Excluded from grandchildren's life

OP, this is really simple. Your DS and DIL don’t like you. You have disapproved of your DIL as a suitable match for your DS and also openly disapproved of her parenting. I’m not surprised they don’t like you.

You don’t get to have a relationship with your grandchildren if their parents don’t like you.

If you want things to change, you need to change so that they all actually want to see you. Moaning on MN about how disrespectful and irresponsible your DIL is isn’t going to change a thing.

This in spades.

Anything the OP does or says at this point is going to viewed through a very suspicious lens, rightly so.

The only thing a person can do at this point is a quick call to apologize for their very active part in running this relationship off the rails, no qualifications no requests, no expectations. Then leave it to the others to set the pace (if any) in the relationship.

‘Hi Ben*,

Understandably you don’t want to drag the kids out to Surrey with the weather being the way it is. We don’t mind travelling to Greenwich and finding a cafe with a soft play - or anywhere you suggest.

If that doesn’t work, the four of you are always invited over here, open invitation. I know how busy you all are so I’ll leave the ball in your court.

I did get the girls a pretend kitchen for their birthday but now thinking about it, I should have asked if you had the space. Should I return it and just give the kids vouchers?’

It is the parents decision where and when to take the children - not yours.

He was correct! He obviously knows you very well.

Op in this post you're not just insulting your DIL but your son as well.

I imagine you are not blessed in tact and this is the consequences to that.

I understand you being concerned about her taking the children to Ukraine but I guess it depends on what part - she's obviously not going to do anything she feels is unsafe for her children and will be in contact with relatives there to assess it all before she goes. That's between her and your son.

I think from your posts you're doing the classic mil trick of blaming your dil for holding boundaries on reaction to your own behaviour and blaming her for your sons decisions and choices when he is an adult man. I think there's a lot here you need to own. You may have apologised but your attitudes are still very clearly current given your opening post and subsequent posts so don't expect anything different from them if you aren't going to change your own behaviours.

Your racist assumptions, judgemental criticisms, surprise visits and entitled attitude have led you down this path with your DS and DIL. Your posts are pointing the blame towards them rather than taking accountability for what you have done. If you ever want a relationship with your GC, I suggest taking accountability and making major amends.

We are LC with my MIL because of racist comments in the past. You have made assumptions about her ethnicity. Do you not realise how that would make her feel? I wouldn't want my kids around that and it's clear they don't want that around their family either.

I don’t think anyone would disagree that having concerns is unreasonable. I’m sure the parents have them too (and are in a much better position to judge them). What is unreasonable is getting into rows about it- it’s none of her business

You dont seem to be able to grasp the concept of being how to be a grandparent. Your role is not to judge and make life difficult. It is to stand by, be supportive and to enjoy your grandchildren.

Your son and his wife have made it very clear they do not appreciate your involvement in family decisions and it has gotten to the point where it is easier for them to cut you out rather than put up with it.

If you want a relationship with your grandchildren my only advice would be to apologise to your son. Assure him you no longer have an opinion on his own families decisions and ask that you be allowed some time with your grandchildren.

You have shown that you are divisive in nature. Your son may not agree with his wife taking his sons to her homeland. BUT it is the kind of decision a family unit has to make sometimes. Its difficult enough for your son and a grandmother has no place encouraging her son to take sides. His only side is with his wife.

Step back, try to apologise and build trust.

Oh dear. You implied that your DIL was after your son for reasons other than love. Your continued disapproval of her and they way she parents her children are just nails in this coffin.

Very hard to come back from that.

At the very least you need to understand and own your sizeable part in this, then you need to sincerely express your apologies to your son, and if you get any further , to his wife.

We never explicitly called her anything. We expressed concern that the relationship may not be built on honest motives, due to her age and back ground , either of those on their own would not have provoked the same questions

Wow. That's shocking.

Obviously if a very attractive much younger woman is showing an interest in someone who would generally not be seen as their type or who is clearly much better off financially it is fair to question

Double wow.

And there we have it.

No wonder the woman cannot abide you. You're a racist, classist person. And I expect your husband is just as bad.

You're a misogynist, too. You commented that your son "lets" his wife take their children abroad. She doesn't need his permission.

