Page 2 | To want to set boundaries with widowed parent and how not to feel too guilty or resentful

GreatSnail · 2024-10-19T06:27:12+00:00

I'll try to keep it brief as possible. My parents split up when I was in primary school and my Dad moved back to his home town hours away from where I still live. He met my Step-Mum within a few months and they were together ever since till she passed away 4 months ago, so 30 years. Step-Mum was a mixed character but very possessive of my Dad and my relationship with her was complicated due to that and that effected my relationship with my Dad so at one stage I had only 'phone contact with him for 6 years. In the last few years Step-Mum became chronically unwell and covid was a thing so I saw my Dad twice in 10 years till Step-Mum died. As soon as she passed away I went to support him emotionally and practically and stayed for 2 weeks. Then I visited again for a few days after another couple of months and have two more visits planned in the next 6 months. Dad calls every day, sometimes 2-3 times a day which i've been happy to go along with to support him but he stresses about things he doesn't need to and often, there are things he could do to make life less stressful for himself but he refuses. I've been happy to step up and help him with things and offer support and visit even though there's lots of aspects of doing that that cause me a lot of stress; because i've been thinking it's early days and things will settle down. But the last few weeks i've been gently hinting that I can't or don't want to talk to him every day and he just hasn't picked up on the hints. So i've said it out loud and it's clear that he's been expecting me to visit every few weeks and talk at least once a day forever, and he's getting really upset and saying he'll have no-one else to talk to and so on. I'm not suggesting I never talk to him, just not every day and that it's still early days and we can talk every day for now but that isn't healthy long-term for either of us. If he was a demanding ass-hole it would be easier but he's not, he's just expressing his fears and vulnerability then I feel guilty and pressured. And the other side is part of me thinks it's a bit of a cheek that he wasn't a particularly involved Father for the majority of my life and now that his circumstances have changed, he's wanting me to be the most important person in his life and for him to be the priority in mine but I don't want to think like that, feel resentful or drag up the past when he's vulnerable. He's not elderly, he's just retirement age. He can look after himself and the house, he drives, has a dog, IMO no money worries but he still stresses about money. He's a lovely man, never abusive or nasty, not ND but very set in his ways. I don't have kids or other caring responsibilities but do work full-time, albeit remotely which makes it harder to be boundaried as he knows I have the time to talk to him every day. Any advice from anyone who has gone through this or advice in general would be much appreciated as i've given it four months thinking he'd naturally need less support but he's becoming more not less dependent on me.

Tiredofthewhirring · 19/10/2024 08:33

My dad ditched us in favour of step mum, but unlike you there's no way I'll be supporting him if she dies first.

You're a saint and he doesn't deserve you.

Original poster

GreatSnail · 19/10/2024 08:32

Redburnett · 19/10/2024 08:18

One thing you could try is keeping a journal. It's inevitable that you will have very mixed and confusing feelings about the situation given that he effectively walked out of your home life a long time ago. Writing down what happens, what he says, how you feel, can help you process it all and perhaps find some resolution.
One thing is certain, the expectations and demands that elderly people make on their DCs only increase as time goes on and they become ever more self-centred and selfish, apparently oblivious to the fact that actually their DC does have a life of their own. You need to prioritise your own MH in all this, and again keeping a journal may help with this. Guilt is so hard to deal with, but writing down what you have done for the relative can help remind you that you have done enough/as much as you can for your own mental health.
Best of luck with whatever you decide.

He didn't walk out.

Short story is he and Mum met when they both teens and Mums family were living in the area Dad was born in, married and had me. When Mums family moved to the other end of the country, we moved too (I was a baby).

FF a few years and Mum had an affair and wanted to separate, all of my Dads family, friends and history was in his home town so he moved back up there and stayed. He did lose everything then met Step-Mum very quickly and built a life with her and I understand why

So I did feel very, very sympathetic towards my Dad for years and hated my Mum for breaking up the family which is an extra layer of emotion and why it's not the case that he abandoned me or anything like that. Though he 100% put Step-Mum first which I don' t think he should have done as a parent and he is not at all blameless in how things went.

OP posts:

DoubleTribble · 19/10/2024 08:31

Bereavement and social clubs seem an excellent idea. It’s a shame that smoking is being a barrier to him maintaining a social life- any chance he’d consider quitting?

FWIW my experience is that men in this situation quite quickly find a new partner- I mean, surprisingly quickly. I don’t know how you would feel about that if it happened?

balzamico · 19/10/2024 08:29

I think I if your step mum was controlling he's probably a bit lost as that will have affected his ability to independently think, plan even socialise.

