Am at a loss to how to deal with 13 yo stealing

There are a lot of amateur psychologists on here! We have no idea whether she is unhappy or just does things to push boundaries and finds that there are zero consequences so carries on doing them.

I think the responses to stealing would be very different if OP’s daughter had been stealing from their daughter at school! And that is what will happen if it isn’t nipped in the bud.

Reducing screen time or taking the phone is win/win. She will probably feel a lot better if her screen time is reduced anyway and have to engage with her family more. And who is to know what is going on online.

There need to be meaningful consequences in terms of lost privileges for theft (and rudeness). Support is all about help and praise, but also about meaningful boundaries. And privileges can be earned back by good behaviour.

What happens when you let the dust settle and talk with her when she's calm, does the response change? My dd will trot out the "I don't care" line out of spite and in the heat of the moment. But when she (and I!) are calmer, the response is different. She's 7, though, not 13.

I second what others have said about your dh having no right to dictate when or how to support your dd when he's away so much and you're left dealing with the situation. She needs help, as do you and your other dd. Both my dh and I and our 13yo ds have locks on our doors, because when dd is dysregulated, she doesn't respect personal boundaries. Your other dd needs to know that her bedroom is her safe space.

If accessing money for counselling etc is difficult then I'd recommend two things: 1. Reading The Explosive Child (to help you more immediately with the challenges). 2. Referral to CAMHS (for longer term mental health support for your dd). I agree with a pp that her picking fault with the food you cook and then refusing to ear it could be an indication of a more deep seated eating disorder.

I’d cut her phone off and any privileges she might have. Basics only until her behaviour improves. She’s got the upper hand in your home and things will only get worse unless you turn this around

Thinking I must have grown up in a strange family/time.
We fought like cats and dogs - not physically as we left early childhood - but arguing one day best mates the next. Insulting each other? Constantly. ( But you insult my brother, and you will know about it) Ever found a frog in your bed ? Muuuuum! Officially traumatised.
My mum was the worst cook in the world. 'Don't eat it, then.'
'Stealing' perfume? Come off it. Steal and hide/dispose of a bottle is different to having a squirt?
My little sister would help herself from my wardrobe. I wanted a big sis like my friend - the best I could do was nick my brother's Brut, or their (too big) shirts. I wasn't into skin care, but if I was, I'd have opened the drawer and helped my self to my Mum's, who would have shown me how to use it. Oh dear, theft and disrespect!
Stealing money, that's a different matter - but you only suspect - be sure before you deal with that. Intentionally depriving you or her sister of treasured goods, taking them and hiding them or disposing of them needs looking at, as she is angry, but a lot of this is being 13.
You expect a fight if you take her phone? Punching the walls? Firstly I'd be looking at her menstrual cycle, then I would want to know what was on that phone.
You sound very insular people. Do you not share?
'Muuum, she's wearing my jumper!' 'Give it back, you have plenty of your own.'
I'm living in a strange world, where having a dab at Mum's cleanser or a squirt of someone's perfume is stealing.
Stealing my husbands razor in a minute, my legs need doing, cannot be arsed to get mine.

I don't want to hurt you at what is a painful time for your family, but your family sounds very unhappy.

Your husband sounds, while mostly absent under the excuse of providing, controlling and domineering. You sound a bit scared of him. You don't want to 'make him mad' but that's preventing you making decisions that would benefit your family. And he doesn't get to make unilateral decisions when he's barely around to parent in person. What would it be like if he was around more? Do your children witness this controlling behaviour first hand? How does he 'get mad'?

Your daughter is exhibiting both typical teenage behaviour and other worrying signs outside the norm. I think the phone is possibly a bit of a red herring as she seems to be clinging to it for comfort. As another pp suggested, I'd really think she needs therapy to find out what's going on with her.

My mother would have said I was a very sulky and impossible teenager (not badly behaved) but I basically disconnected from them because I was sexually assaulted from 11-12. I knew from their relationship with me before that I could never go to them and tell them (because they were in some ways also quite controlling and had anger issues... sound familiar?) so I just stopped trying to have a relationship with them. Even now in my 30s I have a strained relationship with them and they have no idea why and would never try and find out. They know I've had therapy but they're bewildered by it.

I'm not trying to scare you but my first reaction after reading was that your daughter sounds very unhappy. And my second was that your husband sounds unpleasant. And the third is that you're only addressing the very fringes of her behaviour - what you call 'stealing', wondering why someone would say she sounds happy because she has 'everything', worrying about her phone - but have you tried sitting and just talking to her, when she's not in a rage?

