Friend told me I’ve lost myself in motherhood

So many stereotypes 🙄. Some posters are utter twats.

@gannett

Unfortunately this sort of thing you describe happens quite a lot. It’s desperately insensitive but also unnecessary.

Toddlers do of course require hands on care and complete attention. But you don’t sign a contract when you have children that says: “I will henceforth never have a difficult conversation without immediately pivoting back to Peppa Pig or Bluey.”

You need to look after your kids diligently. It’s not a requirement to be such a tunnel vision bore about it. An intelligent person should be able to keep an eye on their toddler while also speaking to another adult.

Why do you have to drag the toddler along? I imagine it’s incredibly boring for them and it completely changes the dynamic.

Without even meaning to the whole focus becomes about the child - it’s incredibly dull watching someone else parent their child when you are meant to be having a nice social catch up. Leave them with Dad or get a sitter next time.

Whereas I wouldn't want " mum" friends and have to put up with their kids. Mind you id not be taking a toddler out when meeting a friend socially

You think your child is the best thing ever.

Your friend, wouldnt be bothered if they never saw the child again.

This doesn't make your friend a bad person because she doesn't want a child she's got no real interest in being the focus of when she tries to spend time with her friend.

Your child is not interesting to most people, other than you and family.

It's more telling than you know, how entirely focussed you are on your pfb when you describe your child as 2.3yrs old.

I like children. I have too many several. DTwins are fantastic, to me. They are tedious foghorns to many. And that's fine. You just need to twig that's the case.

The last time I, as a childfree person, went out with a friend and her kid was just after I'd finished my first course of chemo. She had persuaded me to go out even though I was self conscious of my bald head and still felt fragile. She spent the whole time talking to the kid while I was trying to talk about my cancer and my treatment. I left early and didn't bother again.

When more of my friends had kids I realised that the ones who treated me as if I was invisible and inaudible were just rude. It wasn't an inevitability of becoming a parent. Most of my parent friends don't do that!

Some of us could still attend to children whilst maintaining eye contact and a conversation with a friend.

It used to annoy the hell out of me if I was chatting to someone and they’d break off to just do something inane with a child who wasn’t in any particular need. I was once left hanging on the phone for probably 5 mins once while a friend wrangled with her child whether he wanted the blue egg cup or the bunny one. I was fuming - I had my own three small children at the time, and yet I was left there hanging in silence.

Another friend used to just drop by to entertain her child with our toys. She would start reading a book to hers while we mid-chat. In my own house! Left looking like a dope just sitting opposite her watching her read to her child (with one of our books) while my kids were playing in the other room!

It’s just utterly rude and self absorbed behaviour. The excuse that you’ve got small children doesn’t wash with me. Motherhood doesn’t stop you having a coffee with a friend and being interested in their life. If you’re too ‘distracted’ then you’re not a good friend.

Going against the grain

You can manage a toddler and still have a conversation with other adults.

The toddler does not need 100% of your attention as long as you are aware of what they're doing.

People also have different abilities to divide attention. In many places, I can have an eye on my child and talk to my dad for example but he’s absolutely adamant I can because HE can’t. It’s a slightly fragmented conversation (longer pauses usually) but I absolutely hear and respond

This. Still remember meeting up with friends with new babies/toddlers and I might as well not have been there. I felt invisible and inaudible. They weren’t all like this but a lot of them were.

Many years ago my friend's mother was dying of cancer. It was a horrible, drawn-out process for many months. Towards the end of this we visited a mutual friend who had a toddler. The friend whose mother was dying was talking about this, it was a pretty deep conversation and she was on the verge of tears. Midway through this the toddler came into the room and instantly our mutual friend started cooing over him, asking him what he wanted, whetehr she could look at his drawing or whatever. She interrupted someone whose mother was dying, and talked over her with inane bollocks. It was honestly stunning to watch.

That was in fact the end of their friendship - as the first friend said to me when we left shortly afterwards, "I'm never talking to her again". Not sure if the second friend ever actually noticed, she was that wrapped up in her children. I drifted apart from her too, not much motivation to keep a friendship going when someone shows you how much they care.

I was unable to have children. I had 4 miscarriages and spent around 30k on treatment. So I can't afford (or want anyway) expensive hand bags. But yes because I don't have children I have nice things out on display and my house is normally clean and tidy.
Why because I don't want to spend ALL my time with other people's children would you want my house smashed up?

@Dwappy

I had one friend who was unable to talk about ANYTHING other than her child from day one. I listened to this for 4 years until I started to just pull away.

Your post really resonated with me.

I do have a child and I probably was a bore when she was a toddler. It’s kind of unavoidable.

Bur it’s hard to get across to people how much the takeover of a friend can make a childless person feel. It can literally be like a zombie has occupied your friend’s body and has a warning signal that flashes red if the conversation becomes too adult or serious and hastily steers things back to drivel about what the kid is doing.

Its not just boring being on the receiving end of this it’s mildly insulting because it feels like the friend is using their child as an excuse to avoid proper conversation.

