To think it’s really hard to keep a child with a large appetite an appropriate weight

Mine hovers around the top end of the healthy BMI. I grew up with a lot of food restrictions which basically resulted in me being overweight. So we’ve taken the self regulation approach.

At nursery though they used to give out stickers for finishing your food and then because she had polished off her lunchbox they would tell me she needed more food. I only found out about the stickers at the end of nursery but it’s taken a few years for her to leave food if she doesn’t want it. I wish they would leave kids alone and let them decide how much they want, really screwed up her appetite for a bit.

She still has a big appetite, she does a lot of sport and is otherwise fit and healthy. I have started saying no to a few more things now and I think as time goes on she’ll probably drop a snack. I’m sort of trying to keep her weight steady rather than reduce it by making sure she’s getting enough exercise and focusing on protein. Some children are driven more by food than others, DD’s best friend at nursery had to be coaxed to eat every bite, DD was the exact opposite.

To be fair she does sometimes choose fruit over chocolate and she does have a stash of sweets at home she forgets about (collected from parties etc that just end up in a box or the fridge) etc I tried not to make food too loaded for her and I don’t think any good comes from going on about food too much or restricting in an obvious way. It also has to be whole family, everyone eats similar things no special rules for individuals etc.

I think protein and fibre for breakfast is really helpful, yogurt, cheese, eggs, milk, oats rather than sugary carbs like cereas.

I would be asking the school to review whether the stickers are supporting healthy lifestyles as for your DD they are encouraging her to eat more food even when she is full

Healthy fat and protein are needed to feel full. Meals without a good balance of fat and protein will leave your daughter feeling hungry. Snack, do fruit and protein eg apple with peanut butter (coincidentally the only way I will eat peanut butter) or a handful of nuts.

Carbs in fruit, vegetables and grains (eg rice) are fine because they are accompanied by fibre. Carbs from bread and crackers / crisps are not, so they're not filling.

Fibre, fat and protein are what you need.

Well the sweetcorn and tomatoes is a good addition! And yes, you did say he was having the chicken satay so I guess he gets good protein. It is hard. The fruit is a big win!

My now adult children are both ND with food issues. One undereats and eats only very unhealthy stuff. The other has this thing where she cannot tell when she is full, however she eats very healthy foods. As a child she would eat until she was sick. I had to battle mother inlaw overfeeding her behind my pack (she literally gave my dd an entire pack of biscuits one day for example. Both of them have an issue with textures.

You are going to have to excercise portion control for her whilst you still can. Rather than bran flakes for breakfast I used to give mine Weetabix Protein Crunch which have a similar if not less sugar but more protein (This was mostyy for ds as we had to try and get protein in in somehow. I get the difficulties when you work. So did we and other people would feed them crap which for dd made her put on weight and for ds made him lose weight as a bag of crisps would fill him up so he wouldn't eat anything else! If I gave them crisps it was a handful of pom bears/frazzles/french frieson a plate with a sandwich and salad veg, not a whole bag of Walkers!

I've not read the whole thing sorry but as a kid who struggled with weight and exercise was all about competitive sport, could you try and introduce space for activity for its own sake, so no rules or competition or no worries about what anyone else is doing but just the pleasure of a long brisk walk or bike ride, yoga or swim, maybe some weights but not about who can lift the most, just healthy habits with no comparison. Food wise, this has probably been covered but get her learning to cook and keep very limited junk. Long term appreciation of good food over crap, a balanced diet and a curiosity for using fresh ingredients. Obv not an overnight project but if she loves food, focus this in a healthy way

I also recommend ultra-processed people. There is overwhelming evidence that UPF is the leading cause of obesity, evidence that is deliberately being obfuscated by the huge industry behind these foods. An obesity epidemic arrives in every country where UPF becomes the main source of food. This is not just "the latest scare" - obesity simply did not happen on a large scale before the introduction of these foods. Most of the health advice including food "scares" since then has been manufactured by companies that produce UPF yet are somehow in advisory roles to the UK government when it comes to healthy eating. You couldn't make it up.

UPF is often marketed as healthy: consider flavoured "low fat" yoghurts, cereal bars, "high protein" processed meat sticks of all kinds, "sugar free" options, "healthy eating" ready meals etc. It's all junk food.

