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What is with the English, affairs, and divorce?

319 replies

BoundaryGirl3939 · 18/10/2024 11:21

Everyday when I visit this website I see a post about a husband having an affair, or a suspicion that he is cheating, or an irritation that he is getting to close to a female friend. I see mumsnet as an accurate description of what is going on in English society, and the levels of infidelity shock me.

I'm Irish, and believe me that the men here are not perfect. We have high levels of addiction (alcoholism) and dysfunction (anger management) but the infidelity is definitely not as commonplace (although it does take place but not as frequently). Yes, Irish marriages/relationships break up, and adults may get a second life partner after a relationship has died, but the actual 'cheating' is not as common and is scandalous if it does take place.

I find it shocking that an average man can contently sleep with another woman, and then go home to his wife and kids. My mind boggles that a woman can feel like she has a right to encroach on another womans husband and take a father from his family.

OP posts:
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IVFmumoftwo · 19/10/2024 21:36

BirthdayRainbow · 18/10/2024 18:08

🙄

I live there. Everyone knows everyone!

StopStartStop · 19/10/2024 07:47

Either Ireland is special and the men are super-faithful, or you just think they are...
They're feckin' shameless! They'll try it on in front of a room full of strangers, when anyone could know their wives. Knowing for sure that no-one will tell on them, especially if they are well known.

Runninglateagaintoday · 18/10/2024 21:57

KendraTheVampyrSlayer · 18/10/2024 21:45

Hmm People that post on here are just as likely to be Scottish or Welsh as they are to be English. Or were you under the impression that the Scottish and Welsh are also English?

Well, not just as likely, because the population of England is much higher.
People post from places other than GB too though (like me).

KendraTheVampyrSlayer · 18/10/2024 21:45

Hmm People that post on here are just as likely to be Scottish or Welsh as they are to be English. Or were you under the impression that the Scottish and Welsh are also English?

Runninglateagaintoday · 18/10/2024 21:27

SafeToUse · 18/10/2024 19:35

Yet another Irish person here to say the OP is talking absolute bollocks. I'm from Dublin, in my 60s, and there were always whispered tales going round in my suburban area about who was having affairs with whom. In fact when we moved to this house many years ago, we were quite surprised to be invited to a "throw the car keys in" night in a neighbour's house. We didn't accept but I learned subsequently that those nights were extremely popular in this neighbourhood.

Perhaps OP isn't quite so aware of any affairs because her family and friends all know how judgemental she is so they don't let on to her?

BTW, my DH is from a tiny rural Irish village and it's an absolute hotbed of sexual shenanigans, always has been!

Really?

I’m Irish and feel like I’m missing out now!!😉

I’ve never come across any hotbeds of sexual shenanigans or ‘throw the cars keys in’ nights out! Not even a hint! Wondering should I feel insulted now?🤔😂

SafeToUse · 18/10/2024 19:35

Yet another Irish person here to say the OP is talking absolute bollocks. I'm from Dublin, in my 60s, and there were always whispered tales going round in my suburban area about who was having affairs with whom. In fact when we moved to this house many years ago, we were quite surprised to be invited to a "throw the car keys in" night in a neighbour's house. We didn't accept but I learned subsequently that those nights were extremely popular in this neighbourhood.

Perhaps OP isn't quite so aware of any affairs because her family and friends all know how judgemental she is so they don't let on to her?

BTW, my DH is from a tiny rural Irish village and it's an absolute hotbed of sexual shenanigans, always has been!

DeanElderberry · 18/10/2024 18:59

In rural and small town Ireland a lot of us do know a lot of us. One of the reason we all enjoy RIP.ie so much - we can trace. I've just remembered the time the a local woman with a cleaning job had a fling with the manager of a business she worked at. Everyone knew. I don't know whether he was married - she wasn't, that didn't stop tongues wagging. I think some people emigrate just to have a little privacy.

Davros · 18/10/2024 18:47

Vergus · 18/10/2024 14:31

I'm Irish. I've had 72 affairs in my lifetime

I'm half Irish and I've had 36 affairs in my lifetime Grin

whynotwhatknot · 18/10/2024 18:37

no Irish women dont cheat ask op she knows them all

MoreCraicPlease · 18/10/2024 18:18

Love how it’s just the English who have affairs, and not the Scottish, Welsh or Northern Irish.

