DWP Work Coaches to go into MH wards

I worked in psychiatric hospitals for a decade. I dont think it is a terrible idea, if done properly and carefully. There you go.

This would be pure stupidity.

If someone is unwell enough to need care in a mental health ward they are in not in a mental or physical state where they can realistically discuss employment with anyone...the additional pressure would likely affect them negatively and impact their recovery.

Also, people in mental health ward have a right to privacy like any other patient and not to want some idiot from the DWP, who is not a healthcare professional, to force themselves into their room or cubicle and see them at their lowest.

I have ran employability projects (for charities, not the DWP) for people with mental health issues and other complex needs. There are a lot of difficulties when it comes to helping them get back in the workplace, even when they are feeling well enough to work or volunteer. Some have large gaps in their CVs, long period of sick leaves (which puts off employers) and they can often only cope with part-time, flexible work. We used to focus on helping them develop their self confidence and start with volunteering first to ease themselves back into a routine and so they could get recent references. Or we would try to help them do courses to retrain to be more employable. It is not easy and it takes time.

I have also worked with people with severe mental health issues who also had criminal convictions and those are incredibly hard to try to get back into the workplace.

Basically the DWP just showing up and threatening vulnerable people in a ward would achieve sod all anyway...

Cant vote as have mixed feelings. There are people who would be triggered by this so it is not for everybody. But for people whose work situation is a source of stress, I can see that this may feel helpful. Needs to be looked at on a case by case basis and led by patient needs and wants.

Having worked in MH for 25 years, I have to say I see the whole spectrum. From people making themselves more ill by trying to find or stay at work, to people who only come to therapy so they can claim benefits because they are gaming the system. I will support the former to the max. The second lot? There are too many of them.

Nobody is suggesting that the NHS will only be for those able to work.

No, but I'm really wary of this link the government are making between the NHS and jobs. I really don't think we're as far off as all that from suggesting those with no work prospects should go to the back of the waiting list.

Entirely unacceptable
Outrageous that it's even suggested

The evidence showing work is better for people’s mental health. I’m sure for some people it is. But for many people it’s absolutely not true.

My DB has had mental health problems for the best part of 40 years. The only way he can kept relatively stable is by having his anti-psychotic medication administered by depot injection every 4 weeks.

For the first 7-10 days after his injection, he's like a total zombie: slurred speech, very poor short term memory, can't complete sequential tasks etc. Then he has around 10 days or so of being fairly functional before he starts to become hyper and delusional again.

I can't see how work would help him, or what employer would tolerate an employee who's only fit for work around a third of the time.

"The results of getting people into work have been dramatic, and the evidence clearly shows that it is better for their mental health," she said.

A lot of people I know hate their jobs, are very stressed and unhappy as a result, and put up with a lot of unbelievable shit from their employers.

Just loving our wonderful new government!

DWP and work coaches are seen as bad but they are just normal people working a job and being controlled by the governments stupid rules. I’m sure they wouldn’t want to go either.

I hoped a Labour government might change some of this bullsh*t. Clearly not, and they are proving themselves Conservatives in Red. I'll never vote for them again.

I used to do exactly that as part of my job! Sometimes, clients were so unwell they really didn't have capacity to take on board what was being suggested.

Now, most of my referrals are from an NHS-funded specialist service that adopts a therapeutic approach to employment. They only work with clients who feel ready to think about getting back to work and whose MH team believe they are ready to take that step. And they're well enough to be living independently, not in-patients!

Kendall would probably achieve more by expanding such services.

This is disgusting. The attack on the poor and disabled here has gotten ridiculous. It is clearly our fault that the country is shit.

I have been inpatient many times. There were people there that had been on a section for years. What the fuck are they going to put on a CV? And who is going to employ them?

A PP was right, it is employers that need to change their attitudes to people with disabilities, but instead the people with disabilities are being told they are not trying hard enough. If you are disabled, have a gap on your CV, a criminal record (not unusual for people with MH issues), or are above 40 - no one wants to hire you anyway. The finger is being pointed at the wrong people.

The thing is that hospital is for when you are acutely unwell, you are not discharged as cured and ready to work. The treatment is to discharge you when you are stable enough to be treated under community health care or a crisis team. Hardly anyone is well enough to return to or seek work at the point they are discharged from a psychiatric ward or hospital.

