry for the future evolution of the female spine

Completelyjo · 20/10/2024 07:57

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 07:55

I fail to see how the fact there are far more problematic issues (which I have faced as a woman in a male dominated world) makes this a lesser problem.

Believe me I’m aware of some of the sexual harassment in the workplace and have experienced it in this role and others.

I’m not an extreme feminist and find some of the opinions on the feminist board a little over the top, but some of the opinions here are borderline misogyny.

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In what way is stating that you are making a mountain out of a molehill misogyny? Do you even understand what misogyny is?

You often turn up to this location with biscuits, other times people joke where are the biscuits, it’s a total non issue.

Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 07:57

Talipesmum · 20/10/2024 07:52

Are you the only person coming to site from the office?
If there are client meetings, are they on site or in the office? Ie do you sometimes bring refreshments to site and sometimes not?

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I’m the only office based staff.

I visit site more often for odd jobs than for meetings. Odd jobs daily, meetings monthly.

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Original poster

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 07:55

Completelyjo · 20/10/2024 07:50

Then clarify to them if you want. I think it probably just comes down to the fact that some times when you go there you bring biscuits and it’s just a joke on the other days.

Honestly there are so many actual problematic things women need to deal with in the workplace I personally think you’re making a mountain out of a molehill. What’s wrong with a quick comment back about thinking the custard creams were on them that day?

Show quote history

I fail to see how the fact there are far more problematic issues (which I have faced as a woman in a male dominated world) makes this a lesser problem.

Believe me I’m aware of some of the sexual harassment in the workplace and have experienced it in this role and others.

I’m not an extreme feminist and find some of the opinions on the feminist board a little over the top, but some of the opinions here are borderline misogyny.

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Talipesmum · 20/10/2024 07:52

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 07:39

I think the meeting element is causing confusion. I do supply refreshments for meetings.

The area I’m feeling is sexist is when I turn up on site to carry out a brief task (no meeting). I’m there to do a job, much like they are. They don’t ask each other if they’ve brought the cakes in.

Are you the only person coming to site from the office?
If there are client meetings, are they on site or in the office? Ie do you sometimes bring refreshments to site and sometimes not?

Completelyjo · 20/10/2024 07:50

WillLiveLifeAgain · 20/10/2024 07:39

I think the meeting element is causing confusion. I do supply refreshments for meetings.

The area I’m feeling is sexist is when I turn up on site to carry out a brief task (no meeting). I’m there to do a job, much like they are. They don’t ask each other if they’ve brought the cakes in.

Then clarify to them if you want. I think it probably just comes down to the fact that some times when you go there you bring biscuits and it’s just a joke on the other days.

Honestly there are so many actual problematic things women need to deal with in the workplace I personally think you’re making a mountain out of a molehill. What’s wrong with a quick comment back about thinking the custard creams were on them that day?

stayathomer · 20/10/2024 07:47

I’d think it sexist if you didn’t organise food for eg meetings but since you do I’d assume it’s just part of your job?