Family member awarded enhanced pip - AIBU?

Yea - sorry - daily living not social. The thing is I filled in all the forms snd sent evidence for DS1's last review and heard nothing. Nada. We just continued to get the PIP. I've just sent in the documentation for his last review. The papers were sent 2nd class by post. I had to respond within 4 weeks of the date of the letter. 2 weeks had passed before I received them. The return envelope was 2nd class. I was on my toes and returned 1st class in the defined date. They are taking the piss.

I was on that discussion and I agree, they were really unpleasant - a few posters have commented in the same vein. Unfortunately I’ve had the same problem as you appear to have had in quoting - longer discussion strings tend to bring up the wrong quotes !!

I think comments like this demonstrate how little people know about what it’s like to live as a disabled person. PIP is universal and can be spent in any way that best supports the disabled person. And it’s designed that way for a reason. Every disability is different. No two people are affected by disability in the same way. So what they need to spend the benefit money will depend largely on how they are affected. It’s not a one size fits all system and nor should it be.

There’s an assumption on this thread that spending on disability related need is limited to aids, equipment and care. It’s not. If you’re disabled with very limited mobility you need to buy in services much more than someone without that disability. Think about it. Gardening, cleaning, essential house maintenance, taking care of yourself - bathing/washing/getting on and off the toilet. Shopping - if you’re housebound everything has to be ordered in. If you’re incontinent you have higher energy bills because of increased washing, bathing and laundry. Even changing a light bulb is down to someone else. The list of extra expense is endless. That’s what PIP is for - the extra expense of living with a disability. It’s called Daily Living component for a reason.

Benefit is already paid into the claimants bank account - issuing another bank account and debit card is just another layer of expense and it smacks of mistrust, not to mention discrimination. If the DWP suspect you of fraud they can inspect your bank account statements whenever they like. There are some dreadfully ignorant opinions here.

Sorry I meant to quote the poster (20year renovation I think? )who is insistent that benefit bank accounts should be introduced!

@PocketSand I think this is also adds to confusion. Everyone has an assessment in some form. DS1 has had an assessment, a paper based assessment.

There are points for not being able to undertake any journey because it would cause overwhelming psychological distress. Support with bathing and eating are also looked at under the daily living activities. For example, someone who needs physical help to wash will score more points than those who ‘only’ need prompting.

@Barberries people with mental health difficulties can qualify for enhanced mobility if cannot follow the route of a familiar journey without another person, an assistance dog or an orientation aid.

@PocketSand @Barberries

It's not 'social' - I have never seen it described that way!! It's 'daily living'.

I get high rate social and low rate mobility for mental health. I've never had an assessment of any kind, because my medical evidence was solid as a rock- statements from the psychiatrist I've seen monthly for 6 years, the therapist I've seen weekly for 5 years, and fact I've been sectioned for more than 6 months 3 times. The first award was for 2 years and the second was for 4 years.

I have no idea whatsoever how someone with mental health conditions can get high level mobility, that makes no sense.

It can be hard to understand even for those of us with direct experience. DS1 has never had assessment - DWP spoke to OT. He is very severely affected on a functional level by his autism which causes severe social anxiety such that he is practically housebound. He gets high level social and standard rate mobility. With review every 3 years.

DS2 was assessed on transfer to PIP from DLA. With the outcome that he also gets high rate social and standard rate mobility. Exactly the same number of points. But he is far less functionally disabled by his autism/ADHD. In that he is not housebound if that is not setting the bar too low. He was at 6th form at the time of review and now starting uni. PIP supports those with disabilities to achieve independent living.

DS1 has been let down. PIP doesn't meet the needs of those that will never live independently. There are no additional points for being so severely affected by anxiety that you are practically housebound (apart from a secure dog field which is the only outdoor time) and needing a full time carer because you don't eat or bathe or lock yourself in your bedroom if any one including a workman visits the house.

DS2 needs PIP and DSA to beat the odds and be one of the autistic with a job.

DS1 needs PIP and ESA and much better support.

I think that stuck in peoples’ minds because at one time DWP were asking claimants to think about how they were affected on their worst days when filling in the claim form for PIP. Now, the advice has been modified to thinking about how your disability affects you for the majority of days. The questions asked as part of the face to face assessment were supposed to clarify how often the claimant experienced their worst days and how they were affected on the majority of days. Since most PIP claims these days only seem to include a face to face if the extent of the condition can’t be verified any other way, the opportunity for clarification is less. Tricky.

I’ve come across blue badge nosy parkers who think it’s not enough that you’re displaying a current badge. They seem to think they’re entitled to ask you why you have it - the ‘you don’t look very disabled’ crowd. I’ve developed a script for when I’m challenged. It consists of a hard stare and firmly telling them that that how I got the badge is none of their business - it’s current, it’s mine and I’m displaying it correctly. That’s where my obligation ends - anything else is between me and the issuing authority !!

No I stated that it is possible to fly with arthritis and with other disabilities.

I've lost count of the amount of times I've corrected people over the advice of just basing every answer on your worst day. Apparently that's different to not telling the truth?

