To be deflated by the total indifference to harm being normalised on maternity wards

@VesperLind could you please private message me your friend’s work contact details. I need a lawyer for this exact reason. Both myself and my daughter were failed and have both been left with life changing disabilities and multiple painful surgeries.

I've just given birth and it was quite frankly shocking. Without my partner being as incredible as he is I'd have been absolutely screwed. My epidural failed. I'd told them multiple times I thought it had, was having pain at the site and was able to get up and down off the bed and pee independently. They realised when the surgeon was prepping to cut me.

There was a point that DP and I were both asking for a midwife to help while I'm literally pushing and it was just me and him.

Zero pain relief after an epi and instrumental birth. Kept being promised something or another then after repeatedly chasing it up being told I couldn't have it after all.

My DP was constantly having to advocate and protect me and fill in the gaps of their lack of care. There are some lovely midwives but the service is just not at the level it should be.

I can still hear the nursing staff shout 'you're pregnant not ill' with glee to recovering mothers who could barely walk trying to get some water or change bloodstained sheets. I will never ever forget, forgive or have another child because of my experiences (much more to it than what I've described). You can say it's money all you want but it's culture.

My ex is an obstetrician and he used to say the same, that he was called in too late

It’s bad and I don’t know what the answer is but I work in a unit that was recently rated “good” and can honestly say the midwives here are the most caring, dedicated bunch of ladies I have ever met.
There are a lot of patients who choose to have their babies here despite it being further away from the nearest hospital.

The midwives are so passionate and committed to their job.

It is possible for hospitals to provide a good service with the right management and team. I have also worked at units that simply are not, and never will be, fit for purpose. The best team in the world would not make it decent. Sometimes it’s just the fact that the building is crumbling and there aren’t enough rooms/beds/chairs to accommodate everyone even if lots of wonderful staff were magically recruited.

I think the british public are basically taught from an early age to be grateful to the NHS. I had mine abroad, there are no midwives, you have to actually hire one privately if you want one. I had nurses and an obstetrician. I actually think the whole “get back to natural births” has gone shit for women. It’s fine if you want to but the standard should be epidural offered, obstetrician present. My obstetrician worked in the NHS for a stint, she said that midwives regularly called her too late for her to mount effective interventions.

I did get harassed by a breastfeeding person who my Dh eventually chucked out because I was getting quite distressed.

I'd also like to bookmark this thread to link to on all the silly "why were you so selfish to only have one child" threads.

Err, so we didn't die the second time round and potentially leave two children without a mother.

Or be horribly injured and need surgery.

Or just have an awful experience.

They did, but maternity services were poor before 2010 as well.

It’s shit. I remember the mumsnet campaign. I’m not sure anything has improved. All bar one midwife I’ve met treat me worse than an animal in the hospital - horrible attitudes, no pain relief, filthy toilets covered in blood and no toilet roll, the noise and the heat is unbearable, the tv coming on over your face at 6am, the food if you can get any is awful. It’s torture. But you didn’t actually die and your baby didn’t die so you have to be grateful.

The stories ran the NHS (and all public services) into the ground.

One of the main factors preventing complaints has to be that it’s the last thing you have time or inclination to be doing once you leave hospital with a newborn baby.

I had a reasonable experience with an induction but mainly because my waters broke during first examination so I was quickly sent to the labour ward. Otherwise there were women who had been on the ward for over a week waiting to have waters broken.

The aftercare from my csection was horrendous, my DH had to leave at 2am, 2 hours after the surgery, he wasn’t even allowed onto the ward to help unpack my bags to get what I needed for the night. I basically sat holding baby from 2am until 9am when visiting hours started with no way to get food for him, nappies or anything for myself. I wasn’t offered any pain relief as they forgot I needed it. A midwife waited at the end of my bed to discharge me at midnight, exactly 24 hours after the section, because they needed the bed.

I don’t know what the answer is but you only have to spend 10 minutes reading threads on Mumsnet to see how quick some women are to tear each other down. I imagine it’s a similar attitude in the NHS maternity services.

Agree. Best births for me were ds2 delivered by a paramedic as he came in twenty mins.. and ds3 with a planned home birth as assumed I wouldn’t make it to hospital. And I wouldn’t have. Lovely home birth midwives, care was amazing.
hospital birth with first child was horrific.

What a rude and simplistic reply.

We cant judge the 'best' way to give birth without deciding on what measure(s) were using to define 'best'.

The PP quite likely has her own definition. Just as RCOG has theirs.

That you include 'cost' in your list speaks volumes.

As we know from this thread, the long term 'costs' aren't even spoken about. In fact, they're often silenced quite forcefully.

