Is this going to open a floodgate - weight loss jabs for unemployed

Type 2 diabetes is an interesting one. My DM is 84, overweight but manages her condition pretty well on the whole.

But certainly taking insulin makes her hungry and makes it harder to lose weight.

Your second paragraph demonstrates the type of ‘life isn’t black and white’ thinking that your first paragraph doesn’t.

It’s not particularly progressive thinking to realise obesity is a complex issue, is it?

lol yes

Im sat here on the sofa with my crack pipes and fags. Feet up, watching homes under the hammer.

Cheers everyone!!

One size wont fit all

There are people that medication isnt suitable for. Some it wont have the hormonal effects required and they wont lose weight

Some will keep eating through it because of other issues or compulsions although the research suggests that it supports compulsive behaviours/adhd type impulse control etc

People who have hormonal issues like thyroid which slows their metabolism (Im one of them) can only lose weight eating below their requirement. Its not magic but because the metbolism slows, its hard to eat so little.

People saying 'ive got a thyroid problem and have put on weight eating normally' are slightly missing the point, they're eating 'normally' for someone without a thyroid problem, eating normally for their previous metabolic needs. Their metabolic need has reduced, so they need to eat less. Thats bloody hard if you dont have help with it. You need to take in fewer calories, thats all there is to it.

None of these interventions are foolproof, just like some people dont or cant respond to heart treatments/statins/asthma medication/steroids/painkillers

Some things suit some people and not others, but overall, at the moment, the research and studies about this intervention should give us cause to be hopeful that obesity is treatable. Along with treating by default over 200 possible other disorders which are comormbid.

I think there is also indications that the medication in and of itself, without the weight loss, is positive for prevention of things like dementia, parkinsons etc etc. Not sure on the detail of that though.

The job centres and work programme providers will start monitoring the weight loss of obese job seekers and sanctions will be given to those who did not lose enough weight within a certain time frame set by job centre and work programme providers whose training in weight loss will never materialise and it will all hit the fan.

Personally (as someone who has just lost 6st paying privately for the ‘jabs’, is no longer at risk of diabetes, nor has healthy cholesterol, does have fewer migraines, lower thyroid medication dose, no longer has a fatty liver and am thus saving the NHS a fricking fortune), I think that prescribing free on the NHS would be a great move, so long as the long term data continues to show that there is minimal health risks/complications of course (and a recent study looking at 22k semuglutide and 20k terzepatide users over a 3 year period seems to support this).

I am fit and confident and actually looking to return to work (teaching) after 19years of being a SAHM so will also now be economically active and paying taxes. At my previous weight I was ill regularly, managing chronic joint pain and migraine and had cripplingly low self esteem that standing in fromt of a class of 16-25 year olds again was a fantasy. Now I can’t wait (pun intended).

If people are signed off work with weight related illness/disability, then I think they should be offered a place on the study and, long term, offered it to help them get back to work. My only proviso is that I think it should be managed by the GP surgery and come with complementary diet support (could be an online course) and counselling as the drugs don’t work on their own if you are looking for long term gain.

This kind of topic will of course bring out the kind of people who think every human is 100% virtuous and nobody has ever been fat because of lifestyle choices, and that believing this counts as being progressive.

On the specific topic, I wonder about cause and effect (presumably the study is partly hoping to get some data that might help with this). To what extent are obese unemployed people unemployed because they are obese, and to what extent are they obese because they're unemployed? Not going out to work and sitting at home instead isn't going to do wonders for your weight. (Not, of course, that all unemployed people are physically inactive.) But dealing with the weight problem doesn't necessarily deal with whatever made it hard for these people to find and keep work in the first place.

That is such lazy, Daily Mail, thinking. Educate yourself about the causes of obesity.

This makes me really sad. What state have we got into where people are getting unhealthy and overweight to the extent they aren’t able to do normal everyday activities, and instead of looking at the causes and what’s going wrong in society, we decide that injecting them with drugs is the way to go. I realise that obesity is complicated, sometimes it’s related to medical conditions or you can be genetically predisposed to it, and for some medication gives them the boost they need - great. But so many people are overeating because they are anxious and miserable and bored, because they are working long hours on sedentary jobs to try to pay the bills and are too exhausted to find the energy to exercise or cook healthy food, because unhealthy food is cheap and tempting and is everywhere. I’m lucky to be from a line of people with fast metabolisms but I’m stressed and exhausted, just trying to keep my head above water and pay for basics, and I can easily see that with a different generic make-up I could be piling on weight. Society needs fixing, we need more time and less stress, better access to healthcare, and more human healthcare interactions and care.

