To be surprised at how 'together' commenters appear to be

Jeez ‘deluded’? I’m middle aged and of the generation you’d think would be regressive but quite a lot of our friends and family have decent, intelligent men who do their bit and care for their wives. My late father was 90 and still cooked and cleaned. The attitudes on this thread are baffling to me!

I'm absolutely fine sleeping in a bed that my best friends or my mum has slept in, but not someone's random house guest from the previous weekend.

I don't give an F if someone smokes week, even around their kids, if they're a seasoned smoker and can still look after them properly, but other drugs I won't be around them at all.

Of course if you know a guest is coming you change the bed, but when I was young there were times when you missed the last bus and you just slept in whatever bed was available.

The other thing is that on certain topics, people can be 'extremists' of that topic so in housekeeping you have housewives who are very invested in keeping the place clean, in 'relationships' you have extremely bitter divorced women, etc. YABU is for people who like a big fight so you always have to take into account whom you're talking to.

Things have changed since I was young.
It's true that I don't know of any families where the tiniest children call for their dad when they're ill - mum is still always primary parent for the babies and toddlers - but I know a lot of families who when they list out what each does it seems equal or even that the man does more.

I hope so. I hope my perspective is just skewed by the people I know because it’s just depressing! Especially when I have two daughters.

I know more people than that who have an equal relationship.

claim their partners never look at porn. 99 percent of them are deluded.

Mild thread diversion ... One of the things I liked about my very normal (I thought) second husband was that he wasn't interested in porn. It never occurred to me that, instead, he might have a prostitute habit and be fond of live sex shows 👀

Delusion can take many forms!

That said, I am thankful for MN because it has raised the relationship bar for me, personally. Reading about others relationship expectations has empowered me to fight a bit more for equality in my own relationship. I now do about 70 percent of the parenting, life admin, planning and emotional labour, rather than the 99 percent I used to. It’s taken me years to get to that point. Bizarrely, my family all think I’m some sort of feminist and are aghast at how much my partner does 😵‍💫. My old school and uni uni friends and work colleagues the same age are in the same position as me - fighting for equality but making incredibly slow progress.

Honestly, if it wasn’t for the pay gap I would leave and never go back to men.

I think the women on here who say that they have equal relationships are like the women who claim their partners never look at porn. 99 percent of them are deluded. I know only two couples who have anything like an equal relationship and I know people from ALL sorts of backgrounds.

Good point! We modelled it to my son and he’s the equal-or-more domestic one in his home now. But it’s the girls who need to be coached on how to navigate the patriarchy. It’s such a culture shock for them once they’re out in the world. However much you prepare them they never get over the trauma of being cat called in school uniform…That’s why I think it’s important to teach your daughters to have a high bar and not tolerate male bullshit.

But with clean sheets though, surely!

When it comes to bed linen I am a natural slob too.

If my sheets are changed once a month that’s a good month!

Yes I try and avoid these people and I would admit it to anyone- however I was not brought up middle class I was brought up in a very chaotic shouty and at times violent working class household where my parents would rage and scream and say awful things to each other and my dad would occasionally punch my mum in the face. They were the emotionally disregulated ones and I was not allowed to be, no angry outbursts for me, they were for my parents. My dad once hit a child that a group of us were hanging around with because this child was screaming in that annoying way that some kids do and he didn't like screaming kids. Aged 2 I apparently stamped my feet in anger or frustration and he immediately hit me and they both thought that was such a good thing as I never did that again or had a tantrum. So, do i want my child anywhere near anything like that or any families like that - fuck no I don't as I was a terrified and anxious child always ill because I was so stressed and never knew what i was going home to.

I also had a mentally ill grandmother that i was left with, and who I had to call the police on as she was attacking my mum.

