To wonder how anyone affords to move house?

Sadly this is what happens to bereaved people living in social housing. Sometimes an adult has been living with their elderly parent or other relative for many years, all their life even, but when that older relative dies, they are not only grieving but they often find that they have no right to succeed to the tenancy and are unceremoniously kicked out by the council/HA. Those people have memories in the house, too.

But apparently it's only homeowners we should feel compassion for

So people who have lived in their homes for decades and are used to the space should downsize and go though the stress and cost of moving house so someone else with children can have it instead? My parents live in a very very large house, way more bedrooms and space than they need. My dad recently passed and my mom plans on staying in the house he loved which is full of memories of him until the day she dies and rightfully so. If anybody told her she should go through the horrible stress of moving with the grief of my father's passing still looming simply so another family can have the house I would hope that she would tell them to do one.

Can't you see your issue is with the housing stock, not people who have bigger houses than YOU deem are necessary for them?

Who are you to tell me what I "should" and "shouldn't" be upset about?
And no, I am not upset with crazycatlady for wanting a gym, I'm irritated that she claims to need a 5 bedroom house to accommodate her gym.

Of course I think the government and councils need to take action on the housing crisis - and I vote accordingly. I wonder if how many of the people parroting this argument have done the same? Or have they voted for parties that sell off council housing, underinvest in housing, and maintain the status quo?

It's all very well to blame the government but people need to take responsibility as well.

I agree with you, though, that there should be a lot more social housing, and then there would be less pressure on the private market.

So yes, I feel your pain, and agree the housing system is a mess! We need way more social housing, and way fewer people treating houses as land as speculative investments rather than homes.

I mean… My mortgage on a tiny two-up, two down is £1,800pcm (S.E) (more than 50% of my take home wage) and I will be paying it till I’m 70.. and I count myself lucky!

You shouldn't be upset with @Childfreecatlady for wanting a gym, you should be upset that the government isn't building lots of homes for regular people to live in. And that taxpayers are not willing to fund it.

Lots of people don't like social housing because they say that people like them I.e. people on median incomes wouldn't qualify for social housing. But who sets those rules anyway. If there was enough supply of government subsidized/affordable homes ( cities like Singapore and Vienna do it), it wouldn't be rationed for the most vulnerable. And yes for that kind of housing you can set conditions. Like in singapore the largest flats are reserved for 3g families (3 generations under one roof). For the private market, it's 100% capitalist (and that's fine as long as there is an alternative for ordinary people or even people who don't want to be overleveraged on property).

I'm not being defensive about the gym, I'm simply stating that you or anybody else has no right to say what is and is not necessary for me. If someone worked from home you wouldn't be scoffing at their home office would you? Or would you also expect that to house another person instead? Maybe people should stop having children they can't afford to house eh?

Anyway, I'm done with this convo!

No one care how you feel, it’s irrelevant whether you feel guilty or not. How you feel doesn’t change the situation.

I didn't say you should feel guilty. You are clearly being defensive about your "very necessary" gym! But your refusal to acknowledge the injustice of the system just makes you blinkered and selfish I'm afraid.

Luckily for me, in my life and work, I come across people with a lot less who still manage to "give a fuck" about others.

So I suppose every single person who has a house should feel guilty according to you, as they prevented someone else from buying their house. Forgive me if I couldn't give less of a fuck. And no, we don't set the prices, the market sets the prices. What people are willing to pay sets the price. So those buyers who lost out bc they couldn't afford to pay as much as us lost out to a competitive housing market, it's how the system works. I'm certainly not going to feel guilty about my very necessary gym, thanks.

"We don't set the prices"
Er no, supply and demand is what dictates the prices. You're occupying a large house which means one less large house for families to buy. When you bought it you were competing against other potential buyers who may have lost out because they couldn't afford to offer as much as you.
It's how the system works, and you benefit, but don't spout nonsense that you need a gym.

There is only a finite number of 4-5 bedroom houses. I don't think households with just 1 or 2 adults should have those 4-5 bed houses while households with children or multiple generations are squeezed into 2-3 bedroom houses. That is ultimately what happens.