Actually I didn't get kicked out just left of my own accord as people were just nasty.

I was a member of a few but got kicked out for speaking my mind ! i can't say these were groups where people advised how to claim fraudulently but there were certainly members encouraging others to exaggerate the truth "as it's the only way you'll get an award ". The other issue was posters telling others to "write every answer as if it's your very worst day ". When I pointed out that it's fine to describe a worst day but that you should also specify how often bad days happen as PIP is based on how you are on the majority of days, people would get abusive towards me so I gave up trying to help in the end.

@TomeTome you asked re flying with arthritis. You could but I would think it really difficult if you couldn't elavate your legs. If you had a business class seat this is possible, economy I doubt a eight hour flight wouldn't leave you bent double and in severe pain.
I had to give up my job last December as I couldn't fly anymore. The tax payer lost my substantial tax receipts. I got enhanced pip and that was it. My education and experience has been wasted. Luckily I have a new drug and my health has improved a little. However both my GP and consultant wanted to medically retire me. I refused. I hope to get further improvements after my next treatment. However I will never walk again without aids.

I actually experienced the blue badge abuse yesterday (it hasn't happened for a while). I had my badge inspected from outside the car. I was on a stick ffs. I put it down to my youthful good looks! 😄

Be kind seems to have been forgotten.

There were posters well upthread stating with confidence that there were FB and other social media sites set up to advise on how to claim PIP if you weren’t disabled. I think that’s what’s being referred to here. Like you, I’ve seen various websites and SM groups, including an excellent one called Benefits and Work, who offer advice on how make the best possible claim for PIP by properly describing how your condition affects you from day to day - thus having a better chance of a successful claim first time round and avoiding the stress of appeal. I think there’s a world of difference between that and actively assisting people in committing fraud. DWP are all over claimants’ social media posts these days, so I can’t see how that wouldn’t be picked up.

Yes, I remember seeing a statistic somewhere saying that at the start of the implementation of PIP, one of the largest assessment providers employed over two thousand assessors and only three were doctors. Most are general nurses, physios, OT’s and paramedics.

To be fair this poster sounds like a benefit adviser, and having worked in the same field I don’t think they were exactly pouring scorn on the claimant. I’ve provided a few, hopefully anonymous, examples of my own, but I can see where people are coming from with this one as it could be outing if the claimant is on MN.

As far as the holiday goes, I think the main point was that the claimant was using the backpay from the claim to pay for the holiday. I must admit I found this unusual because IME claimants usually saved any substantial backpay or put it towards a big purchase. Not that I consider booking a holiday with it unreasonable, but it depends on your opinion as to whether PIP should be used wholly for disability related expenditure, and whether a holiday could be considered that. I don’t have an opinion either way - there are no restrictions on how the benefit is spent, and nor do I think there should be.

The posters’ main point has been lost though. The claimant was on the point of reaching age 66 and was awarded the mobility component for ten years on the basis of a condition which can occur as a result of the aging process. This does seem a bit perverse when you think that AA claimants over retirement age don’t have a mobility component because any new mobility conditions after age 66 are deemed age related and not supported.

@Rosscameasdoody IIRC the GMC had some 'misgivings' at the outset and even tho' some doctors were recruited initially they faded away after that

I also think some assessors find that they aren’t suited to the job - sometimes because certain aspect of the nature of the work goes against their ethics as a health professional. I know a few people personally who were recruited and didn’t last long.

It’s also a fact that in the main DWP assessment providers don’t recruit doctors as assessors - they’re largely nurses, physios, paramedics etc, and as such won’t necessarily have any prior experience of the conditions they’re being asked to assess and are relying on the few days training they receive in disability analysis after being recruited.

And I think it’s also only fair to mention that assessment reports are regularly audited, and the auditor can direct the assessor to change any aspect of the report if they think they are being too generous with the points awarded. This is despite the auditor having never even seen the claimant. Are we all getting the picture as to how the system is actually designed to work against the claimant ? Does anyone see why those who work within the system, or have been at the pointy end of it are trying to make the point that defrauding the PIP system is not as ridiculously easy as posters suggest ?

Yeah and the benefit fraud investigators would have a field day - a self-compiled data base of fraudsters/would-be fraudsters to look into

I m not sure there are groups that are actively advocating fraud ,but as I have said on previous threads of this nature ,I'm on various Facebook groups ,for DLA /PIP and I see posters on a regular basis putting in claims for very tenuous reasons, and I think some people probably do join the groups to Pick up tips ,
That said they are generally not successful.

So will I. Waiting with bated breath as we speak !!

I totally agree, also the fact that she booked a holiday is no one's business either. Being disabled with mobility problems can make life harder, not impossible. It is not fair to basically pour scorn on the fact that she dared to go on holiday.

@TomeTome Sincere apologies - misunderstood your post as saying you couldn’t fly to India with these disabilities. Either my eyesight is on the blink, or my blood pressure is through the roof at some of these replies. Sorry, I’ll get it deleted now and book an eye test !!