To envy my sister's freedom?

Yes that’s how I read it too.

Completely agree - the amount of women on here complaining about their partners yet they are choosing to have children with them, often multiple children, then in uproar when their relationship ends with said shit partner and start demanding their child free “me time”.

It’s selfish and cruel. If as a Mother you aren’t prepared to take on full responsibility and care for your offspring, if need be, then you shouldn’t be having them.

It isn't either/or definitely. When I was younger I wanted a different kind of life, big birthday nights out, girly holidays etc. I did all of that travelled and lived life, and kids wouldn't have been part of it. I would not have wanted them at that point.

Now I have different wants/and needs. I would be envious of family Christmases, the build up with santa etc, birthdays, Easter, tooth fairy, halloween, all of the cool things you can do with your children. I love seeing dc's faces light up on Christmas morning, all of the build up, doing all the fun things! With not having dcs too young I have experienced both, and I wouldn't trade it for the world. We get time to ourselves still, now they're at school, and meals on own, all our evenings when they're in bed. They're pretty good kids anyway tbh. As cliche qs it sounds they've made me into a better person, less selfish somehow, and happier overall, less petty over stupid things.

What an odd comment. ’The childfree’, who are you referring to, cattle?

I went to the theatre and had lots of fun, with a friend. I didn’t realise you could only do that with a daughter!

Some people will, I’d expect people who’d like to have children but for some reason can’t.

But sometimes it’s like saying ‘don’t worry about feeling envy at people who have disposable income and can buy whatever they want, I’m sure sometimes they envy your money worries too!’ 😂

Not every scenario has an inverse one to match.

Also the stereotype that every childfree woman is well-off financially, has lots of holidays etc. I suppose it may depend on if they have a partner but even if they do, not every couple is financially ok. And if single, well statistically single childfree/childless women are amongst the poorest group in society. Probably because it's so expensive living alone.

I'm lucky. I wanted children and got the life I chose. I also enjoy family holidays (and know I'll miss them when my DC are older). But I'm aware that I'm lucky and not everyone is so lucky to have what they wanted in life.

What's weird about this thread is some people making stereotyped assumptions.

My friend did manage to conceive eventually (after years of trying and fertility treatments). Before that though nobody, not even her family, knew she wanted kids. That's why we were all surprised when she announced her pregnancy.

Of course some people choose to be childfree but it's wrong to assume that everyone who says it's a choice is telling the truth. Turned out it had been too painful for my friend to tell anyone when she thought she'd never have children. Especially as most of the her friendship group including me, and her sister, had children.

My friend's example btw is relevant to the poster who thinks everything in life is a choice. Others have already pointed out that's not the case with many people because of unplanned life events. Infertility is one of those unplanned events.

I read it as ‘every decision has an effect’. If you end up in a life you didn’t choose, there will be a decision behind it.

Not every decision is known to be a bad one at the time of making, however. But I read thread after thread on here where woman have children with ‘useless’ husbands who admit to them being useless before, and I do think well, there is a decision that you made.

DH and I often reminisce about our childfree days and feel a pang of jealousy when our childless friends have spontaneous (and cheap!) holidays during term time, tidy houses, regular nights out. But we look at it as short term pain, long term gain. The time goes quickly and in say 10 years, DC will be older and we will have more time to ourselves, hopefully with the chance for a weekend break or even a full week away without them. And I'm excited for the potential future, the memories we'll make on family holidays, seeing them grow up and make lives for themselves, the big family Christmasses once they start to find partners, hopefully grandchildren one day. So whilst I might have that fleeting jealousy, I'm still happy with my life choice and wouldn't change it.

I certainly never envied anyone with children when I was childfree and planning to remain so.

It does seem to be a not uncommon delusion among a certain type of parent, though. Some people really seem to have a strong need to feel that others envy them, for any reason. You see it on threads here all the time, when someone complains a colleague isn’t polite or a group isn’t including them, and there’s often a cry of ‘They’re just jealous!’ with absolutely zero grounds for thinking so.

