To think I can’t manage a job on top of children?

I read this with the same sadness as you do.

'In the trenches' almost always gets used a few times in these threads, since when should getting to enjoy family life be like a war?

I don't think a model where women can't work is good either though, as some women really fair better mentally with time in the work environment.

This was me. Thankfully mine are now 13 & 15. Its brutal when they are small.
I worked FT and mine were full-time nursery.
Exh was a useless father duc nothing = worked 70 hour weeks.
Left him years ago as I was doing it all anyway.
You need a better cleaner
Him to take kids at weekends
Work more hours and divide up chores. He can hang a wash out at 6am and do all cooking Saturday sun !
Otherwise your resentment will grow and grow....

Sorry it clearly doesn’t work - you say yourself you were shattered!! That’s a crap life for everyone. I don’t know any working mums of children under 5 who aren’t either exhausted, permanently ill, or close to burn out. Truth is society doesn’t care about children and women having children. And we don’t have equality. What we have is a misplaced version of equality where we are expected to work and earn money AND do the real woman’s work.

There’s some great tips here & I am making notes but I also want to say ime it absolutely does get easier, not easy but less hard once they are a bit older. There’s advantages to every situation as well as disadvantages and once you have some breathing room (when youngest around 3.5yrs in my experience) you may see the advantages more clearly, for example for me I absolutely wouldn’t suit not working so I love my daughter seeing me making progress in my career and prioritising that as something which is important to me.

Hmm, really? 😕
I thought it was quite a high standard here.
Back in my country, you'd be expected to live under (abusive) parents, grow up and move one block of flats further, have kids, work and if lucky, not an abusive husband with a beer breath and
a pot belly.
Might be exaggerating a bit, but it was always a firm No thank you. 😁

I have to do work 5 days a week as a single parent. I honestly feel I might die of exhaustion at times. Honestly OP it’s so hard. I do not know why people are such martyrs about taking on so much. I certainly wouldn’t pick this life. If you can afford it step back a little but do not give up work.

i am another in the camp that never expected ex partner to have an affair and just leave the country and me to get on with all the childcare.

This too - each of you gets a lie in on either Saturday or Sunday!

God I would have killed to have had the opportunity to work from home when mine were younger! I've been doing it since Covid and omg it would have made such a difference! They're all adults now though. Even sent the eldest to a childminder until the age of 13 because I didn't want her coming home to an empty house on her own!! (Told people it was her auntie lol!)

If you are all out of the house full time 3 days a week what cleaning/tidying are you doing on those days?! Surely you can manage without that?

If you need to buy more clothes/undies to survive without washing Mon-Fri then do that.

Get a better cleaner who will also tidy (mine also does washing and changes the beds).

Don't give up your job, you're in the trenches now but it's so hard to get back in once you are out. And it's something that is yours when the rest of your life is bound to serving the family.

Take turns at the weekends with DH to have a rest. Half a day each or something.

Good luck.

Single mom here and lists save me. I have OCD and ADHD and need to be regimented.

I have a morning routine checklist, cleaning checklist weekly, daily, and monthly. I also have a bedtime routine checklist.

It makes it easy for me to know what needs to be done each day and do it. I clean roughly 30 minutes a day at night focusing on different rooms. One load of laundry a day.

I wipe the bathroom down while brushing my teeth each day. The main one in the morning, mine at night. I clean as I cook. By the time dinner is ready there's not much to tidy. Then just a wipe down of the kitchen and quick mop.

If I'm cooking something in the oven I use that time to do my chores.

Kids rooms are easy to organize if you have bins to put their stuff in. A big toy box even. It doesn't have to be super organized they can help pick up their stuff even when young.

I think the biggest tip though is get rid of stuff. I don't keep clutter. Everything has a place so it's easy to tidy up.

Totally understand what you mean and I’m in a much easier situation and WFH full time. I feel like I have no time to think or get anything done.

I have children almost the exact same age and I keep telling myself it will get easier! And hopefully it will.

In answer to your initial question, it’s up to you to decide if you can or can’t manage. Don’t compare yourself to others because that’s not relevant.

Anyway sending empathy x

I hear you! Looking back I have no idea how I did it. I had my youngest when I was 40, and I already had a 5 year old and a 3 year old. The oldest two were doing activities 4/5 nights a week, so I had to take them there straight from work. I had to drop them all off in different locations in the morning and pick them up in the evening.