Job coaches are good, but they should be outside the hospital setting when the patient is not only stable but well on the road to recovery.

This government insist that anyone with any sort of mental health or pain situation will be better working. They have made it clear that they want to slash the numbers/cost of those on sickness/disability payments.

So, this is the sort of thing they will do.

Job coaches are not therapeutic interventions in any sense of the word.

All the studies used to show that work is good for mental health really show a simple correlation between those that work tend to have better mental health than those who are out of work.

Politicians have weaponised this simple correlation that (duh) healthy people are more likely to work than the unwell into a cause and effect relationship of work makes you healthy that has been disproven time again. It started with the Victorian work cure and this is just the same old bad idea in modern packaging.

It sounds utterly bonkers, but I assume they mean as an opt in support for people who have been treated and are preparing to be discharged. I imagine that's quite a scary moment. You feel better but what happens next for you, how will you manage, what support is there. Someone saying look here's how to fill out forms, cv etc, what to say when they ask about your 6 weeks in psychiatric care.

My brother has been admitted onto a psych ward once and this might have helped. He runs his own business now.

Having read a few articles about this I think this could be really helpful. So many people they get caught in a cycle of returning to hospital. Often they have little structure and routine which is so important to keep many people well.

Having purpose, having structure and achievable goals tailored to induvial needs is a positive move forward. Far to often patients leave hospital and have so little support or focus on their future.

This isn't about working with people who are acutely unwell. Many people with serious MH conditions can work, it has to be work that is suitable, hours that are suitable with levels of interaction and hours that they can manage. With the right support this is a really positive move forward

nobody is going ti be forced to see them.

No, but they can be easily coerced into seeing them.

You lose your PIP if you’re in there over 28 days. I think that is apalling too as many rely on PIP just to help cover rent/bills.

Do they have any idea how ill you have to be to get a place in a ward? Honestly.

Plus I am a bit sick of a defeatist attitude being taken that actually infantilises people with mental illnesses

Indeed. Like assuming everyone with mental ill health have no or few qualifications or work experience and need tips from a "work coach" on how to write a CV.
Probably be more helpful to have a work coach give HR departments tips on how to not discriminate against candidates with illnesses or disabilities or related employment gaps.

Btw where are these job vacancies for everyone currently not in work? There are more people on jobseekers benefits than there are total job vacancies in the UK. That's not including people receiving disability benefits.

Your last paragraph sums up exactly what I have thought for a long time. So many employers won't even interview,let alone employ someone with physical/mental disabilities,and who have gaps in their employment history due to these issues. When the government say things like anyone who is on ESA but is deemed fit to work,hasn't found a job within a year will have their benefits stopped,I find this utterly terrifying. With the best will in the world,someone who is mentally or physically ill is going to struggle to find a sympathetic employer.

OMG do they ever give up? I'm absolutely appalled at this.

Re your first sentence. Not necessarily. Lots of people are in minimum wage jobs and they need in-work benefits because the cost of living isn't being addressed (ironically the cost of living and the consequences for people on low incomes is one cause of mental breakdown).

If the government wants to boost the economy and cut the benefits bill, they would address the cost of living. That actually includes a supportive not punitive benefits system. The current benefits system actually causes mental health breakdowns. That's known.

Also more council housing - bad or insecure housing costs both the benefits bill and healthcare many billions. And as others have pointed out end the false economy approach. Timely access to well-funded and good public services including NHS and social services would prevent people reaching crisis point.

How many people wouldn't have ended up in a mental health ward or become too unwell to work if they'd had access to disability benefits without extreme distress of the current system and if they'd had timely support from other public services? Loads.

Re your second sentence. That's the key word. "Healthy". If someone's too unwell to work, they're too unwell to work.

Finally if the genuinely helpful approach was adopted (ending the false economy one) and people were given the time needed - without extra distress and worry about benefits that makes them more ill, then what? The issue frequently isn't the person looking for work. The problem is employers.

If the government wants to "get more people into work" then why aren't they focusing on employers who practice disability and employment gap discrimination?

@110APiccadilly nobody is suggesting that but unfortunately the position we are in is that we need to get people back to work.

Nobody is suggesting that the NHS will only be for those able to work.

Being economically inactive is, unfortunately, bad for the country.

I can't imagine that the DWP staff will be taken with that idea either. I wouldn't have thought that visiting psychiatric facilities would be high up their list of fun things to do.