NC Parents Secretly Seeing Kids

I think it’s really tricky. Human relationships are complex. My DGM was full on abusive and neglectful of my dad when he was a child. I spent limited and supervised time with her as a child. I have fond memories of her as she had mellowed and become nicer to be around. Or she was just better at being a grandparent than a parent.

as an adult, and knowing what I do about her own upbringing and situation, I also have some understanding of why she might have been like she was. As much as I will always hold how she treated my dad at the forefront of my mind, I also value having had some kind of relationship with her, and I’m glad that my dad managed that relationship as he did, rather than banning me from seeing her, which would have left questions for me and a sense of a missing piece of where I come from.

I think you need to let him make his own mind up, but you can also be honest about why you don’t talk to them.

"you can't stop me meeting up with who I want to, he's my grandson and I'm entitled to see him, you may think you can dictate to people but I've got news for you.....you can't."

I'd respond (or get DH to)

No you're right we can't stop you you're correct. However you are by no means entitled to see anyone at any time. We had chosen not to share all the details of why we no longer have contact with DS. We didn't want to tarnish any happy memories he had with you. However as you have now gone against our wishes we have no choice but to share the full horror of what you have said regarding Dd. Naturally he is horrified as we were and no longer wishes to have any further contact with you. do not contact any of us again. Any further communication will be seen as harassment.

I would go with allowing him to see them as it is causing him stress to keep 'the secret' - and it's not great that they involved him in that. However, as a kindness to your son, I'd not add to his discomfort by forbidding him. Let him make his own mind up about them through spending time with them.

This reminds me a sitution many years regarding my eldest brother and grandmother - he saw her in secret, but my grandmother was nothing like your in laws. I think your son is old enough to make his decision. I think tell for full facts of situation and let him decide for himself.

They use racist slurs openly, they have an pretty toxic view of people on low incomes. The language they use to describe migrants is not at all acceptable.

And hopefully, if you've brought your DS up to have values and ethics, he will see this @AlliBali

Forbidding him contact with his grandparents could potentially cause him to see them just to defy you, and to agree with their attitudes as a kind of teenage rebellion.

He's old enough to start making moral decisions - but you could say that the reason you don't see your in-laws is because of their racism, and their slurs towards his sister. And that he is free to make a decision, knowing that they hold these racist and ableist attitudes towards his sister.

Give your DS the opportunity to learn and grow.

I think you should. I wouldn't meet anyone who thought that of my sister - regardless of what age I was.

Your MIL is engaging in one man upmanship rather than familial interest.

I don’t really think it’s reasonable to expect OP and the rest of the family to go, given what’s happened in the past. But if DS wants to continue contact, I would make a point of dropping him at their home and picking him up each time he wants to see them - and making myself very visible in the process. Sends the message that no matter how unreasonable they’ve been in the past, OP is not trying to influence DS one way or the other. Hopefully that will take some of the fun out of sneaking around for the GP, and if/when DS realises what horrible people they are and stops contact, it will be clear to them that this was his own decision.

I bet that if you stop forbidding DS to have contact, and assure him that you are happy for him to have an independent relationship with his GPs, that they will lose enthusiasm for seeing him.

Illicit meetings are a form of control for them. Once they're not Illicit any more, they're just...routine.

I think you have to tell them what they said about his sister.

It's not fair to keep this fact from him as it could certainly be a deciding factor for him.

It will shock him but he is old enough to understand that some people do things like this and that he has been manipulated by them to get at you.

Presumably your DS has witnessed this multiple times

and yet he still wants to see them?

what on earth are his views?

I suppose it is his prerogative, but how disappointed would his parents feel.

oh ignore this kind of nonsense

well of course you must tell him

the fact you haven’t, is why he’s been sneaking around meeting them

Get a civil injunction

they sound obscene

but at 15, if the DS knows this and still wants to meet them, that is his prerogative

"you can't stop me meeting up with who I want to, he's my grandson and I'm entitled to see him, you may think you can dictate to people but I've got news for you.....you can't."

She is right.

His dear GPs called his own sister who has cerebral palsy a 'sp*z'.

This.
Does he genuinely want to meet up with them or does he feel he should?
Are they coercing him via text ?
Might help if you sit ds down and explain why you’re nc with his grandparents.

Your poor DS
i really feel for him

Dangerous to tell a teenager to keep a secret about meetings. Not sensible. But DC is 15 and can make some decisions. Let him continue to meet GP. If they are so toxic at some point he will realise this. Also explain safeguarding to him and that it's not wise to meet even GP and lie about where he is.

He is old enough to be told. A fifteen year old does not need protected from hearing racist and unpleasant names. At the moment he has been told he can't see his GP for an unspecified reason, and of course that isn't going to seem reasonable to him. His actions can't be controlled like a young child's can. Tell him so that he can make a properly informed decision. Not some waterdowned version which will still seem unconvincing, tell him the truth. After that he can make his own decision and if he wants to still see them, then make it no longer a secret.

Why would you want to punish him ? He’s fifteen and obviously felt strongly enough to want to see his GP, but didn’t want to upset his parents. If OP hasn’t explained the details of why they went NC up to this point, then telling him the full facts now will give him the opportunity to make an informed decision as to whether he wants to continue contact. If he does, I don’t think OP has much choice other than to allow it so that he doesn’t feel as though he has to sneak around.

At 15 he's old enough to make his own relationship with his extended family.

He is 15 and old enough to enjoy time with his dear GPs!

You need to tell him literally everything.

It's actually a positive in some ways because it shows the whole family outside of the GP are good people who do the right thing, it's not just you.