Labour are going to crash the economy/jobs market.

Brexit. being out of the single market and customs union and the additional red tape this has introduced is ruining the economy. £4billion a year lost and counting. This needs to be addressed.

Nah, doesn’t help at all and contributes precisely zero to the discussion.

HTH

I agree. It seems half the country is some form of benefits and the rest doesn’t work at all.

@SunriseMonsters thanks, I think I'm in one of these schemes, lgp scheme 😱

Ponzi schemes, i.e. current claimaints funded via current taxes. Only works until you have more claimaints than people paying in. The same setup that scammers often use with fake investment schemes, which always collapse when those wanting to withdraw "their money" (which does not exist because it's already been spent paying off previous "investees", yet they continue to believe they will receive until the scam is revealed and it all falls down, which is inevitable with anything structured in this manner).

It was apparent over 40 years ago that this was an unsustainable system and certainly not one any competent Government would use to finance pensions and that due to demographic changes (population bulge of baby boomers plus rising life expectancy) this would become impossible to fund without it draining tax revenues needed for other purposes: health, education, infrastructure (things that actually increase productivity and generate economic growth and therefore rising living standards).

These "liabilities" (which simply will not be paid for those currently in these schemes and not retired yet, because the UK literally cannot possibly pay them) are held off balance sheet so not even included within the Government's quoted debt figure. If they were the markets would have a fit but I suppose it's obvious to all of those in finance/ economics that at some point (much too late to manage a smooth transition to a sustainable system, of course) these people will have to be told that they're not getting what they think they will get because there's literally no way the UK can pay them what it said it would, which they've paid nowhere near enough to fund even if it had been saved and invested, which it hasn't. Successive Governments being con artists basically, each hoping they'll be out of office before the proverbial hits the fan and someone unfortunate has to level with people on the reality.

No Government bothered to do anything about it and put a sustainable, contribution-based funding system in place as e.g. Australia did to reform their system that was previously like ours, because their Government actually cared about making decisions that were viable for their country in the long term and weren't prepared to continually lie to people and promise the moon on a stick knowing there was not the slightest chance they would ever be able to give it to them in reality.

How is the economy supposed to flourish if businesses keep exploiting people with zero hour contracts and poor conditions and expecting the welfare state to pick it up?

I don't principally agree with the concept of tax credits for working people. If employers can’t pay their staff a decent wage (which is way above NMW) they don’t have a viable business. It’s more complex than that as cost would be passed to consumers but is some ways thats true cost, not subsidised businesses.

There is a lot if free advice online, so small businesses don’t have to be experts - but if you’re responsible for someones livelihood by employing them you should take that v seriously.

It’s likely probationary periods will be much longer with ‘day 1 rights’ and so you’ll need clear expectations and feedback on what is going well/not.

Link to all these cases you’re referring to?

It’s been flat for the past 2 years IME

I CBA to RTFT.

Whilst there are considerations for small businesses, wanting better protection for employees will not trash the economy. What a clickbait thing to post. Trashing the economy is having a budget that doesn’t balance Truss style and that spooks investors, this is a way off that.

Arguably it might be an extra barrier to some recruitment, but it stops a lot of undesirable things (zero hours etc.) which are a drain on the welfare state.

I can remember the 'Winter of Discontent'. Half the country was on strike for one thing or another.

The winter of discontent was 1978-79, not in the 1990s...

Well let’s wait and see then shall we?

Very little of that makes any sense

You clearly understood my post nevertheless.

Musk didn’t fit the bill for the event. That’s been explained. It’s nonsense.

The explanation from Jonathan Reynolds in my Sky link didn't make much sense - at least the interviewer didn't think so.

Yes, laws have to go through a process. That’s not news.

I disagree;

Labour's new deal for workers: A fight postponed?

when the applause dies down, behind closed doors many arguments will continue over many months.
And it’s unclear who will triumph when long periods of consultation close.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c153dzy1kj4o

I do. It’ll finally shut up all the stupid rumours.

TBH I don't think we want to know it!

