Labour PIP benefit cuts

Stop panicking. It may not affect you.

FWIW I worked in one place where one lady received £1600 pcm and spent it all on stuff that later had to be donated. Her disability qualified her, but her actual need was for a part time voluntary job as she was lonely for people, not stuff.

I then worked somewhere else where one man was in a wheelchair and couldn't tolerate any interaction or he would self harm until he bled. He absolutely doesn't need £1600 of the taxpayers money each month.

Hopefully people like this will be re means assessed. Along with those who receive that amount, never spend it and regularly get benefits cut off because it gets saved and they go over the threshold....

IAPT is designed to treat common mental health problems (you can find the list online: depression, GAD, OCD, PTSD, panic disorder, several others), however having a diagnosis of an SMI doesn't preclude someone from IAPT intervention as long as their presenting problem and symptoms is one of the disorders they treat, rather than symptoms of their SMI. Suicidal ideation isn't a barrier, however the presence of plans/intent does mean someone isn't suitable for IAPT.

If someone's presenting problem is their SMI or personality disorder they fall under secondary care services, or primary care hubs which have come into force in some areas of the country.

Lots of people claiming PIP and stating they're unable to work are saying it's due to depression and anxiety, which does fall under IAPT. People with SMI whose symptoms are still very much florid will need treatment for something IAPT doesn't offer.

Risk of self harm isn't a concern, if it is not "dangerous", lots of people self harm, it's a part of so many mental health problems and a way a lot of people manage distress.

It's a shame there is such misconception out there about what NHS mental health services do and what's available.

IAPT is designed to treat common mental health problems (you can find the list online: depression, GAD, OCD, PTSD, panic disorder, several others), however having a diagnosis of an SMI doesn't preclude someone from IAPT intervention as long as their presenting problem and symptoms is one of the disorders they treat, rather than symptoms of their SMI. Suicidal ideation isn't a barrier, however the presence of plans/intent does mean someone isn't suitable for IAPT.

If someone's presenting problem is their SMI or personality disorder they fall under secondary care services, or primary care hubs which have come into force in some areas of the country.

Lots of people claiming PIP and stating they're unable to work are saying it's due to depression and anxiety, which does fall under IAPT. People with SMI whose symptoms are still very much florid will need treatment for something IAPT doesn't offer.

Risk of self harm isn't a concern, if it is not "dangerous", lots of people self harm, it's a part of so many mental health problems and a way a lot of people manage distress.

It's a shame there is such misconception out there about what NHS mental health services do and what's available.

IAPT is not available to people with more complex or severe mental illness & also excludes people with more severe ASD & LD (on DSR - dynamic support register), also anyone with current suicidal ideation or high risk of self harm.

I have a type of bipolar disorder & cannot access IAPT.

I think this is a really positive move. It's sadly the case that a lot of people have written themselves off and chucked themselves on the scrap heap, throwing their hands up and saying 'I can't work ever' and then expecting to coast along indefinitely.

There are people that absolutely need that support, and I hope the reforms does a better job of differentiating so the support is there for those who need it, and people who don't are encouraged to re-engage with society.

Work is good for your health, activity and achievement boosts self-esteem, meeting others helps you feel closer to others and part of something. Work isn't really optional, but it's seen as optional amongst huge parts of the country.

I know a lot of people won't like it, and it will feel a bit scary and new for a while, but in the long run I think a lot of people will be glad. Those who say 'there's no support there!', our local Talking Therapies service (used to be called IAPT, they're all over the country) has a team of therapists delivering mental health treatment (with the waiting list being less than six months for all treatments, often a lot less) and also a team of employment advisors that support people with all kinds of job things like applying for jobs, writing CVs, interview skills, accessing funds for clothing and transport, liaising with employers about reasonable adjustments, educating on workplace rights, and many other things.

Unfortunately giving someone longterm open ended indefinite benefits and saying 'you're right, you can't possibly be expected to work' sends the message to that person that they're useless and can't contribute or be productive. Tell someone they can't do something and it often becomes true. That's not fair to anyone.

Also I saw something about how jobseekers allowance might be time-limited and based on contributions and not as low as a result? I think that's fantastic. As it stands if I lost my job I'd get a paltry amount, despite having never claimed benefits before other than child benefit, despite having paid taxes and NI for two decades.

I have a long term progressive disability that leaves me in severe chronic pain on a daily basis, and need a lot of medication to function. I'm also as lefty and liberal as they come. I'm actually impressed by the Labour government tackling this head on. I didn't think they had it in them.

I'm sympathetic, but the government really has no alternative but to revisit disability benefits- the cost has spiralled by about 400% since Covid.
Practically all the increase is for mental health reasons, everyone went through lockdown and all the stresses , so potentially anyone could claim-and looking at the figures this is what has happened.
Disability benefits have always been more generous than out of work benefits, and are therefore more attractive.
I would not be surprised if the whole idea of paying more for disability is revisited, people with disabilities, physical or mental do not usually need more money than the simply unemployed.
It will be unpopular, but that is to be expected- I'm not sure a case can be made that so many more people are now unable to work because of mental health issues than 5 years ago- this increase has not been seen in other countries.

The implications of this are massive.