Like you, I always felt I was getting the worst of them - sleepy and not wanting to rush in the mornings, and cranky in the evenings - and that wasn't just the kids!!

DH did stuff like packed lunches, which I always hated, and some pickups from activities, but some like swimming and ballet, where I had to stay. I only did laundry at the weekends unless we really needed something washed. Dishes were done as and when (dishwasher). Everything that could go into the tumbledryer went in it. Anything that couldn't was smoothed down over the radiator. DH did any ironing but there wasn't a huge amount.

Accept that your house is probably always going to be untidy. We mostly had the kids' toys in the family room so we could close the door, but of course stuff got carted everywhere. Homework was tough, though in the end we got them to do it at their childminder's house (the kids were smarter than our childminder lol!) and they had their evening meal there too (provided and cooked by me though!)

I worked FT throughout. Because of logistics there was no way I could ever make PT work for me financially. I did do 'family friendly' a few summers when they were older, but other than that, I have always worked FT. So long as the house wasn't a health hazard, and the kids were happy, we muddled through it.

A close friend of mine also had 3 children, much closer in age than mine. She stopped working for 20 years. She's been back in work a few years now, but she doesn't have much in pension, while I have my years of FT contributions to fall back on. Everyone tells you - it's the biggest cliche, and when you're in the thick of it, you think it's damn stupid! - that it all goes by so quickly, and it actually does!

Also had zero family help - lived too far away!

You absolutely can manage - you just have to prioritise and not put yourself under any more pressure than you have to.

I did it with three children. To be honest, I would have found it more stressful to be at home all day with them.

First of all, these are the hardest years in terms of balancing work and home and your own life. In a few short years, you will be able to fit in a hobby again or not feel like you are being squeezed in a vice all the time. It really does get easier.

Second, I would ask why the cleaner was stressful. My cleaner has been with me since those days and the day I came home and the house was cleaned was the happiest day of my week. Ask your friends and try to get a really good cleaner - at least then you know the bathroom and kitchen and floors are done once a week.

Batch cook. In those years I cooked every second or third sunday morning. I quite enjoyed it - bolognese, chicken curry, casserole, tomato sauce, chicken casserole - and made at least 10 portions of each. It was repetitive but at least dinner was on the table once the pasta had cooked.

Lower your standards - your home does not have to be perfect.

Have your husband do something once he does come home - a load of laundry or clean up the kitchen, pay the bills, or put out the bags for the morning (I would have everything laid out by the door).

At the weekends, lean into where you are in your life and do things that are pleasant for smallies (zoo, nature walk, playground) but make it nice by meeting up with another family, bringing a picnic etc. Carve out some time for each of you to have a couple of hours break over the weekend.

I remember a woman who had twins and an older child saying to me that she remembers buying frozen diced onion and looked back and couldn't believe she didn't have the time to chop and onion. I used to freeze sandwiches for the week - horrendous - but it worked.

it really is worth keeping your job if at all possible.

But having children shouldn't just be for the wealthy...and it's a shame families can't often survive on one income. I read an interesting thing, can't remember where but basically saying that women in the UK are quite unlucky compared to other nations in the sense that they will need to work, won't necessarily have strong extended family ties and buying in outside help is only for quite well off people...and that therefore even middle class women are rushed off their feet with work and domestic chores in a way that middle class women in other countries aren't. I thought it was quite interesting.

Who cares what society expects?
I don't have the challenge of children or work
(landlady) and don't have much to complain about at 45.
Far from gloating, where I came from, if I did what society expected I'd be extremely unhappy or worse.
Observing others (women) since childhood very carefully, who is happy and who isn't, helped me make my choices.

Can you afford what used to be called a "Mothers Helper"?

Someone to come for a couple of hours every morning, take the kids to nursery, come back, tidy up doing the washing up and put a load of washing on, change the beds one day, clean the bathroom another, thats sort of thing.

Ah I feel your pain. Similar. I have 4 children and work 3 days. My work days are manic and the house is a tip although I do my best. It's a struggle but it will get easier. My youngest is 18 months but my older 10 year old can help a bit in the mornings. I have a cleaner on my day off so although I spend an hour tidying for her arriving it saves me a couple hours of cleaning and I can catch up on ironing that day. Finding a reliable cleaner that won't cancel on you is the way forward as it took me 4 to get one that didn't cancel on me last minute half the time! It's not impossible, these are the toughest years but I don't believe it will ever be stress free either. Find a better cleaner it will really help 😊

Yeh it's hard. But you manage. We all do (those of us who work full time with kids, anyway). It's tough but not forever.