You say she refuses to eat all her food every night, could she really be criticising your cooking and then refusing to eat it all because she's actually developed an issue with food, and trying to hide the fact I wonder?

Is she a healthy weight? You need to look for any signs as to why she's lashing out at you.

Can you make the connection between your unhappy daughter and her essentially absent father? She's got very little she can control in her life, so she's exerting control where she can. Yes you need to draw boundaries, but painful as it is, maybe you need to look at how your marriage is working for your daughter just now. How's your older daughter doing? How do you feel about it? Are you happy with your husband as things stand?

What has he suggested you do? Your child needs support as her behaviour is a cry for help

Op, the way you describe your dh is quite cold and aloof. It also sounds like he holds the purse strings, in addition to spending a lot of time away from home? Could there be some challenging family dynamics going on that may be affecting your dd's behaviour?

If my 13yo ds stole from me, I'd explain that if he needs something he should speak to me about it and we'll work something out. And if he continued to do it, I'd reduce his allowance to pay me back. Stealing (or "borrowing") makeup and perfume though is fairly standard teenage behaviour.

Your dd sounds quite explosive though, and it sounds like there could be more going on here than standard teen behaviour. Does she ever show any remorse for what she's done? What does she say in response? How do you deal with the situations when they arise?

All behaviour is communication. Your DD sounds unhappy

Attention seeking behaviour is a sign of a child craving attention. You could respond with loving concern, but you do need to implement boundaries. This isn't the soft option

Arbitrary punishments like removing her phone won't solve anything. Focus on actions and consequences eg tell her the night before what you're cooking for dinner. If she doesn't want it, she cooks for herself

Do your local authority offer parenting courses eg Triple P, Teens Plus? This might help you

And, if yiu can afford perfume and skin care products, you can afford bedroom locks. Don't make excuses to continue the status quo

This response right here, I can't make her, is why she is walking all over you. She's your child so yes you can make her, that's how you parent. If she escalated aggression you need to ask for help outside the home as that's not normal behaviour

Quite aside from the issues with your daughter, it sounds as though you are being financially abused and controlled. Would he withhold money from you if you wanted to go to counselling?

Age 11 is a big transitional time for adolescents as they go from primary school to high school. Have you spoken to her school to see if she can access support there? Some have their own counsellors or can sign post you to local support services. CAMHS tend to have long waiting lists and can be picky with who they support
Just remember, behaviour is communication and she seems to be communicating that she's not happy.
As a side note. Its quite concerning that your reluctance to getting dd support is influenced by your husband withholding money. Is he controlling in other ways?

I wouldn't see using my make up etc as stealing ,my DC definitely did this
Shr does seem unhappy and counselling might help

My first question would be, how is she at school? If she is well (or even better) behaved there, then boundaries work for her.

IMO teens want and need boundaries and enforcement. It shows the that you care. The concept of any punishment meaning you ‘lose’ them is diametrically opposed to all research.

I second taking the phone and making her earn it back by good behaviour. You don’t even need to physically take it, just put it on an app like ‘Apple Family’ and turn it using that. I think phones are pretty intense anyway and a rest would probably do her good.

As to the stealing (and it is stealing), I think you should allow your DD1 to lock her door. You can have a key when you need access. She deserves to have security of her possessions. And lock your own door as well.

The loss of phone and the inability to enter rooms that aren’t hers should make her realise that she can’t be behave how she likes without consequences. Talk to her about what she needs to do to win back trust. And find other things to reward good behaviour with. Look for things to praise her for.

I would talk with her about therapy, but there is no point unless she actually wants to engage.

Get her a large lockable box or a door with a code lock that only she and you have the code to.

Are there any other siblings on the scene?

To some kids increased discipline will enforce them doing the bad behaviour more because bad behaviour = rush of dopamine from the attention they get. It's a cycle. Even when there is positive attention.

Approach discipline as something you teach.

Child going through puberty with an absent father, phone addiction, being screamed at by a mum under financial pressure isn't going to fix herself.

Your husband is hardly there so he can't control getting help for your child. You need to get a GP referral for mental health, she's not going to tell you why she acts like she does at this point.

You would benefit from a part time job too for your mental health and to not be dependent on a man you don't want to make angry about money.

2 years later

A lock on a bedroom door won't work, my brother smashed the lock on my bedroom door when I was a teen. He smashed my room up too for doing it. I had to install the lock myself because my mother wouldn't listen, he ripped it off the door.

If she's already getting violent, you need to show her that violence has consequences.