Try and find some activities he can do - does smoking really have to stop him? Seems a poor excuse to me

Renamed · 19/10/2024 08:29

He could have been the best Dad in the world and it still wouldn’t be right that he was looking to you to meet all his emotional needs. This is selfish behaviour and doesn’t consider you as a person at all, just as his daughter, therefore available.

I was just thinking, imagine you were his son? If he rang you and started to talk about his past relationship you probably wouldn’t listen for hours would you? You’d probably change the subject.

Nothatgingerpirate · 19/10/2024 08:28

Sympathies.
I had to go very low contact with narcissist widowed mother, who thinks I'm here to give her my time and energy while she can emotionally abuse me as she wishes.
At 42, I chose my own life. Only regret is I didn't
"mature" earlier.

turkeyboots · 19/10/2024 08:28

Is there a Men's shed nearby you can take him to when you visit next?
https://menssheds.org.uk/

I miss landlines in this situation, it was easier to tactfully avoid calls.

Home | Men's Sheds Association | UKMSA

We support Men's Sheds Association in the UK. Men's Sheds are community workshops where men can create converse and connect.

https://menssheds.org.uk

PortiasBiscuit · 19/10/2024 08:27

Pumpkincozynights · 19/10/2024 07:52

Ok so I don’t know you and don’t have to sugar coat this.
You say he was a lovely man but he really wasn’t was he?
He left you as a child and never gave you a backwards glance. For all he knew you could have been starving to death or being beaten by your other parent/family.
I sincerely believe that you reap what you sow.
He made his bed and I would leave him to lie in it,
He wasn’t calling you twice a day when you needed him was he?
Me-I’d stop answering his calls. Start by not answering today. Then cut it down to answering every other day. Then less frequently.
What excuse did he give for not calling you? Use the same excuse.
I’ve come across many, many people in your situation- mainly always women because women are socialised to always put the feelings of others before them. I can tell you straight that the ones doing what you are get no benefit from it in the long run. All it does is screw them up even more. Reopening wounds and never giving answers.
He isn’t the father you want him to be.
Pull back for your own sake. Quite frankly he will drop you like a tonne of bricks when he meets his next squeeze.

Yeah, don’t do this. Won’t do either of you any good in the long run.

ForZingyHazelTraybake · 19/10/2024 08:26

SardinesOnGingerbread · 19/10/2024 07:50

I'm interested that your narrative of your Dad suggests that he had no agency in your relationship over all that time. He was so fragile and powerless that this step mother made this terrible rift happen, although he would have of course loved a relationship with you and would have grieved his loss of you frequently. From the outside, this man chose selfishly to prioritise someone over his child to suit himself, and then is fully willing to oh so gently guilt trip you into stepping into the gap left by the last woman. I can understand how sad you must have felt by your father's absence, but I do wonder if you never got round to grieving for the man your father actually is - a selfish bell end who has the absolute effrontery to wring you dry for the tail end of his life without a second thought. He wasn't caring for you before, he doesn't care about the impact on you now. I'm so sorry. That is hard. But not acknowledging that and coming to terms with it may end up being harder in the long run.

One possibility is that he was selfish, another was that he was in an abusive relationship, something that happens to men as well as women.

NotMyDayJob · 19/10/2024 08:24

I'm sorry OP, I don't say this to be unkind, but he sounds like a very selfish man, step mum was his emotional support, and now she is gone he is subbing you in because it suits him. I say this from a place of experience because I am estranged from my father due to his wife and I have no doubt should she never be around he'd be back pretending the last 15 years hadn't happened. Maybe she was abusive and controlling but at some point he made a choice to bit be very present for you and then to assume you'd pick up the mantle when she was gone.

I honestly think you should look into some counselling to support you in setting some boundaries.

Carouselfish · 19/10/2024 08:23

I get it to some.extent. step mother here was thoroughly awful and made it very hard to have a relationship with him. She died in an awful way and since then I have had more of his time, however he has mainly turned to serial online dating. He's on his phone constantly.
I chose to accept that he was a pretty selfish weak.person who didn't stand up to sm for an easy life and who can't function on his own. I wish he was calling me more actually. So, n your case, I'd forgive the past, accept he is generally quite selfish yet for your sanity, arrange a weekly call and fortnightly visit.

IhaveanewTVnow · 19/10/2024 08:22

I’m sorry to read your post OP. My father did the same except my mother had died at the young age of 48. He moved on and prioritised every new woman in his life. He then married and I rarely saw us. She had no children and didn’t understand the child parent relationship. She controlled his access to us. When he died, she moved house and I’ve never heard from her again, including my kids who she knew from birth. Just goes to show she was never interested in us. Your father may be different but you control it.