I am Irish and think the OP is wrong!

BirthdayRainbow · 18/10/2024 18:08

IVFmumoftwo · 18/10/2024 17:49

Not sure about. There are places in Yorkshire that almost feel incestuous.

🙄

IVFmumoftwo · 18/10/2024 17:49

Sparsely · 18/10/2024 12:34

I lived in the Norhtern Ireland for 3 years and what struck me was that everyone knew everyone. So when anyone met it they would ask where they were from. After a couple of minutes chat it would always transpire that their 2nd cousin worked with the other one's brother. Then they'd probably go on to find a few more connections they had in common .

This would certainly make you think you're not going to get away with whatever heinous act of moral turpitude had just crossed your mind.

In England, you wouldn't usually try and find common connections because it would be more unusual.

So I don't think it's really a question of motive, more of opportunity.

Edited

Not sure about. There are places in Yorkshire that almost feel incestuous.

JaneJeffer · 18/10/2024 16:51

@BoundaryGirl3939 get back in the DeLorean

mathanxiety · 18/10/2024 16:45

Liv999 · 18/10/2024 13:56

I'm Irish and I know several women who are having affairs/ have had affairs, but no men..🤔

Lol, another old neighbour from Dublin effed off to Birmingham with the local postie, leaving her husband and two children. I have no idea how that ended, but what a cliche.

mathanxiety · 18/10/2024 16:36

ginasevern · 18/10/2024 15:07

I'm not Irish and I don't live in Ireland but there may be fewer cheats because there are fewer people. The population of Ireland is way smaller than England. This would be the case for murders and other statistics as well I assume. I would also imagine that due to the historic strangle hold of the Catholic church, people are more reluctant to get divorced and face a societal backlash. From what I've seen and read, much of Ireland is still quite rural. Everyone knows everyone else and you're likely to have your aunty living down the road. Very few English villages still have "English villagers" living in them so the structure of society in the two countries is somewhat different.

Proportion doesn't work like that.

Ireland is predominantly urban and suburban.

There is little or no backlash for divorce, or living with an unmarried partner, or having a same sex relationship, with or without marriage.

mathanxiety · 18/10/2024 16:29

Nogaxeh · 18/10/2024 11:30

Is there any evidence that this is different between the two countries? Maybe there's simply more shame and less anger about it in Ireland, so it doesn't get talked about and you don't know how much it's happening.

I know that in my part of rural Ireland it feels like it simply wouldn't be possible to have an affair for more than five minutes. Everyone knows everyone it just wouldn't be practical.

But even in Ireland most people live in cities now where it's more anonymous.

Definitely the element of everyone knowing everyone else (slight exaggeration there) comes into it. You'd have to be very circumspect to get away with it.

I remember as a child (mid 70s) sitting in a big tree in front of my house early one summer evening, nicely hidden from view, when I spotted through the leaves a neighbour knocking on the door opposite, the door opening, the woman inside grabbing the man by the arms and snogging him as she pulled him through the doorway. The snogging continued until he managed to push the door shut with his foot (and probably afterwards). My eyes were out on stalks.

The man definitely had a reputation for womanising, I later learned. Having the reputation repelled some and attracted others. The woman from the house opposite wasn't his only conquest. My DM wasn't surprised when I told her.

Someone I knew from school (early 80s) left Ireland and slept her way through several states in the southern US before eventually settling down. She was very open about the affairs with married men, and was also very open about sleeping around while in school. set being said, she was talked about and eyebrows were raised.

DeanElderberry · 18/10/2024 16:10

That reminds me of a Wendy Shea cartoon from the 1980s.