I'm a Grandmother too and was ready to empathise OP but I can't. You are getting way too involved in your son's life, choice of partner and their DCs. It's not up to you to pass judgement on any of these things you have mentioned here. Your son chose his partner. It's none of your business if you think she isn't his type!
Obviously if a very attractive much younger woman is showing an interest in someone who would generally not be seen as their type or who is clearly much better off financially it is fair to question. We apologised when we were told we were wrong.
Not fair to question at all. He is a grown man fgs.
Even if you did apologise, the damage was done.
If she wants to take her children to see her family then that is up to her too. I very much doubt she would put her own children into a serious dangerous situation so she obviously feels comfortable with going to her home town.

Seriously, you need to stop passing judgement. Maybe then they might let you back into their lives but I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you.
You only have yourself to blame.

Also who are you to guess what anyone’s type is?

Wow you are far far too involved. Expressing concerns that the relationship might not be build on honest motives on her part??? Due to her age and background?

I wouldn’t speak to you again either.

Being Eastern European doesn’t make someone automatically dishonest?? You sound severely racist. Your son’s probably lucky to have her. WOW

You seem to blame your DIL for all of this, you say she has no respect, but you lay absolutely no blame at the feet of your son. It's his job, not hers to ensure his children have a relationship with his family, she goes to lots of effort to ensure her children have a relationship with her family!

It's quite clear that you just dislike her, they have picked up on it and your son has decided to protect his wife from his parents who make her feel really shit when she visits. You don't see your DIL because of you and your actions, you don't see your grandchildren because of your son! None of this is your DILs fault.

You seem to struggle with the idea that it is not your right to tell your adult child how to live his life, who to marry and how to raise his children.

If you have a close, supportive relationship, having an open discussion with your adult child about their life choices is fine and can even be helpful to them. But it's a discussion - not you telling them your view. You listen to them, ask open ended questions, show interest in their views, gently raise alternative views etc. You don't start by telling him his wife is only with him for the money. It's never going to go well.

Can't grandparents worry about their grandchildren's safety? Sure. But that doesn't mean you need to share your worries with them. Do you really think they are unaware there is a war in Ukraine?

And you clearly do not have the sort of relationship with them where any sort of comment is going to go down well so my suggestion is that you stop making any. Just stop. If the kid is about to be hit by a bus, you can shout to warn them but otherwise just don't express an opinion on how they should be doing things.

One day, if you rebuilt a good relationship with them, they might be open to discussions on parenting choices but you have a long way to go first

But op those words will offend. They may even be true, but they will still offend.

When you say things that offend, you often get cut out. You may have said them out of love or concern, but there’s still a risk of fallout, and that’s the price you pay for taking that risk. It’s just being disingenuous to expect the DIL to think “fair enough: I am actually a gold digger and only marrying him for x reason so I owe it to the parents to just ignore it.” Humans just don’t work like that. You’ve accused - perhaps rightly - and this is the result.

Just in response to this part of your OP

"My sons is meant to bring them to see us once a month but most times he ends up coming alone with some excuse. "

What do you mean by this? Have you complained about the lack of visits and told him that you'd like to see him/them at least monthly leaving him feeling like he had no choice but to aquiesce? And now he keeps failing to keep up with an arrangment which he didn't want to be part of and never agreed to - another black mark against him?

I live in a family with a dynamic like this - were the only 'right' thing to do is to tow the PIL's line and not following their schedules and rules is immediately met with coldness, sulking and comments about how 'difficult' we are being and how difficult DH has always been.

You've transferred your anger at your son to his wife and you're surprised that he's doubled down and doesn't want to have much of a relationship with you?!

It doesn't matter if you are right or wrong here. If you want any relationship with your son you need to take a massive step back and make some apologies now. You need to accept their boundaries and stop with the judgement. He's an adult now and he can choose whether or not to have you in his life.

I took our children to Australia to see grandparents several times from when they were babies. It took 48 hrs door to door.

I would hate it if my 21y daughter married a man ten years older I have to say. But I am not a fan of age gaps like this when the woman is so young still. The power dynamic isn’t right.

We expressed concern that the relationship may not be built on honest motives, due to her age and back ground , either of those on their own would not have provoked the same questions.

'Background.'

You mean the racist assumption you made that all attractive Eastern European women are only interested in western men for their money?

Call it what it was, OP. You were racist, xenophobic and anti-slavic.

You reap what you sow. Good on her for not taking your crap.

She probably doesn’t want to open herself up to criticism. Why would she?

It is a truly horrible thing to imply that someone your son loves is after him for his money. Even if you think it, you do not say it! Do you not know this???

Apologising doesn't make a difference.