Because there is a lack of understanding about how dangerous giving birth is. It used to kill lots of women. Just because it's 'natural'
doesn't mean it's not without risk.
The stakes are very high and the compensation is huge as it's often to cover lifelong care for an infant born alive but with brain injury

Well it’s just care for women in a patriarchal society what do you expect op…

This is why I had all my babies at home with independent midwives. No way was I going into the lottery that is NHS maternity care. Best money I ever spent.

Deleted comment as thread moved on and general discussion feels inappropriate.

I am sorry for everyone's experiences

@LikeWeUsedToBe
I'm so sorry. That's horrendous and such a bloody unnecessary outcome. It's the lasting trauma of these experiences that gets overlooked. Hoping you can get the help you need soon (took me 5 years) x

I'm so sorry. This is so commonplace that surely they'd rather start listening than having to deal with these emergencies? Surely it would make an individual's life easier?

I had similar. Wasn't my first baby and I told them how I labour. They of course knew better. They actually told me off for making noises on induction ward as I was upsetting other patients. I said my waters had broken they said I had wet myself. Student midwife comes in to ask who's waters had broken as there was maconion laced waters in the corridor. Midwife in charge was soooo angry with her for showing her up. Then left me to labour without a midwife on the induction ward with other women.they I ly believed me when his head was out. Had to transfer to labour ward with his head crowning and hip from one bed to another with his head literally hanging out. He was supposed to have extra checks with paediatrician as soon as he was born but didn't get them as they had refused to believe I was in labour. Luckily he was ok but had he not been?

Oh and I was derided even gas and air as "you are not in labour". It was like a torture experience.

Had a letter from the constant for my last baby explicitly saying give her gas and air when she asks as she labours fast and had traumatic experiences last two labours..... midwife's overruled the consultant said it's not policy and refused me gas and air. Refused to listen when I said something isn't right. Left me for hours screaming in pain without pain relief before accepting I needed an emergency section because baby was pushing my bladder out in front of him. And over two years later I've still not had proper investigation into what's going on with my bladder following that. Just last month I was given a self catheter and I lost so much fucking weight from the edema that had built up because I can't piss. I would have a functional bladder had they listened to me when I said hours earlier something is wrong. But they won't listen to us

You really do know. I felt this intense pelvic floor pressure as I went to fully dilated and genuinely mooed like a cow. But the default seems to be this weirdly belligerent "attack is the best form of defense" whereby anything you ask or suggest which contradicts the clipboard gets scoffed at.

You just have to look at the numerous threads on here that say how grateful we should be for the nhs and we shouldn't slag it off to see why these things are allowed to slide. I read a thread yesterday about a woman suffering with other patients screaming, nurses talking loudly, poor treatment and the replies were all you should be grateful etc.......

No we shouldn't, we should demand more. After major abdominal surgery men would not be discharged without pain medication but thousands of woman daily are after a c section. Woman are left in unsafe/unclean situations on maternity wards every single day. It needs to stop.

Talking in mum and baby groups post a tally. Seems like c section/ induction is a dirty word. Anything other than birthing pool and breathing baby out is failure. Weird thinking

I think the run up to childbirth with the woo woo NCT classes affecting what women can realistically expect. They had pictures of candles in a delivery suite. Lol you're lucky if you get a midwife and not waiting for days. I waited 4 days to go to labour ward. I didn't care about candles. I would go for elective c section next time to eliminate risk associated with unscheduled care

people are expecting a magical experience, you don't get that when someone has a tumour removed. I don't think you can fully separate the horror most people feel the first time they are in hospital from maternity services, which is the first hospital stay in a lot of cases, which is one of the issues.
Completely disagree. Women go in expecting pain, exhaustion and mess but also basic respect and human decency. I and many other women had been to hospital before having babies. It doesn't have to be a horror. It is good that women are shocked and angry at neglect and negligence, at being left in pain, filth and blood, without access to food or water and treated like a nuisance. Nobody should expect that or get used to that.

I would object to money being moved into maternity from anywhere else, the list of issues in the articles are happening everywhere and to allocate resources on something as subjective as patient satisfaction and demand would further penalise those who cannot argue for themselves, the people on dementia wards who don't even get help to eat before their meals are binned, for example.
my meals were binned before I could eat them when I was in hospital with hyperemesis because I was too weak to walk to the eating area. Eating at yo bed wasn't allowed. The nurses made it very clear what an inconvenience I was and had I tried ginger and eating little and often? You dismiss "patient satisfaction" on a thread were people are discussing PTSD, serious untreated injuries like severe tears and risk to life of baby and mother. Not to mention pretty objective things like bloody sheets.

I suspect a lot of the safety, privacy and dignity concerns come from the constant presence of other people's male partners on the wards. That was the only really horrible thing in maternity compared to elsewhere
Most men are there advocating for their wives and partners (who are often bedbound, traumatised and exhausted) and are kicked out in the evening.Again IME staff managed to make the maternity ward a pretty horrible environment on their own.