There is a huge amount of evidence to say that processed red meat is bad for health:
https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/eat-well/food-types/meat-nutrition/
'Eating too much processed meat and red meat probably increases your risk of bowel (colorectal) cancer.
Processed meat can also be high in salt and eating too much salt can increase your risk of high blood pressure.'

and that is without even considering the weight of evidence on the harms of the additives added to processed meat e.g.
Sodium metabisulphite
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10581848/

There is no point arguing that one ultra processed product is cheaper than another if it is actually worse for your health. I personally avoid all upf but people who choose to eat it need to read labels carefully. Generally when a product is cheaper it will contain less healthy whole food components and more cheap chemicals to preserve it and bulk it out.

Great if you know an underlying cause. But what about the obese people that don’t actually eat a lot? Undiagnosed thyroid problems etc. what about the people that can’t afford to buy decent quality food - junk food is cheap and you don’t need to eat a lot to get fat. What about the people that don’t eat a lot but are obese due to lack of exercise or restricted mobility? What about the depressed people who use food as a crutch? Give them this injection and then what? Wait for their depression to just magically disappear? I hope they address why these people need a weight-loss injection and help them deal with the why. Unfortunately that requires time, effort and manpower.

So full of self loathing that you are projecting out on others.

What are you doing about that?

Looking at the list of ingredients is less than half the issue - you are only highlighting the existence of UPFs.
You need to look at the nutritional label: how many calories per 100g, how much fat per 100g, etc.

Two sausages, a 'normal' pile of mash made with a small dab of butter, and a pile of peas is likely to have fewer calories that the ready-meal equivalent, because ready meals generally contain extra fat in sauces (or in this case in the mash) to pad out the meal and cut down on the cost of the 'real' food ingredients, especially the cheaper ones.
Try draining a ready meal of the sauce or gravy (wash it out in a sieve) and have a look at what 'food' you are actually getting.

I think the point isnt about whether something is either tasty or nutritional

The claim was made that junk/ready meal foods are cheaper than buying ingredients to make a meal

That depends on what the ingredients are, how many you are cooking for and what their intake needs to be

You could feed a family of 4, on 4 very cheap ready meals that are a pound each. That is feasible, Costing 4 quid total

You could buy a bag of sausages, the peas/tin of peas and bag of potatoes, or ready oven chips. You could feed 4 people on that, I dont know the costs, perhaps that would also be 4 quid. Then the oven cost, then the time taken, perhaps

You coujld get much much cheaper and buy a bag of lentils, bag of pulses, chop up loads of veg, get lean chicken, I think for 4 people, it may well even out, havent done the numbers because the chicken will increase the cost a lot even though the lentils are cheap. But you need kids that will eat lentils, veg and chicken. You need time to make it taste nice, you need all the spices or herbs and know how to do that to make it taste nice. Otherwise your carefully costed and cooked up meal ends up in the bin with hungry angry kids.

Although kids shouldnt be weaned on the sort of junk that gives them an appetite for it.

Agree. The ready meal is cheaper if you're cooking for one. And that's without thinking about whether cheap sausage and mash is actually healthy. Eating sausage and mash, or equivalent every night isn't going to help people lose weight.
Healthy food is expensive. Healthy food for 1-2 people even more expensive. Eating habits formed before people start families can easily carry on after having kids.

Another contributing factor is families not eating together. I love the days when all four of us eat dinner together - I can make a healthy meal that all four of us enjoy (VERY limited number of those). But the realities of my life (and I'm fairly privileged as I mostly WFH) mean my kids need to eat before my husband is home. Which means 2 meals. This has lead to poor food choices.

What mournjaro is doing for me currently is forcing me to make better choices, I'm having to try to find more options that all of us will eat, or I eat with the kids and my husband can own his own poor choices. I'm changing habits, only time will tell if that works long term after mounjaro. I'm quietly confident at the moment, but that's easy because I'm not hungry!

I agree there’s an element of planning in cooking rather than eating ready meals or takeaways (though not much planning, frankly).

But since so many on MN appear to know lots of people who live on Maccies and KFC, eating bangers and mash more than once a week doesn’t seem any hardship by way of sameyness. And that’s assuming it’s a single person.

A friend made me a roll with fishfingers and mayonnaise recently. A filet o’ fish in all but name! And costs hardly anything.

It works the other way too. There's also loads of projection from people assuming that everyone here to debate this has bad intentions and look down on/despise/feel superior to fat people and don't want them to be thin. In fact most women are affected by diet/weight issues, whatever their size.

its really obvious the Op has no clue what they are talking about.

They have seen the story and just reacted with negativity. Maybe that’s worth examining Op. Why this has caused such a reaction from you.

Are you honestly telling me there is no other way for people to lose weight than state sponsored weight loss jabs??

”I suggest you do some research” is such a mundane mumsnet term for people that can’t really be bothered making an intelligent point but can’t help but stick there nose in on a thread.