There are too many workers with extremely unfair terms and conditions in contrast to others who have excellent Ts and Cs with optimum protection. Those with the former tend to be in lower paid jobs and can v
be subject to exploitation. Employees need to be entitled to sick pay irrespective of their length of service. What happens if you break your leg/need an emergency operation ( as examples) after being in the job only afew days. If u don't get paid, what about your rent/mortgage and living expenses? Those people need to receive the same protection as employees in corporate/public services.

Sure, yes, just like that.

Just because Tories were bad, doesn't mean Labour is good. They are both bad.

This Labour government are incompetent. Chancellor who can't or won't listen to anyone. Disaster imminent.

We have to stop talking about 14 years of shit from Tories. It can't achieve anything. We need to move forwards. And these people in office will not achieve this for us, sadly.

Prior to the 14 years, it was far from utopia. I had my kids under the last labour govt. It was utterly terrifying - over full hospital, total neglect. My teacher sibling was badly assaulted in school under the last labour govt and left to work in the private sector.

I accept the tories literally ate themselves. Well, Rishi ousted Boris, caused Truss and then spouted utter shite about national service in the run up to the election.

Very little of that makes any sense.
I don’t care about any Swiftie stuff. T(e news shouldnt either. It’s nonsense.
Musk didn’t fit the bill for the event. That’s been explained. It’s nonsense.
Yes, laws have to go through a process. That’s not news. Labour has a huge majority. It’s nonsense.

I'm so tired of the Tory HQ propaganda machine. It's the same old thread format, over and over and over again.

The Tories spectacularly mismanaged the economy to the point that we are all very much living with the effects of it, and they massively increased national debt. Immigration went through the roof and inflation went nuts. God forbid we give literally anyone else the slightest chance to fix things without the Tories' constant oppressive fake predictions and doommongering.

cardibach
Criticising non issues for the sake of it

I wonder if Swiftie Starmer will feature on BBC News at Ten?

Is it more important than investment, or workers’ rights?

I knew Brexit Britain would be a success already . Although a bit daft not to invite Elon Musk - more embarrassing comms mistakes from Number 10:

Business secretary refuses to say why Elon Musk not invited to key investment summit.
https://news.sky.com/video/business-secretary-refuses-to-say-why-elon-musk-not-invited-to-key-investment-summit-13232808

We still love you Elon Musk, says UK government
https://www.politico.eu/article/we-still-love-you-elon-musk-uk-government-peter-kyle/

On workers' rights much is still going to consultation isn't it?

Why do you care?
Do you really think they were in return for protection?
Donyou really thin’ the protection was unwarranted given what happened in Vienna?
Is it more important than investment, or workers’ rights?
Honestly @Clavinova, you usually make sense even if we disagree, but this is nuts - it just seems desperate. Criticising non issues for the sake of it.

After 2 years you would know if someone is a piss taker though, and got rid beforehand. I think 2 years is too long to acquire rights. About 6 months is about right, long enough to suss out the bad eggs but not too long for the good eggs to wait to get some security

I think what you are failing to understand that in small businesses you cannot dedicate time to performance managing single employees as you will lose money. In building, if you employ a carpenter who says he can do XY&Z and backs it up with photos and videos from previous work but then when he gets to site he’s making lots of mistakes that he shouldn’t be doing. Some of these mistakes are costly to the business owner. He cuts an expensive door too short. He doesn’t have to pay, the client doesn’t have to pay, the business owner does. This happens a number of times over a few weeks. Jobs are no longer profitable due to the new employees incompetence.

Instead of being able to sack him immediately after 4 weeks, we will now have to have an informal chat progressing gradually to a written warning, offer training and support (taking away another carpenter from doing their job) and give chance after chance whilst all the time having to be mindful of their mental health. The business owner is fielding calls from unhappy clients as the work isn’t being done correctly and not to the timeframe so affecting the businesses reputation. Meanwhile the other staff who take pride in their work are unhappy at having to work with the new employee who doesn’t do the job properly. Clients withhold payment until mistakes are rectified, affecting cash flow in the business, meaning suppliers have to wait to be paid and the business owner may even have to loan the business money from their personal account. You get the gist.

It’s completely different to supporting a long standing employee going through some personal issues that are temporarily affecting their performance. They absolutely should have the rights that are currently in place.

Not that normal;

The prime minister was given 10 tickets in total over three concerts

@SunriseMonsters what's the public sector ponies scheme pleaser