I do think most posters are presenting true opinions. But only relative to the post at hand. For example, I am zero tolerance on drugs, I have a 50:50 relationship, zero tolerance for aggression, low screen time for DC etc.. so in posts relating to these things I would appear ‘together’. But… you don’t see on that post that I like a glass of wine most evenings, that sometimes I struggle being a parent, I’m battling anxiety and that I would have no issue climbing into a bed my mate had slept in 😂
Different strokes for different folks, no one is perfect.

Such an interesting thread!

I thought I was fairly 'normal' until MN put me straight.

I'm actually a natural slob it seems 🤔

I have to put notes on the calendar to remind myself to change the bedding every month.

I have a cleaner every fortnight and don't do any other cleaning (unless visitors are due).

I get the exterior of the car washed twice a year, interior once a year.

I am a perfectly able cook, but can't be bothered since kids left home, so eat lots of things on toast or ready meals.

I can easily polish off a bottle of wine in a sitting.

I've made my peace with it though - and I do have a full, balanced life. I'm content.

Yep

Honestly this.

I didn't even know it was a thing not to give your guests clean sheets. And I'm not trying to sound like a dick.

As PP said, MN is often an eye opener.

Don’t worry. I post here and have no issue sleeping in beds others have sleeping in, find social drug use very normal and while my career is ok, finances could be better (all my own fault) and I have always had a shit show of a romantic life (and so involuntarily childless as a result) so no, not all of us have our stuff together!

This.

I also assumed most people on MN didn't have their shit together. Especially the bitchy, judgemental ones (and there is alot of them) - they just seem miserable.

I think there are women who, whether consciously or subconsciously, will socially avoid anyone who doesn't fit the nice middle class family ideal or who has a slight whiff of dysfunction or a little hint that all might not be well. For example, my DH had a period of extremely bad mental health following a bereavement and our marriage went through a bad patch, and we've also had a vulnerable relative staying with us for long stretches here and there (i.e a month at a time not just a few days), and it's as if some of the other mums in NCT/church just instinctively knew to distance themselves even though I myself came across as quite cheerful and don't really mention my problems. Some people have a very sharp social antenna for any kind of dysfunction and naturally keep away. In a way I don't blame them - I think on one level a very prudent strategy for keeping away from drama and having a peaceful life, and also ensuring that you are your kids aren't exposed to anyone who's life goes outside a certain perimeter of "acceptable" behaviour/life experience.
It's not how I roll personally but I think it's quite a common mindset among middle class parents although I don't think anyone ever admits to it.

This isn't real life at all. I feel like I'm kind of underrepresented on here in that I'm a childless benefits claimant who smokes pot every day.

I remember a recent thread where there was a heated debate about whether it was disgusting for married couples to share the same bath towel. 🤣
Yeah, I sleep with them, fuck them, kiss them but I won't share a fucking towel with them.

Don't take this as the world. But the good thing is most people are ultimately trying to be helpful and supportive to other women. No matter what background. X

Yes, completely agree with this! And also we go through stages when some things are going well and times when those same things are a bit of a mess really.

For example, our DD went through a very long moody phase as a teenager…like several years. Bit of a shock because DS’s phase had lasted about two months so we thought we knew what we were doing with teenagers 🤣. I spent several years feeling like a really rubbish mum, because the moods and disdain seemed like they were here to stay and I couldn’t see how we would ever have a decent adult relationship. Fast forward several years (she’s 24 now) and she’s lovely and we have a much closer relationship than I had ever thought possible when she was 16/17. She even apologised for it when she was 22! Anyway, the point is that I wouldn’t have dreamt of weighing in on any discussion about teenagers, parenting or anything like that during those years because I didn’t feel that I’d have anything to offer and would have felt like a hypocrite. These days I might just say something though, especially if it would encourage someone stuck in the weeds with teenagers that things are very likely to change.

Most people don’t offer advice on things they feel aren’t going well in their own lives and so you don’t get a true picture. We’re all just winging it really aren’t we??

Yes everyone has their own demons.