Frame 1 had her pot-bellied O'Brien saying 'they say any true Irishman would crawl over ten naked women to get to a pint'

in Frame 2 'that's not true'

And in the next, double-width frame, he's up on his elbow calling to the naked woman at the end of the line beside him 'hey, Bridie, pass me down that pint!'

we were convinced that Shea knew our boss, but in truth there was more than one of them around.

mathanxiety · 18/10/2024 16:09

Seashellssanctuary · 18/10/2024 11:29

You need to think a bit more logically

Population England 69m
Population Ireland 5m

So as a very rough calculation things are 14X more likely to happen in UK including posting on this forum

Edited

No, that's not how probability works.

MinnieCauldwell · 18/10/2024 16:04

Op has had a lttle hissy fit and popped off now...

GiveMeSpanakopita · 18/10/2024 15:53

BoundaryGirl3939 · 18/10/2024 11:24

I said that it does happen here but it's not as common.

Now I'm just spitballin here but c...could that POSSIBLY be because....people having affairs tend to keep quiet about it?

Davros · 18/10/2024 15:41

Maybe up to a few decades ago when Irish people were very devout it was rare! It's very sad and destructive, but I suspect it's now becoming far more common here!
Devout my arse. It was ILLEGAL to get divorced in Ireland until not long ago. I went to a cousin's wedding in the 1980s, they split up after a couple of years but she had to wait YEARS until she could get divorced. Contraception was ILLEGAL until relatively not long ago, way to keep women shackled while the lads went out drinking

PlantHeadNo5 · 18/10/2024 15:37

coldcallerbaiter · 18/10/2024 15:15

Men are made to be rampant more so due to testosterone but that is the urge only, it’s a blunt instrument of nature. Females are tuned to get the best male they can each pregnancy, so males are often ‘left to themselves’ so to speak.

Can I see your evidence for this? Because of all the scientific information I’ve read on this, it’s very circumstantial and based on theories with no actual biological evidence to back these claims up. As I said, scientists can’t seem to agree on humans and monogamy and whether it’s natural or societal.

And I’m not sure I buy the theory of men wanting to spread their seed, because if that’s the case why do they wear condoms? If they actually wanted to spread their seed they would have loads of kids to pass on their genetics, but they don’t, they just want sex. Wanting sex and it being part of your biological make up are not the same thing.

QuintessentialDragon · 18/10/2024 15:30

Huh? That's bullshit, surely. About the English. I'm not from UK (come from another EU country) and I can tell you, affairs/divorce is just as common there.

Furthermore, it wasn't that much different with the older generations (I'm 36). I have a wide range of friends of different ages/generations and we discussed this very topic a few times. Yes, divorces were much rarer, that's true. 'Obligation', etc. But cheating? Plenty of that. Mayyyybe less than now, but I wouldn't be too sure.

I'll be flammed for this no doubt, but whatever. I don't see cheating as a massive deal. As long as your other half doesn't know and no emotional affairs involved. What you don't know won't kill you. Yes, I did it myself. On solo trips abroad, work trips and some such. It's just sex, I don't think about any of the men, never met them before or after, and don't view it as a big deal. My partner might have cheated on me too, I just don't know any of it and as I don't, why would it bother me.

Helpnifoseeker · 18/10/2024 15:24

Bigcat25 · 18/10/2024 14:09

The Catholic church is a larger draw than others as they don't allow priests to marry.

Being married does not and never has been proof that someone is not a paedophile or child molester, nor a protection for children!

Helpnifoseeker · 18/10/2024 15:17

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 18/10/2024 13:11

An Irish friend told me that in the not so distant past, if a man was having affairs, or ran off with someone else, it was always the wife’s fault, and even the priest would tell her that if she’d been a better wife to him, it wouldn’t have happened.

Thank God they're not like that now! My priests said the very opposite, that I needed to separate from him and make a life of my own. They never , in any way, shape nor form even so much implied I shared any of the blame and put it all on him! I'd say as so much more is known about the different types of abuse these days (and adultery is a form of abuse in itself and usually accompanied by other forms as well, such as gaslighting!) Catholic priests are becoming much more aware of the trauma and damage caused by adulterous spouses to their victims- the betrayed spouse!
The only thing a Catholic, or at least a practising, believing one, will not be given permission by a priest to do, is take up with another person. That is unless you get a Church annulment and then a divorce, then you'd be allowed marry in church again!