Yes, I'm surprised ready meals haven't been mentioned.
There are plenty of reasonable quality ones.

Agree with @WelcomeToMonkeyTown it’s much happier at home when you aim to keep a child-friendly home, not an immaculately clean home- beautiful where unrealistic standards create unnecessary tensions.
Life is too short, fuck the housework and dance with your partner and your kids!
Also reward them for small cleaning and tidying jobs even when they are not yet old enough to do it properly they will treasure your praise and love trying to help out💕
Can you take time out just for you and DH ? can you book childcare on a Friday when Dh works from home, maybe monthly or fortnightly so you both have lunch together and you get reprieve?

I couldn't manage a job on top of small children. So for me, YANBU. Caring for your children, running the house, life admin, night wakings, enough downtime and rest for you (and DH) - that's full-time as it is.

The cost of living is just too high these days and the necessity for many of having two incomes makes the early years really hard.

It's crazy that a few decades ago families could cope with one income to function - albeit being careful with money.

I would suggest trying to change your work somehow? Or asking for help and respite from family if possible.

Me and my DP both work full time and have 5 children. How do we cope? We both pull our weight and also embrace the chaos sometimes and ignore the housework every Friday night to relax and have a date night. DP get to wfh a lot and will do the laundry then. The robot hoover massively improved our lives (kids tidy up for a robot because they know it eats their Lego without any conscience) but fundamentally it sounds like your DP thinks that he doesn’t need to do any housework or mental load because you have 2 days a week to do it. That’s the problem.

We have same age gap and same working arrangement. I'm in pretty similar situation as you but mine are now 2.5 and 4.5 years old. Mornings are manic and I'm a little late every day. It's been 2 years and noone has pulled me up on it yet, but I will say it is a very relaxed workplace.

On the days I'm working I collect the kids and try to stop somewhere like the park where they can run and frolick a bit before we arrive home. I find it clears everyone's heads and makes everyone less cranky. Much harder with the evenings drawing in though.

On wednesdays when im not working I often keep my eldest out of preschool along with my youngest who is home with me, so we can have a chill morning and breakfast, and do something enjoyable. I find it stops him getting too tired as the week goes on and he can reset midweek. My preschool is fine with this approach. I won't be able to next year when he starts primary.

I deep clean one room per week and I vaguely keep up with laundry and put the dishwasher on every evening. Husband sometimes hangs the laundry and walks the dog and will cook a weekend meal, though lately he's been working extra at weekends. I let my youngest cosleep if needed so I can rest.

Found click n collect at Tesco pretty handy when my youngest was smaller.

I definitely felt the same way as you but it has calmed down and the ages of your 2 now are really tough going!! I struggled at that stage too. I feel like mine have settled a lot in the past 6 months amd things are getting easier. I've also become much more forgiving of my own chaotic tendencies and stopped worrying what work thought of me. 🙃

Your DH needs to do stuff to help at weekends and in evenings. Both of us work full time in our household and we both share chores around our schedules.

sandwiches can be made and put in the freezer on a Sunday night for the week ahead for example

buy 7 sets of polo tops and bottoms for school uniform. Make sure 5 are washed and ready on a Sunday and 2 spare on rotation

Online food shopping - if he commutes on a train he can do the adds throughout the week and book the delivery for 8-9pm when you’re both home.

It does get easier as they get older and more able to do things themselves eg dressing and breakfast etc. but until then you both need to work as a team, even if he works more days than you.

Spreading your working hours over 5 days as a PP suggested might also help you feel less hectic and give you more time in afternoons

This. I am British Indian and have seen the collectivism get diluted over the years. I also see the stress also amongst my US colleagues who are parents even though they are earning loads seemingly living the ‘American Dream’. It’s horrible and me and DH are shaping our goals to move to be nearer to family so we can support each other more. Getting additional paid help in most western countries is extortionate, it seems like the best way forward is to be collectively minded as a larger family. This includes sensibly sharing finances when times are tough for individual members of the family.