Original poster

GreatSnail · 19/10/2024 08:22

SprigatitoYouAndIKnow · 19/10/2024 08:09

It sounds like he is trying to replace all of the interaction he got from his wife with just you. You need to be clearer with him, not just subtle hints and ignoring when he says about getting everything he needs from you. You can be firm while being kind, or you will be stuck as surrogate wife for the rest of his life.

I would push him to look into U3A in his area. If he likes gardening, do you have allotments in your area? There is a social aspect and it gets him out doing something. Not an indoor activity, so he can smoke there too.

I have been ignoring it because it's been early days but clearly, i was setting up expectations which i'm not willing to meet forever.

Which is why i'm having the conversations about boundary setting now. It's just easy, hence seeking advice and it's helpful to hear all the different perspectives.

OP posts:

Redburnett · 19/10/2024 08:18

One thing you could try is keeping a journal. It's inevitable that you will have very mixed and confusing feelings about the situation given that he effectively walked out of your home life a long time ago. Writing down what happens, what he says, how you feel, can help you process it all and perhaps find some resolution.
One thing is certain, the expectations and demands that elderly people make on their DCs only increase as time goes on and they become ever more self-centred and selfish, apparently oblivious to the fact that actually their DC does have a life of their own. You need to prioritise your own MH in all this, and again keeping a journal may help with this. Guilt is so hard to deal with, but writing down what you have done for the relative can help remind you that you have done enough/as much as you can for your own mental health.
Best of luck with whatever you decide.

Original poster

GreatSnail · 19/10/2024 08:17

Beamur · 19/10/2024 07:57

I think you're being exceptionally kind and patient. Just be clear that your not available daily for calls if that doesn't work for you.
Don't be surprised if he remarries again quite soon. I don't think he will want to be alone for long.

I've always thought that and with SM being ill over the last few years, was preparing myself for that as he's never struck me as the kind of man who'd do well on his own but we have spoken about it and he says he's not interested in other relationships but that might change.

OP posts:

ivykaty44 · 19/10/2024 08:17

When you get his phone call today, during that phone call, say right dad I’ll call you on Monday tea time. If he suggests a call tomorrow or asks why, just say I have a few things on for myself so I will talk Monday.

it gives you back control and starts the process of setting the boundaries

then if he calls you tomorrow/ don’t answer

Monday let him know you’ll call Wednesday
again if he says anything you let him know I have stuff happening and I can chat Wednesday. Maybe suggest he does some socialising, clubs etc

wednesday say you’ll call Saturday
and don’t answer in between

but ask him when you speak about clubs

Original poster

GreatSnail · 19/10/2024 08:14

Pumpkincozynights · 19/10/2024 07:52

Ok so I don’t know you and don’t have to sugar coat this.
You say he was a lovely man but he really wasn’t was he?
He left you as a child and never gave you a backwards glance. For all he knew you could have been starving to death or being beaten by your other parent/family.
I sincerely believe that you reap what you sow.
He made his bed and I would leave him to lie in it,
He wasn’t calling you twice a day when you needed him was he?
Me-I’d stop answering his calls. Start by not answering today. Then cut it down to answering every other day. Then less frequently.
What excuse did he give for not calling you? Use the same excuse.
I’ve come across many, many people in your situation- mainly always women because women are socialised to always put the feelings of others before them. I can tell you straight that the ones doing what you are get no benefit from it in the long run. All it does is screw them up even more. Reopening wounds and never giving answers.
He isn’t the father you want him to be.
Pull back for your own sake. Quite frankly he will drop you like a tonne of bricks when he meets his next squeeze.

No that didn't happen.

Throughout school I spent a week or two twice a year with him due to distance and school holidays and then into adulthood. In my 20s I had a two bedroom flat and had some lovely visits from him and Step-Mum but then she fell out with me for years and then things were never the same.

But we had contact throughout that time.

He never left me as a child or at all.

Completely agree with what you're saying about women putting other peoples needs above their own and know i'm doing that.

OP posts:

SardinesOnGingerbread · 19/10/2024 08:10

OP you're being manipulated by this man. He sounds passive aggressive and it feels like you've been buying in to this poor old dad story.

SprigatitoYouAndIKnow · 19/10/2024 08:09

It sounds like he is trying to replace all of the interaction he got from his wife with just you. You need to be clearer with him, not just subtle hints and ignoring when he says about getting everything he needs from you. You can be firm while being kind, or you will be stuck as surrogate wife for the rest of his life.

I would push him to look into U3A in his area. If he likes gardening, do you have allotments in your area? There is a social aspect and it gets him out doing something. Not an indoor activity, so he can smoke there too.