Totally normal I think.

I love my life with kids and wouldn’t change it - but in the same way that if I had steak for every meal, I’d probably love a night of sushi, I’d bloody love a week on my own!

We discussed this upthread. And she might. But she equally might not.

I can be pleased that my brother & SIL have a happy family setup while not envying them in the slightest.

I'm not. If anything I'd be critical of the one with children. She made her choice, she has gorgeous children who she and we all adore, and they have a loving and involved auntie. It seems unfair of her to resent her sisters lifestyle.

I am not resentful of the childfree. Especially now my DC are grown and there is nothing more fun than going to the theatre with my DD.

Absolutely. I often felt when I was happily childfree that a minority of other people (not actual friends, but people casually encountered at someone’s barbecue or something) resented the hell out of my ‘easy’ life, as though they hadn’t had the same choice themselves and chosen differently.

Then, when I had DS at 40, the same type of person appeared to resent the ‘easy life’ of having only one child, and I was not infrequently in the bizarre situation of having a total stranger hector me about how ‘an only is a lonely’ and I needed to have another child immediately because otherwise I was being ‘selfish’.

It was hard not to come away with the impression that a certain type of person doesn’t like to see others exercise a choice that makes their lives look, at least from a certain angle, ‘easier’, freer and more prosperous.

I mean, I’m entirely upfront about the fact that I chose to have one child because I wasn’t prepared to make the various compromises that would have been needed for more. I don’t resent people who chose to remain childfree, or people with four children.

Don’t blame your childfree DD if this happens. She’s not responsible for her sister’s choices. And she probably does not resent your DD for her choices at all.

I have a DD with young children, and a DD who is choosing to be child free. So this kind of thing really worries me.

They've always got on well, but I'm already seeing resentment creep in when the DD with children talks about her sister and partner 'having a good life' and going off for weekends/having lie ins.

It really does worry me that their relationship could break down over the different choices they've made.

Of course. Having children sounds dreadful and neverending to me! I'd worry about them constantly and not be able to cope with the guilt of bringing them into all these global crises. It's liberating to know that I'm not leaving anyone behind when I die. I do have a partner, though, so maybe I'd feel more lonely or scared without him.

No, I don’t understand at all.

Jealousy is not an emotion I have ever felt.
I do know that’s probably not the norm.
Maybe it’s a mindset but my DD is the same, we were having a discussion about it the other day.

Every mentally well adult has the life they choose. 100s and 100s of decisions over years have led you to where you are today. So your situation is your choice. If you have serious envy, then that may mean you've made a series of stacked up bad decisions that have led to a place you don't want to be in

This is such a horrible mentality that’s basically designed to excuse you from having any compassion for anyone ever.

It’s also so demonstrably inaccurate that it’s laughable.

Agreed. Think someone needs to do a little reading about structures and agency. Or, you know, just engage their critical thinking skills for a few seconds.

Completely normal to feel a bit jealous. But whilst she’s child free by choice I’m sure she has moments when she’s jealous of your family set up too

If you choose to get married and have children, you know that you are choosing a life that may put you in a position of being a single mother - it's a risk because men leave, men die unexpectedly. But the underlying choice to have children puts you on that path. If you don't want to take that risk, don't have children.

This! The amount of posts on here from single Mums whining about their ex’s dropping the kids off early and not getting enough of their precious child free time, maybe they should have taken more consideration into whether they actually wanted children in the first place because this will always be a risk.

I think this is naive

We have some control over our destiny, but many of our choices are shaped by circumstances outwith our control

I think a bit of envy is a totally normal thing, and it’s what keeps the world turning!

My best friend is child free. I absolutely am envious of her frequent and expensive holidays! But that’s fine, we just have different lives, it doesn’t mean I want to swap to hers.

You can’t always choose the life you want. I didn’t choose to be unable to have children. What I did choose though was to make the best of it and use the freedom. now like the lifeI have as much as if I had chosen it, IYSWIM.