To think that parents should be more responsible for their children’s behaviour in public?

There's plenty of tolerance for children. There's decreasing tolerance for entitled parenting.

I didn't say they should be restrained all the time, however the scenario pp described in the hotel is one where they should be restrained.

🙄 A hotel lobby is not a place for a toddler to explore ffs.

Don't get me wrong, I had my fair share of my toddlers getting into mischief when I had to let go of their hand to pay for something etc, but I never let them explore places that weren't appropriate.

There are places where you can let your toddler explore/run free, and there are places where you have to hold their hand/restrain them for everyone's safety and convenience. It's not rocket science.

You are completely right. If people aren't going to parent their children then stay home with the monsters and don't ruin the experience of gong out for everyone else.

The uk is the worst for children, no one seems to have any tolerance or help for children. When I go to other countries Portugal, Spain, America they are much friendlier for children.

child Friendly isn’t letting children wander anywhere.

there are ways to let the child stretch their legs without just leaving them wandering around into areas they shouldn’t be and if a parent was right behind them while they explored that couldn’t happen.

the UK isn’t child unfriendly, it’s poor parenting unfriendly!

Recently at Euston station I was waiting for someone near to the piano. My train got in sooner than hers by about 30 minutes.

A man fixated on his phone while presumably his 3 young children who were bashing, banging and basically trying to demolish the piano for about 25 minutes. He never looked up from his phone, not once.
The noise and witnessing this was very distressing. The place was full of travellers.

One man stood silently watching, waiting for them to finish.when eventually they did, he sat down and played it beautifully.

A whole station full of people turned with pained expressions looking at these kids and the father who was completely oblivious. He seemingly couldn’t hear any of it despite being stood next to them. All those people and not one approached.

It was the worst of the worst, noise, destruction, zero respect for things not belonging to them, just shocking. Responsible adult could give a shit.

@Sirzy yes, you should stop them going behind the desk. Yes, you should be ensuring they aren’t annoying other people.

But - no you can’t hold their hand or have them on reins 100% of the time. Nor have to go to a soft play if you want them to be able to explore a bit.

If you are in a hotel lobby, waiting to check in or whatever, your toddler has been strapped into a car seat for two hours - yes I think it’s reasonable to let them explore a bit.

That’s what other posters are saying about the UK not being very child friendly - a toddler wandering around in a public space isn’t automatically a nuisance, and they shouldn’t need to be ‘restrained’ at all times unless in a soft play.

Then you hold hands, you use a little life style backpack, you go to soft play. There are plenty of options which don’t include them running around a hotel lobby to the point they can get behind the desk.

You can’t restrain them all the time though, they do need some opportunities to explore.

You can’t keep them restrained 100% of the time unless in a playground or a private space - doesn’t work, especially if you live in a city.

I completely agree Imustlearntocook. I don't think UK is child friendly. The difference is societies that like children, welcome them into a space and don't expect them to be ' controlled' at all. If kids are being loud in a restaurant in Italy or Spain everyone will send them outside. It's not seen particularly as parents responsibility.

Kids playing out on their own, together isn't seen as a threat. Other people will interact with them. You still get a bit of 'wait till I see your mother Giacamo' if they think they've done something naughty but it won't be to tell the mother off for poor parenting.

I am always taken by the aspects of kids books from 50s and 60s which were seen of signs of adventurous characters - like scrumping apples from next door. Which would now be shamed and criminalised.

I agree. I'm all for the village and have no problem with other people speaking to my kids or telling them to be careful or think about whether X is the best thing to do here.

But I think out of the school parents I know (so see them with kids more often and know likely reactions) over a third would bite my head off for speaking / warning / disciplining their child (even if it wasn't discipline).

And I mean if I didn't know them, what they would do. Not because I know them

The parents were unreasonable. I’d have made my child sit down or left if they were all hyped up. Surprised the staff didn’t say something. It’s dangerous too when people are carrying hot drinks

The 19 month old should be restrained by the parents.

I've never had this. In fact I get the opposite when I tell my dc off in public, when I do notice how other people look it's usually sympathetic.

Yes the parents should tell them off and make them sit down.

I do think it’s a bit of a catch 22 though - people don’t take their kids places because it’s not deemed child-friendly / difficult to manage them in a busy cafe etc, so then they don’t learn how to behave in those places.

@Guavafish1 I wouldn’t feel too bad about your 19 month wanting to run around a hotel lobby - IMO these young toddlers can’t really be disciplined / told to behave anyway (only distracted!) and their tottering about is usually harmless as they are small / slow etc.

It’s bigger children running around in a small space that is more disruptive.

I'd smile at you if I saw you correcting your child - more folk need to consistently parent.

Depends on the cafe. The cafe in my gym is always full of noisy kids after their swimming lesson. I accept this and don’t go at those times.

I asked a child to push their scooter not ride it in the supermarket and got a right mouthful from the mother

The UK is child friendly though.
Also, saying "it takes a village' doesn't mean parents aren't responsible for their own kids a part of the village.* *

On the flip side, I get lots of judgemental looks when I tell my DC off for misbehaving in public. Like most things relating to parenting - you're damned if you do and damned if you don't

Some parentsof all generations have allowed their children to be a nuisance to others.

As a kid I wouldn't have been allowed to run around somewhere like a cafe. And not just because it would irritate other customers, but because it would be unsafe for me and the staff.

I wouldn't allow my DD to run around a cafe either. She can go for a walk around (usually with one of us) to explore the new place, but safely and supervised. And she'll be told she can't because if she trips staff with hot food/drinks it could be dangerous.

We have to be able to take kids to public places, and it's not always going to go well, because they need to learn. But it's on parents to teach them the right behaviours, not to just let them run feral.

Controlling a child's behaviour so it doesn't irritate others is the parents' responsibility not 'the village's'. Entitlement is the word that springs to mind - don't have kids if you're not prepared to put the time and effort into training them to be responsible and respectful of others.

You can't have it both ways though. You can't say that you want a village but don't want anyone disciplining other people's dc. And being part of a village means teaching your dc to respect other people and their space, and not letting them behave in a way that negatively affects others.

Basically what you mean is that you want everyone to be kind and understanding with wet blanket parents so that they don't feel bad. You want people to accept poor behaviour from other people's children. For them to look on smiling and say "well parenting is hard isn't it, they're doing a great job" when they are not actually doing a great job.

Personally I think that the UK is very child friendly. But people can only take so much, and they are getting fed up of entitled parents who think that they can opt out of putting the work in to raise their dc to be decent human beings.