HollyTilly · 19/10/2024 08:09

I fully share the views of @SardinesOnGingerbread and @Pumpkincozynights having been there myself.

Original poster

GreatSnail · 19/10/2024 08:08

SardinesOnGingerbread · 19/10/2024 07:50

I'm interested that your narrative of your Dad suggests that he had no agency in your relationship over all that time. He was so fragile and powerless that this step mother made this terrible rift happen, although he would have of course loved a relationship with you and would have grieved his loss of you frequently. From the outside, this man chose selfishly to prioritise someone over his child to suit himself, and then is fully willing to oh so gently guilt trip you into stepping into the gap left by the last woman. I can understand how sad you must have felt by your father's absence, but I do wonder if you never got round to grieving for the man your father actually is - a selfish bell end who has the absolute effrontery to wring you dry for the tail end of his life without a second thought. He wasn't caring for you before, he doesn't care about the impact on you now. I'm so sorry. That is hard. But not acknowledging that and coming to terms with it may end up being harder in the long run.

No, i don't think that at all.

He was weak and took the easy option that made his life easier. I'm under no illusion of how things were or what happened but even when I didn't see him often and when Step-Mum wasn't talking to me, we always maintained contact and he's always been loving and supportive, just not very present.

I'm very aware if I needed the level of support I'm currently giving him, I wouldn't have got it but it doesn't make it easier to put the boundaries down without feeling guilty and I don't want to get into a mindset of you didn't do this so I'm not going to do that because it's not how I want to be or live my life.

I'm glad we have the opportunity now to rebuild but I don't want to be his go-to for everything he needs for the rest of his life.

OP posts:

Original poster

GreatSnail · 19/10/2024 08:02

YouveGotAFastCar · 19/10/2024 07:44

I’d second recommending bereavement clubs, social clubs for older people, coffee meets for older people, etc. He needs to make new friends.

But I’d also consider telling him that your employer has asked you to start going into the office a few days a week from December or whatever. It might be easier for him to start to accept if he doesn’t think you’re choosing not to talk to him every day, and it’s a fairly harmless lie.

Thankyou.

I've already been fibbing recently saying a couple of times I couldn't talk that day as had a meeting in the evening online. That's how the conversation has come about, because he's been saying how that made a big difference to his day and he missed talking so I was gently saying, well we won't talk every day forever anyway Dad and his response was why not? and said he thinks he'll need that always and thought that's what would happen. Then he gets upset and says could we do it still for a few days? or is it okay if I call you tomorrow? and I feel terrible and say I wasn't thinking we have to reduce it now because I didn't meant that, but that we will and should at some stage.

Then he just says okay darling, whatever you think is best and is really reasonable about it but with a shaky voice and I come off the 'phone feeling wretched and then cry. Crying now typing it!

OP posts:

ThePoetsWife · 19/10/2024 07:57

SardinesOnGingerbread · 19/10/2024 07:50

I'm interested that your narrative of your Dad suggests that he had no agency in your relationship over all that time. He was so fragile and powerless that this step mother made this terrible rift happen, although he would have of course loved a relationship with you and would have grieved his loss of you frequently. From the outside, this man chose selfishly to prioritise someone over his child to suit himself, and then is fully willing to oh so gently guilt trip you into stepping into the gap left by the last woman. I can understand how sad you must have felt by your father's absence, but I do wonder if you never got round to grieving for the man your father actually is - a selfish bell end who has the absolute effrontery to wring you dry for the tail end of his life without a second thought. He wasn't caring for you before, he doesn't care about the impact on you now. I'm so sorry. That is hard. But not acknowledging that and coming to terms with it may end up being harder in the long run.

We had this with FIL who was absent for much of his life. He became so demanding (think boiled frog) and really shown the selfish entitled man behind the sweet exterior.

It escalated so much that my DH had to set boundaries very firmly after a row with him when he told him some home truths.

He also was expected to his carer when FIL became ill so watch out.

Beamur · 19/10/2024 07:57

I think you're being exceptionally kind and patient. Just be clear that your not available daily for calls if that doesn't work for you.
Don't be surprised if he remarries again quite soon. I don't think he will want to be alone for long.

Barney16 · 19/10/2024 07:53

It seems like it's still early days so maybe it will naturally improve as time passes. Or maybe he will find a club or hobby that will divert him? Like pp have said maybe a social club, book club. Is there a gardening group in his local area? There's one close to me and whilst I don't go, they meet once a month all year round. What about university of the third age? If you Google it there's groups and events everywhere, they have online talks too. It seems very vibrant.