UPF doesn't affect everyone equally, some people may be able to eat only UPF and manage their weight much more easily, but genetics mean that in others UPF really interrupts the ability to regulate appetite and weight. We are animals and hunger is a powerful signal we simply can't ignore!

I would work on cutting down UPF, and not worrying about portion control so much so long as your daughter is eating nutritious mostly non-UPF foods. It's almost impossible to exclude UPF entirely but I think cutting down to 20% UPF would be a great target. That may mean replacing the meals she has at school, even though they are portion controlled they could be affecting her appetite / need to snack at different times of day.

I want to repeat, there was no obesity epidemic prior to the introduction of UPF. It is the cause. Nothing about human nature has profoundly changed so that we're all suddenly fat, lazy greedy bastards who can't regulate our appetites. It's UPF. The narrative that we need to "move more" or just will ourselves to eat less can literally be traced back to Nestle, Coca Cola, Unilever who make these foods.

Porridge is the easiest healthy breakfast in my opinion! Very filling.

Not at ours, portions are good. Not far off what we do at home.
eg on roast dinner day it’s 3 roast pots, mixed veg portion, yorkshire pudding and meat, gravy. With a pudding which can be something like a doughnut (normal size) or serving of Eaton Mess or similar. Not saying that is especially healthy but the portions are not small.

It must vary hugely by supplier, ours are cooked on site and it’s a small school (65 kids roughly).

I thought there was a problem in the UK with lack of fibre in people's diets theses days. My two have bran flakes but they are teenagers. My DD sometimes has it with Greek yogurt but I don't think young children are that impressed by greek yogurt.

I do agree with you OP. It’s really hard. If it wasn’t then there wouldn’t be so many obese adults either. I read ultra processed people this summer and as a result, we have removed almost all ultra processed foods from our household. There are a couple of exceptions - Oat milk as we have a child with a dairy allergy and vegan mayonnaise and spread. The occasional flavored yoghurt. It’s hard to do 100% and of course we accept that our control over school, parties etc is limited.

No more shop bought bread, cereals, biscuits, crisps etc. I think it’s the overconsumption of these nutritionally bereft processed carbs that is one of the problems. We don’t have sweets or chocolate in anyway, but do allow it at a party or special occasion. We do allow sweet treats when out so usually on a weekend we might buy a cake at a cafe or similar. ideally something homemade rather than packaged. My DC are not overweight but you could see that anything processed disrupted their portion control, blood sugar, cravings etc. I would suggest that this might be something to look at?

The portions are tiny.

They get maybe one chipolata sausage, a tablespoon of veg and maybe a scoop of mash.

Then they're given a small cookie or muffin.

I feel your pain @OP. My eldest is the sane at 6 and has no off button. I batch cook nutritious meals for the week ahead on the weekends that are a good mix of protein, fibre and carbs but give my little one an inch and they'll go the mile until they're sick. I've tried letting them gorge until they're sick so they make a connection with that but it's the same thing again the next day if I allow it. Have you taken your Dd for a blood test?

Ah OP, I so feel your pain. Mine was the skinny kid and the nurse had us doing 7-day food diaries. I used to be "that mum", begging pre-school, school, etc to stop offering sweets and snacks. They had no idea how many extra nutrient-free calories they were handing out. Fancy cake with buttercream and a chocolate on top. Two bourbon biscuits and a cup of hot chocolate. A mini chocolate bar. A carton of pure fruit juice. That could be my child's entire daily intake.
Yep, as the parent you're in control. As the parent, I was known as the one who stopped the birthday sweets and got the snack switched to toast and milk. Big bad meanie me. It's not a comfortable role.
Your kid is unusual, and most parents won't understand.
Breakfast top tips:
Branflakes and milk has a mix of carbs, protein, fat. If I thought there was a blood sugar issue, I'd serve 15-20g branflakes with 100g plain Skyr mixed with 100 ml wholemilk. But cornflakes were my goto cereal - I wouldn't demonise branflakes but they weren't top.
A fried egg takes one minute or less, if your child likes them, but that's only a twice a week thing.
Definitely porridge, which is surprisingly high in both protein and fat, and add a dollop of plain skyr again. Porridge takes a minute in the microwave. A handful of frozen blueberries chucked in for entertainment value.
The 7-day diary is not for the faint-hearted, but it can be useful reality check: yes my kid did attend three birthday parties that week. Yes grandma offered cake, neighbour shared doughnuts, and auntie made smoothies every single day, adding a whopping 700 calories and 150g sugar to the menu. And don't get me started on school fetes, dance class fundraisers, and church charity stalls...

