Being vile to 111

I understand that it has been designed this way for a reason. But there are trade offs and this is one of them.

There are alternative ways of designing a service like this (for example, use more experienced staff who don’t need to use an algorithm).

It is not ethical to work for a system you don’t believe in and can’t change. Why are you there if you don’t endorse it? I know it sounds rarified but ultimately your integrity matters.

Hi@111hell I just wanted to post a huge thank you to you and your colleagues for doing such a hard job.
On the occasions I've had to call we have been relieved to hear a calm voice and gotten the help we need. We are always polite and thankful. Hats off to you it must be tough when people are rude.

How is any of this red tape ?

I’m sorry but the last time I spoke to 111 they were AWFUL.

we waited 16 hours for a referral to the out of hours GP when we knew DC had scarlet fever and needed antibiotics (other DC had it at the time)

In the end they gave us an appointment over an hour away, refused to make one any closer (when we live 20 minutes away from a treatment centre) and the appt they have was at 3am. They told us if we didn’t accept the appt we would have to start the process all over again. Answered the same questions about 5 times all to different people. It was beyond frustrating and so stressful.

I am a student nurse myself and never take it personally if someone is rude. I always think if I was confused/getting conflicting information/in an uncomfortable bed/getting poor sleep/too hot/couldn’t shower easily/didn’t like the food etc…. You wouldn’t want to know me!

im not saying people have a right to be rude but we all have our own circumstances and sometimes we don’t always show people our best side

There’s a current thread about how the OP’s teen daughter stormed out of the GP surgery and told the GP she wasn’t good at her job. Apparently because the GP was probing with questions the girl didn’t think relevant. Some of the replies there made it much clearer as to why GP’s are leaving the profession in droves. You’re not alone OP, the general public get more entitled every day. Presumably lots of them watch programmes like Holly and Casualty and think people actually do talk to healthcare professionals the way they depict on TV !!

We are an NHS family but one massive issue I have with 111 is the lack of autism awareness. I have a non verbal DS very high needs in a fully specialist school and no matter how clearly I explain this they always ALWAYS push me to give them answers I don’t have and he can’t tell me.
Pushing me to ask him questions when I’ve already explained he has severe learning disabilities and can’t speak or communicate.

What is red tape about wanting to know a caller’s current location? Callers ring us with health concerns, they may need an ambulance so we need to know.

Sorry that happened. You should have called back and complained about her attitude. The call would have been listened to and you would have had a response.

And? OP asked 'why are people so awful to 111'? Your response - highlighting all the red tape involved - perfectly answers that question...

Done! They said they leave it on the file so fingers crossed they get it! Thanks ☺️

No just ring 111. It tends to be quiet weekday daytimes.

That’s interesting because I once called them in the middle of the night in a panic as my DC was so ill and the woman who answered was the most unsympathetic, unprofessional person I’ve ever dealt with.

She was so bad I told her I’d wait till the morning and take my chances. She was shocking. I’ll never phone them again. I’ll just go straight to A&E.

Oh yea I’d love to do that- so I have the number they rang from - would I just ring this? Im in West Yorkshire. I want to thank her as I don’t think I would have taken her in without her saying for me to, and turns out it was broken and they made the right call!

@Sensiblyplease hope your dd is doing OK. Good to hear a positive outcome
You can go on careopinion.org.uk and follow a flow thing to give feedback on your call and treatment.

I hope your daughter is making a good recovery.

We never find out what happens after the callers have left the 111 system. Unless you’ve done something wrong.

You can thank them by calling in, just say you’re calling to make a thank you.The call handler can find your daughter’s details and find out who dealt with the call. We love when people do that. ❤️

Aw I was so impressed with 111 the other day. My daughter fell down the stairs, I rang 111 as I wasn’t sure what to do. They videoed me to see her, saw her behaviour and got us a taxi to hospital . Turned out she had broken her leg. I was so impressed as I didn’t want to waste an and es time and space but they made the call for me and were correct. The daughter was screaming and crying in pain all through the phone call which must have been painful to hear for the paramedic. But she didn’t mind.

Does the call handler ever find out the result of what happened or how can you thank them for helping?

Unfortunately the triage system has to be a specific way for patient safety to ensure nothing is missed and that call handlers who are not medically trained don’t give out medical advice which could be brought into court or a fatal accident enquiry.

It’s to protect them and the patients.

Your attitude is basically it’s not right but because it’s a shitty system be expected to be treated like crap and we absolutely do not endorse the system but unfortunately the fat cats who sit in the offices don’t really care what the users think.

I would love to know the jobs you have had over the years where you have had a say in how things are ran and how your opinion has single handedly changed a companies way of working.

I'm really sorry for you and hope you find sources of appreciation near you: you do a very important job. 💐It's not fair you're been treated badly.
I feel the same about any other job that requires to be dealing with general public by phone: I think not being face to face makes it easier for people to be rude and nasty (like anonymity on internet forums 😬...).

No I haven’t but I don’t Google symptoms and I do my utmost best to keep people out of A & E when the system prompts it by speaking to a medically trained professional about what’s going on with my callers.

I also think the buck passing, ‘I have no say in the system’ is an unprofessional attitude. If you’re in the job you are endorsing the system. Yes it’s not your design but it’s also not ‘nothing to do with you’.

If you read my post you will see I agree that “It's not right” to ever be rude to 111. But if the OP is interested in a discussion on why this happens, it’s helpful to understand how the triage system is perceived by callers. You can spend all your time complaining that it’s not right but it’s more helpful to understand that part of the problem is the design of the system. You can’t expect people to always slot neatly into your system like robots. It’s not realistic.

There's no excuse for rudeness but I personally haven't found 111 helpful so I think a lot of it is frustration combined with fear and pain, exhaustion or illness. I remember one lady on here ringing them to get a death confirmed ooh. The deceased was her mum and she waited ages. They kept calling back to check in, making her go through the script and she kept having to say "no- she's still dead" to reconfirm the death. I feel in such circs, they should be able to circumvent the script.

They were awful when I woke up with frightening, sick making vertigo on a Saturday after a dreadful, dreadful headache . I'd never had it before and it was subsequently confirmed to be from a nasty inner ear infection. 111 just cruelly wasted my time for 2 days. Operators were nice so I don't blame them or their script but I felt punished and like a nuisance because due to my difficulties with movement they couldn't easily dump me on a&e.

The 111 operator was vile to my daughter in law, the recording was played at her inquest. The lead barrister didn't want it playing but the coroner wanted to hear it, he threw his glasses across the floor in anger when the request was granted.n. The operator was conveniently out of the country and didn't attend,