I don’t know what the answer is because if course mums are preoccupied with their toddlers. The childless friend has to take that on the chin a bit. But I do think its incumbent on people to ask themselves: “Does my best friend really want to have to remark for the fourteenth time in ten minutes how cute little Harry is when she wants to talk about her boyfriend / promotion / university dissertation?”

There is such a thing as a mum bore. It's hard not to be one when they're small, you don't sleep well and have very little time for yourself. As they get older it's so important to create time and space for yourself or else you start to lose all personality.

If you want to stay friends with this person you need to make some effort to see them childfree. As your DC gets older they need to be taught not to interrupt and that sometimes they need to go find something to do while you're busy.

What a cunty post.

What the fuck is wrong with you? Fantasise about somebody you don't even know treating their friend horribly? That's what you find 'so nice?

And by the way, I very sadly don't have children. My husband and I have had to accept that it will never happen for us. I also don't have any designer handbags, a whitewashed oak table, or leave medications lying around. I do have some expensive make-up, but have no problem with my visiting nieces and nephews painting each other's faces with it, once their parents are happy with them doing so.

Why the vitriol and bitterness?

Even those of us with children don't want to hear about other people's children. I would so much rather talk about books, theatre, music, world affairs... literally anything. Obviously ten minutes or so is OK, just not three hours.

I have many childfree friends.

Meet her without DC.

If you don't have kids it's not much fun meeting up with friends when their children are with them.

As a childfree/childless person I'd happily back away from a friendship if what we both wanted didn't align anymore. But I often see so many parents saying they "lost all their friends" when they had children. I think friendships should be about give and take on BOTH sides.

If a parent would rather only be friends with other parents and take their child with them 24/7 that's fine. But they can't then expect their childfree friends to be waiting to pick up where they left off 3/5/10 years later etc.

If a childfree person wants to NEVER see a friends kids that's also unreasonable.

A bit of both normally works best. But if either party is unable to manage compromise then the friendship is probably best not continuing. But I do dislike the tone of most posts that its always the childfree person in the wrong and that they just need to be more understanding.

This is a bit harsh on the friend. Maybe just don't meet up with the toddler but for evenings out instead. What child free person goes out with a toddler? I don't think I ever did before I had kids, my mum friends did that stuff with their mum friends and I did their 'nights off'.

True! She might not ever want children, and she's entitled to like seeing her friend without her child. But OP is entitled to want friends who like spending time with her child as well, if that's what she wants. Some mothers like to be with their children all the time at that age, and that's not a failing. Maybe she didn't mean it to be an insult, or maybe they might both be better suited to different friendships at the moment as they are in different stages of life too.

I am a mother and I agree that this is incredibly rude. I would get up and leave.
OP you need to see your friend without your child, stop talking about him and remember you have a first name - and it's not 'mum'.

Yet again it always seems to be the childfree getting the blame for everything.

I'm childfree/ childless NOT by choice. Pretty much all my friends have children. There are many different ways of parenting and some friendships withstand some versions, others not so much.

I had one friend who was unable to talk about ANYTHING other than her child from day one. I listened to this for 4 years until I started to just pull away. I didn't see her even ONCE by herself in 4 years despite her being married and having parents that would happily babysit. I remember once sitting in a softplay cafe with her, she was staring at her child playing (which I get she needs to supervise him) and we sat in silence for a whole hour. The silence was interrupted by her telling me to watch what he's doing there he's so sweet! If I tried to talk about anything at all other than her child she'd nod and make "hmm hmm" noises but there would be nothing else. I don't see her at all now. And from what I hear she doesn't really have any friends other than other hard core mum friends. She's also struggling now the child is 13 and wants to do less and less with her as he's a teen.

I have another friend with 3 children. We mix seeing each other separately and with the kids. Often I'll go round for an hour for tea, then we'll head out for an early dinner just the two of us, then sometimes if it's before bedtime I'll say bye to the kids for another half hour. I love seeing them but it's also nice to just chat to my friend. While it's just us two she rarely mentions them unless I ask or it's relevant to the conversation. When we've been in groups before and I'm the only childless person there she's really good at redirecting conversation when it's all just about kids or she'll try to at least talk to me about something else.

I'm not saying I don't want to hear about people's kids ever. But it's hard when I'm the only one in my friendship group who wasn't able to have them (only managed 4 miscarriages instead) and it's all they ever want to talk about. Unless those parents that blame the childfree on here think I should just fuck off and find other friends because I'm infertile?
They will often meet as a group with the kids. When I'm not there they can talk about them all they want. I just would like an hour or so on a night out that we can discuss other things. I really don't think that's too much to ask.

If she is referring to your behaviour when you are with your child then she is being ridiculous. When you meet a friend with a toddler you are lucky if you make eye contact, that's how intense toddler supervision is. I'd be more concerned about the patterns of when you meet her. Is it a mix of with or without children? I think both are important. I know some women who won't let partners do bedtime or won't get sitters and insist on being with child 24/7 when not working. If this is the norm for you I think she has a point.