We are trying to move to an area with good schools, there are no (or very few) family homes that come up for sale in the area, in part because their retired owners (whose now adult children are long gone) don't want to downsize, and even when the houses do come up for sale, they're ridiculously overpriced. So there's a huge amount of competition for the 3 bedroom homes, and 4 bedroom homes are beyond the budget of most people with children in childcare/education. If people were more willing to downsize when they no longer needed the space, there would be more bigger houses for families.

Of course, no one really thinks like this, because we live in a capitalist, individualistic society, and everyone (understandably) prioritises their own interests.

It's very frustrating though!

If you read what I said, I said, it's absurd to think that we are preventing a family from having a bigger house, if they want one they can buy one, we don't set the prices. And yes, we don't need need those rooms but we do feel they are a necessity for us, so we bought a bigger house. Why is me having a gym less important than someone else having a play room? Oh right, it's not.

Why is it absurd?!
A couple with no children does not need a 5 bedroom house. You might want one, but you don't need one.

Rich people might have more than they need for sure, but you can't judge people on the size of their home or state that BC someone has a big home someone else has to have a small one. We are a couple, no kids, some animals, purchasing a 5 bed house. Each of those rooms has a purpose and are necessary for us. However we are in no way preventing a family from having a larger house, that is kind of absurd.

Well yes, that is kind of the problem. The cost of housing has gone up exponentially while salaries have increased marginally at best. That means only people who got on the ladder early with loads of equity or people who have very good salaries can afford to buy.

You wait. We could afford to move now but that's because we have lived here 11 years and would take the increase in value plus paid-off equity plus savings with us for deposit and stamp duty and costs.

We moved 6 months ago after spending 9 years in what we planned to be a 5 year house. Covid happened, furlough, so much uncertainty, so we stayed put even though we had really outgrown it. When the time came though, we really needed to move for catchment area and the house was no longer meeting our needs. We saved hard, putting the money away monthly we knew we'd need for a new mortgage plus moving costs. Our 1.8% 2 year fixed rate was coming to an end so even to just stay where we were we'd have been paying a few hundred more. We'd built up a decent amount in equity so when we sold we took some of the equity out to cover EA fees, solicitors fees etc and to cover some renovation costs in the new house. We doubled our mortgage to move but in the time since we bought our previous house, both DH and I had significantly increased our salaries through promotion and we were finally out of the painful years of paying childcare costs which was a significant saving every month. Our new house does need further work that we are saving to do, it will likely take us a few years to save and do everything we want but we're fine with this.

We're 34, on our second house now and we need to move again next year as we've had another baby and our 1% fixed rate ends next September. We're now frantically saving £15k to move so we can put all equity into the sale. Our mortgage is currently £500pm and will go up to £1000pm when we move. This will be our last move for a long time now I suspect.

Plus lots of people have ££££ in equity which distorts the market but younger people can’t help when they were born.

The idea of a property ladder doesn’t really exist any more because every prices are so high, wages have stagnated & FTBs are older.

I think you made a good choice bypassing the flat stage.

I don’t think the whole starter home thing really exists anymore for like millenials onwards in the UK. We are similar in that we bought an ex council semi needing renovation in a lovely but very rural area. I said at the time it would make a good first home….but not a forever home.

Now it’s looking like it’s our forever unless we relocate in retirement or inherit. I’m fine with it though, and it actually has enough rooms (3 bed, 2 of which are big) downstairs bathroom + one of the bedrooms (annoying but good for aging), nice garden views, big gardens and double driveway. We have a small mortgage but i really can’t be arsed to sell down the line only to have to do this all again at an older age. So only want to move to a final, final house near DC one day wherever they end up…but who knows what housing costs will be. We earn above average combined for the area but feel lucky to have even secured this house at our age (30 ish when we bought)

Someone working 37.5h/w NMW making a small pension contribution would indeed earn about £1500/month net. But they'd still have to pay rent and everything else. The average private rent in England is £1327/month. So a couple both on minimum wage would have £1673/month left to pay for everything else.

You would have nearly double that!

You upsize as your circumstances change (increases in income or reduction in paid childcare) or you make your home work for your family and stay put

M