What are the most common side effects of Ozempic?

The most common side effects of Ozempic are listed below. Tell your healthcare provider if you have any of these side effects that bother you.

• Nausea
• Vomiting
• Diarrhea
• Stomach pain
• Constipation

What are the serious side effects of Ozempic?
While less common, the most serious side effects of Ozempic are described below, along with what to do if they happen.
Severe Allergic Reactions. Ozempic may cause allergic reactions, which can be serious. Stop using Ozempic and get help right away if you have any of the following symptoms of a serious allergic reaction.

• Breathing problems or wheezing
• Racing heart
• Fever or general ill feeling
• Swollen lymph nodes
• Swelling of the face, lips, mouth, tongue, or throat
• Trouble swallowing or throat tightness
• Itching, skin rash, or pale red bumps on the skin called hives
• Nausea or vomiting
• Dizziness, feeling lightheaded, or fainting
• Stomach cramps
• Joint pain

• Headache
• Crankiness or anxiety
• Hunger
• Dizziness, or confusion, or drowsiness
• Blurry vision
• Slurred speech
• Sweating
• Feeling jittery or shakiness
• Fast heartbeat
• Weakness

Vision Changes. Ozempic may cause your vision to worsen when you start using the medicine or start a higher dose. Tell your healthcare provider if you develop new vision problems. If you have a condition called diabetic retinopathy, your vision may temporarily worsen when you start Ozempic or a higher dose. Make sure that you keep all appointments to have your vision checked.

Kidney Damage. Kidney damage can happen when using Ozempic, especially if you have nausea, vomiting, or diarrhea, which can cause dehydration. Try to drink water to avoid dehydration. Call your healthcare provider right away if you have any of the following symptoms of kidney damage.

• Reduced need to pee
• Swelling in your feet, ankles, or legs
• Weakness or unusual tiredness
• Difficulty catching your breath or chest pain/pressure
• Confusion
• Nausea
• Seizures

• Fever
• Your skin or the whites of your eyes turning yellowish in color (also called jaundice)
• Pain in your upper stomach area
• Stool (poop) that is clay-colored

What are the most common side effects of Mounjaro?

The most common side effects of Mounjaro are listed below. Tell your healthcare provider if you have any of these side effects that bother you.

• Nausea
• Diarrhea
• Decreased appetite
• Vomiting
• Constipation
• Upset stomach or stomach pain

What are the serious side effects of Mounjaro?
While less common, the most serious side effects of Mounjaro are described below, along with what to do if they happen.

Severe Allergic Reactions. Mounjaro may cause allergic reactions, which can be serious. Stop using Mounjaro and get help right away if you have any of the following symptoms of a serious allergic reaction.

• Breathing problems or wheezing
• Racing heart
• Fever or general ill feeling
• Swollen lymph nodes
• Swelling of the face, lips, mouth, tongue, or throat
• Trouble swallowing or throat tightness
• Itching, skin rash, or pale red bumps on the skin called hives
• Nausea or vomiting
• Dizziness, feeling lightheaded, or fainting
• Stomach cramps
• Joint pain

• Swelling or a lump in your neck
• Hoarseness
• Trouble swallowing
• Trouble breathing

Low Blood Sugar (Hypoglycemia). When used with insulin or other diabetes medicines that increase your body’s insulin levels, Mounjaro can cause low blood sugar. The doses of your other diabetes medicines may need to be changed when taken with Mounjaro. Call your healthcare provider right away if you have any of the following symptoms of low blood sugar.

• Headache
• Crankiness or anxiety
• Hunger
• Dizziness or confusion
• Blurry vision
• Slurred speech
• Sweating
• Feeling jittery or shakiness
• Fast heartbeat
• Seizures

• Reduced need to pee
• Swelling in your feet, ankles, or legs
• Weakness or unusual tiredness
• Difficulty catching your breath or chest pain/pressure
• Confusion
• Nausea
• Seizures

Vision Changes (Diabetic Retinopathy). If you have diabetic retinopathy, your vision changes may get worse with Mounjaro. Call your healthcare provider if you notice any of the following vision changes (new or getting worse).

• Loss of central vision, which is used to read or dive
• Not being able to see colors
• Blurry vision
• Holes or black spots in your vision
• Floaters, or small spots in your vision caused by bleeding

• Stomach pain
• Fever
• Pale-colored stool
• Yellowing of your skin or eyes

This is going to be an interesting social experiment if it happens. Has the potential to go very wrong or very right.

They need it to support them to eat less. It really isnt complicated

I need the patches to stop smoking
I need the methodone to stop using heroin
I need the antabuse to stop drinking

Its the stopping of the substance that is the treatment in and of itself. That is the aim.