We had an extremely healthy diet as kids in the 80s and 90s -my mum didn't even buy fruit juice. I really appreciate what she was trying to do. But now my sister is morbidly obese and although I'm a healthy bmi, I've had four teeth extracted (because I had eaten so many sweets/drink so much fizzy drinks etc as a teen and young adult). It's so hard to know how to get the balance right as parents!

I think this too. Bread has very little actual nutrition unless it’s the very grainy versions.

Give less bread and baked goods and more protein. I think some people have a tendency to overeat wheat based products and put on weight. I noticed this in some members of my family, including dc1.
As soon as I cut out snacks of toast and croissants, the weight dropped.
The odd cake or doughnut makes no difference to dc1's weight now.

None of that is too bad for them op; it’s the donuts etc that are the issue.

On that meal I’d be more worried about Dc3! Did he eat cheese and wrap ? It’s fine now and then , but he needs veg and better protein. Are there raw veg sticks he will eat? One of mine used to eat a pile of these rather than cooked veg and the rule was if they didn’t eat the veg served they had to have these. But we did what you do and just served it all up regardless and it didn’t take that long before they kind of joined in. It was helped by an older Dc who used to say “ why do you have such an under-developed palate?!😀”

Blimey OP I really wouldnt bother with a chilli if its that much faff, try and find things that you dont need to have so much angst over.

Even if that involves some degree of processed food and I notice many on this thread dont seem to know the difference between processed and UPF

Its become the new scare.

Just give them smaller portions, or portions they need according to their weights. Children also do need carbs, fat and protein, they cant have diets like adults do with very few carbs but make them from lentils/pulses, grains rather than things like bran flakes which are a bit empty.

That's interesting. My youngest is still at primary and only has a school dinner once a week when they do a roast, she doesn't like the other options (worse luck for me as I don't love making packed lunches..! But it is a massive plus in that I can ensure she's eating relatively healthily.) We look at the menu each week in case she changes her mind and they usually seem like quite calorie dense foods especially for families like ours who don't eat meat (pasta bake, pasties etc). Do all schools ensure the meals are a certain number of calories? I guess they must do it through portion sizes - but maybe that is problematic as a friend of my daughter who has school dinner every day has told me that they get the same amount in year 5 as they did in reception, even though I'm sure their nutritional needs must be different? I wonder if that could be part of the problem for the littler ones.

My DD is 5, eats like a horse but is a skinny bean (age 2-3 waist but age 5-6 height). She’s also naturally quite lazy.

We control portions of non healthy food and allow unlimited healthy foods. It’s not hard. DD fortunately loves salad veg, fruit, yoghurt so it’s not difficult.

We don’t say no to anything but she’s allowed one doughnut not 4.

I was like your greedy DD - I grew up in the 70s/80s, with 2 sisters, small age gaps, so similar ages. My Mum would give all 3 of us the same food, but I always felt hungry, whereas my sisters would be happy with what was put in front of them. I can remember crying because I was so desperate for more food, even though I'd eaten the same as my sisters, and then I'd eaten the one spare fish finger available, so I'd actually eaten more than them. (Fortunately?) my parents had no money, so there was literally no spare food in the house & my mother had to be strict with portion sizes. Even then though, I was always the slightly chubbier one of the 3 of us, both my sisters were skinny.

And now as an adult, I'm always hungry, and I always have a tendency to eat more than I should - I have managed to keep within a normal BMI but OMG the hunger.

I'm so relieved that my own 2 DC seem to be able to eat to satiation and then stop, so they just stay within a normal BMI without feeling hungry all the time

Also, its no good berating OP for school dinners and telling her to go in and challenge them or check them or ask about them etc etc, school dinners are what they are, often beige crap, they wont change