When someone loses their PIP, their carer loses their carer's allowance and would be treated as a jobseeker for benefit purposes. The "cared for person" would be left to their own devices while their former carer was at work/looking for work.

A lot of claimants have to use some of their PIP (and LCWRA component of UC) to top up their rent, because of the failure to increase local housing allowance rates in line with actual rent.

People under-35 who get PIP are exempt from the rule that caps the housing element of UC at the shared housing rate, they will lose another big chunk of money in addition to the loss of PIP and LCWRA.

Some people stand to lose over £800 a month. Not many people can afford to lose that much money without a considerable degree of hardship.

I'm really worried about the implications of this for a lot of my clients. All my clients have MH issues, many have other health problems as well. They will be absolutely terrified. The proposals seem to be targetting the mentally unwell and will impact them very significantly.

However, I suspect that this may turn out to be another of those things where a government makes a proposal that seems very harsh, creates a hue and cry, then waters it down so that they can claim they've listened and taken on board people's views while achieving exactly what they wanted in the first place.

I just hope I'm right.

I think this is a really positive move. It's sadly the case that a lot of people have written themselves off and chucked themselves on the scrap heap, throwing their hands up and saying 'I can't work ever' and then expecting to coast along indefinitely.

There are people that absolutely need that support, and I hope the reforms does a better job of differentiating so the support is there for those who need it, and people who don't are encouraged to re-engage with society.

Work is good for your health, activity and achievement boosts self-esteem, meeting others helps you feel closer to others and part of something. Work isn't really optional, but it's seen as optional amongst huge parts of the country.

I know a lot of people won't like it, and it will feel a bit scary and new for a while, but in the long run I think a lot of people will be glad. Those who say 'there's no support there!', our local Talking Therapies service (used to be called IAPT, they're all over the country) has a team of therapists delivering mental health treatment (with the waiting list being less than six months for all treatments, often a lot less) and also a team of employment advisors that support people with all kinds of job things like applying for jobs, writing CVs, interview skills, accessing funds for clothing and transport, liaising with employers about reasonable adjustments, educating on workplace rights, and many other things.

Unfortunately giving someone longterm open ended indefinite benefits and saying 'you're right, you can't possibly be expected to work' sends the message to that person that they're useless and can't contribute or be productive. Tell someone they can't do something and it often becomes true. That's not fair to anyone.

Also I saw something about how jobseekers allowance might be time-limited and based on contributions and not as low as a result? I think that's fantastic. As it stands if I lost my job I'd get a paltry amount, despite having never claimed benefits before other than child benefit, despite having paid taxes and NI for two decades.

I have a long term progressive disability that leaves me in severe chronic pain on a daily basis, and need a lot of medication to function. I'm also as lefty and liberal as they come. I'm actually impressed by the Labour government tackling this head on. I didn't think they had it in them.

That depends on the disability- we were mostly talking about rise in claiming for mental health reasons, also figures like that are derived from the disability lobby, which to be honest is unlikely to give a dispassionate view.

I'm sympathetic, but the government really has no alternative but to revisit disability benefits- the cost has spiralled by about 400% since Covid.
Practically all the increase is for mental health reasons, everyone went through lockdown and all the stresses , so potentially anyone could claim-and looking at the figures this is what has happened.
Disability benefits have always been more generous than out of work benefits, and are therefore more attractive.
I would not be surprised if the whole idea of paying more for disability is revisited, people with disabilities, physical or mental do not usually need more money than the simply unemployed.
It will be unpopular, but that is to be expected- I'm not sure a case can be made that so many more people are now unable to work because of mental health issues than 5 years ago- this increase has not been seen in other countries.

I'm sympathetic, but the government really has no alternative but to revisit disability benefits- the cost has spiralled by about 400% since Covid.
Practically all the increase is for mental health reasons, everyone went through lockdown and all the stresses , so potentially anyone could claim-and looking at the figures this is what has happened.
Disability benefits have always been more generous than out of work benefits, and are therefore more attractive.
I would not be surprised if the whole idea of paying more for disability is revisited, people with disabilities, physical or mental do not usually need more money than the simply unemployed.
It will be unpopular, but that is to be expected- I'm not sure a case can be made that so many more people are now unable to work because of mental health issues than 5 years ago- this increase has not been seen in other countries.

I think the problem with fraud is that the government again doesn’t have the money to spend basically using private investigators to track reported possible fraud.

They go the for easy ones. Caught out by a news article or in the papers, evidence sent with cold hard proof photos/videos with links to the wide open social media. Slam dunk cases where it costs only a persons few hours wages.

They have no interested in following Karen to see if she does go to the bingo and Toby alone despite claiming she can not leave her house without a chaperone.

It must be ace having a job where you barely touch your pay and get the best of food, drinks etc for next to nothing.

Most people seem to have given the Tories years before the penny dropped that they were essentially inept. Why after 3 months are people already disappointed with this government ? As usual it’s like bloody football. No sooner has one manager been sacked, the new one is almost immediately criticised on the basis of a few matches.
Absolute short termism and an inability to delay gratification. Unless of course you’re the Conservative Party who always have the benefit of the doubt.

You do know it's not just rich people?

Unless you count a pensioner on under £12k as rich of course