Sad we will be spending another Christmas away from home

We used to alternate Christmas and New year with our families every year with young kids. Whilst it was lovely being with family, the travel, wrapping and transporting gifts without the kids seeing them, lack of sleep etc was so stressful. On top of that the kids didn't really get to play with their gifts properly...the dog might eat pieces or pieces might get lost. COVID year was quiet but so relaxed. The difference being able to put the kids to sleep in their own beds and allow them to just play was liberating and they actually asked if we could stay home every year. Since then we've said if they want to spend Christmas with the kids, grandparents are welcome to come to us.
I couldn't imagine doing that on a train especially with young kids for Christmas. Easter would be much more manageable and we continue to travel for that.

What did you do at Christmas when your son was that age?

I think it's nice that your son checks in early and decorates the hotel room. It shows that he is trying.

Yep, that's a really sweet touch.

I feel for you @RosenNn . I'd be disappointed too. But realistically you live too far away for them to make that journey over Christmas.

A pp mentioned the horror of the London Christmas getaway. I have friends in London (without children) who need to make that journey to parents before the railways close down for Christmas and Boxing Day. It sounds nightmarish. Your son would have to book a specific train in advance, the stations are absolutely packed out and chaotic, and so would their train be. And they'd be trying to manage the kids, their luggage and the presents. I honestly wouldn't put my kids and my little grandchildren through that.

It might even be that the parents can't get leave from work for that whole week, when they're going away again soon after.

Basically you're faced with your grandchildren or your church. Only you can decide which is most important to you.

I’ve read the OP’s posts and some but not all of the other posts. This reminds me a bit of a thread (years ago) where an OP’s parents had retired and moved to Cornwall but were then annoyed when the OP went to stay with her in-laws in Belgium. Their point of view was that she was willing to travel overseas but not to come and stay in the UK - hers was that it was actually cheaper and quicker to get to Belgium than Cornwall.

If the trip to Serbia is three or four hours then it may be quicker, cheaper and easier to get there than to the north east (depending on where in the north east it is). It may be that they can’t face doing a long trip up north when they know they are also going to Serbia (or they can’t get annual leave for both trips over Christmas - I wouldn’t be able to).

There are twelve days of Christmas. Spend Christmas Eve / Day at home and go to your church. Come down to London on Boxing Day.

I completely agree.

I think my eldest was 2.5 when I put my foot down and said we'd be spending Christmas in our own home from now on - and I am fully supportive of my adult kids making the same choice when they have their own little ones.

I don’t think you are going to persuade them to come to you. So the choice you have is to continue to see them at Christmas or do your own thing at Christmas and see them on a different day.

Can you book and decorate an Airbnb closer to them and make it more of a festive experience? Do it a few days before or after Xmas day so you get to do your own celebrations as well as with them?

Definitely.

OP and DH are the people for whom travel is easiest at the moment. That's what it comes down to.

Btw also the travel costs from Serbia to uk are probably not possible so your DIL will only ever be able to se her family if she travels to there. Also not sure on restrictions for travel out of Serbia and maybe they also have health conditions. Your DIL is probably very homesick.

Enjoy your Christmas at home this year and attend your one home. See them before or after instead. They then get a magical family Christmas alone for a change which I’m sure they will love.

also be very grateful that you see that much of them.

I understand that it would be nice to host them, but I think in the circumstances I would just make the best of things and say nothing. The children are very small and they already have one big trip around that time.

Talking to our Macedonian friend who wants to visit the UK, the costs are really prohibitive. I think she said the cost of applying for a holiday visit worked about £300. You then have to factor in that wages there probably are around half those in the UK (I believe wages are lower still in Serbia). So it's like us paying £500 or 600 for the visa alone.

For both her parents to come to London itd be like us paying the best part of £1500. And that's BEFORE you add in the costs of flights and hotels.

It's really sobering and it really makes you think about how we take travel for granted in the UK.

I hope the OP has the sense to look up some of this and to start to appreciate the barriers and issues at play here.

There was an expectation that we went to in-laws for Christmas.

It was bad enough that though I was working full time and really just wanted a break, MiL expected me (none of the men) to jump up and help in the kitchen, wash up, make cups of tea etc, and the BiLs kids staying up till past midnight. The the killer which was rail chaos, bad weather, cancelled trains, a long wait and then having to stand from the NE to London with severe overcrowding, with a toddler and whilst 7 months pregnant. In fairness at some point the guard spotted me sitting down on the floor and took me into first class. We never went to them again for Christmas. I am sure they thought I was awful but we enjoyed our quiet Christmases.

My DH used to go and fetch my DM every year as DM didn't drive. He would then return her home around 27th or 28th or whenever she wished. It was I admit a much shorter journey of around 1:30 to 2 hours but DH did this for years. We'd still do it now even though it's more like a 4 hour drive but sadly DM died 13 years ago.

Has your son given a reason for not wanting to come to yours?

If it's the length of travelling, would you consider booking a nice air bnb cottage outside of London that they can get to by train, and that you can all stay in for a few days? Maybe somewhere coastal/in the countryside? I've stayed in some and they've had Christmas trees up etc.

A road trip to the NE? Ouch. That's harder than the train.

I wonder if the OP has given thought to the cost of the train tickets particularly around Christmas? They will probably be as expensive as flights to Serbia (noting they are likely to be flying in early Jan which is low season for flights). And when the kids hit 5 they will have to pay the cost of that.

There needs to be a reality check on expectations here for the long term.

When the children hit school age then the parents are going to be restricted on when they can go to Serbia and the costs of travel during the school holidays are going to make it much harder for them to be able to afford as many trips either to the NE or Serbia.

Perhaps the OP should consider moving south to be closer to her grandkids...

YANBU to feel sad about it, but they aren't being unreasonable either. It's just one of those things where it's hard to please everybody. And I think you should try to be understanding about your DIL's desire to travel to her family every year. As she lives far away from them and from her own country and culture, it's understandable that it might be extra important to her to make this particular annual trip. It will be a way of staying in touch with her roots and keeping her children in touch with them. It's hard to do that at home without the surrounding wider culture. It doesn't mean that it wouldn't be lovely for you if they also felt able to make the trip up to you once or twice, but they probably think about that entirely separately, and as lots of PPs have pointed out, there are multiple reasons why parents of small children often prefer to have Christmas in their own homes. The Serbian trip is a bit of a red herring.

Do your son and DIL actually want Christmas altogether or is it an expectation and they're too polite to say? Perhaps they'd like to enjoy a Christmas together as their own little family as their kids are young so they can enjoy their own traditions as a family of four.

If I were you I would go and visit in the run up to Xmas and spend the actual day at home. They do spend a decent amount of time with you really throughout the year especially with such young children. I wouldn't mention the Serbia trips.

The roads are also chaos at Xmas. And it sounds like they don’t want to travel.

I would recommend the OP takes a trip to Serbia to get some perspective on costs and affordability...

It's a country which is very interesting to visit.

Certainly it changes your preconceptions...

Most children are more comfortable and happy in their own homd, surrounded by their own toys, and sleep and eat better at home. I have always felt that i want my small family unit to remain at hpme for christmas, and if grandparents would like to join us thats fine. They are retired with all the time in the world to relax in their own home, whereas we work 40 hrs a week and crave that downtime at home with our children.
I actually think it's quite selfish and controlling when grandparents want everyone to return to their house for christmas - usually its so that they can control the christmas proceedings: food the way they want it and the time they want it served, tv on what they want to watch, doing what they want to do.

I agree with other people that the children are very young and this is perhaps an unfair ask at the moment.

Like most family issues on here this would be best solved with some communication and a direct conversation with your DS.

This. The big celebration in Serbian, analogous to Christmas in the UK, is New Years.

Aside from obviously getting to see her family, and the children their grandparents, spending Christmas in Serbia, and engaging in the traditions, are a way of keeping the children connected to their culture.

My parents took my brother and I back to Serbia for holidays too. Always enjoyed it, and am glad they did.

I've not read the full thread so maybe this has already been suggested but why can't your DH drive down and pick them up and bring them to yours for Christmas and then take them back? This would be less hassle than them coming on the train and I can quite see how they don't want to do that with small children

Just a thought