Disagreement with in laws and moving forward

This will invariably turn into another exercise in the interminable AIBU sport of 'kick the OP'. The responses were predictable.

Probably.

I suspect this isn't a one off incident but a pattern of behavior - I'm just surprised Op got to teen years and not learnt to politely convey - wind your neck in with IL or deal with young friends and family who are less polite than you'd expect.

How old is your child? Seems a bit unnecessary to make a big deal out of the phone on a birthday meal. It sounds like you are talking to a 5 year old not a teenager. His response was clearly unacceptable though, as was your FIL's. So plenty of blame to go round I'd say.

Not a fan of phones at meals either..it is rude, and your nephew and FIL were rude. If you are still upset about it, tell both you won’t tolerate being spoken to like that…it was disrespectful and a challenge to your authority and judgment. . Their choice whether to apologise; your choice what you want to do after that. Mostly though, you are carrying around a lot of emotional hurt about this, and that is not great for you. I’m not sure, but maybe you have been steamrolled by family in the past, and then ridiculed when you protest. If the latter is true, that has to stop…that is no good.

Not really thinking it necessary to invoke MH problems as a cause of OP’s actions or decision not to let their teenagers have a phone, or because they are upset for being rudely treated. Some people are more emotionally sensitive. That doesn’t meant they are mentally ill.

However, speaking of MH, I might mention that there have been some studies that show increased social media usage/phone use can lead to poor mental health for adolescents, so much so, some secondary schools are banning phones. Phones also interfere with face to face interaction and community building in schools. I noticed huge upticks in MH problems and decreased attention span over the 30 years I taught university students, and whilst correlation may not necessarily be tied to causation, these issues seemed to start with increased mobile phone usage/social media. I told my students to turn them off during lectures and seminars so they would focus better. Performance was better when they weren’t looking at You Tube.

I don’t have a phone, just an Ipad without a SIM. My life is a lot more peaceful and I can focus on things much better without distractions, notifications, etc.
YMMV.

Boundaries are boundaries!

Just out of curiosity what ages are your children ? What age is your nephew ?

Thinking about it, I think you’re going to have a bumpy few years ahead as your children enter their teens if you’re isolating yourself from your family over this, @shill4nuttn

They aren’t biddable wee things and they will kick against such tight restrictions.

It sounds like you’re all as rude as each other! Your nephew sounds like a prize bellend, but what on earth did you have to tell his mum what to do for?! I expect your FIL was tactless trying to end things.

You aren’t in survival mode, you’re embarrassed that this went down so badly. Pick your battles next time, it doesn’t sound like people were staring into their phones at the expense of interacting with others.

This will invariably turn into another exercise in the interminable AIBU sport of 'kick the OP'. The responses were predictable.

It's not a battle I'd have chosen and your rule is rather strict and might have been waived at a birthday celebration. But you're quite right that being glued to phones at the table is rude, that your nephew was exceptionally rude, and as for FiL justifying and excusing that rudeness over the parents' authority and agreed ways of raising their own child, that is so far out of line as to be inexcusable.

He won't apologise - arrogant men like this never do - so setting this as a term for moving forward is really pretty pointless.The only thing that's in your control is whether you apologise yourself to keep the peace (I wouldn't) or decide how often you are willing to be in his presence and open yourself up to further behaviour of this sort.

Nephew can be excused on account of his youth, but FiL had no business undermining you in this way. I'd take a big step back, avoid him as much as possible, and deploy 'grey rock' whenever circumstances do not allow for this. And if he brings it up again, I'd be tempted to tell him to go eat a peach.

We have a no phones at the dinner table policy in our household but I wouldn’t have died on that hill when out in a restaurant for a birthday celebration.

Same.

I've had years of IL trying to undermine DH and I and managed to push back without going into survival mode - we all generally move on to polite never mentioning it again even if we simmer afterwards.

Ironically one of last things MIL tried with was trying to say it didn't matter that kids had their phones at dinner table in our house - that was met from me with 20 minutes won't kill them. Now they often complain - often non verbal or few digs usually aimed at me -they are on them when we are out for a meal - thing is DH often is as well and sometimes places are noisy and chaotic and it helps them though all that - so it make it hard to say anything - I do give looks but they are often ignored.

I'd not keen with the cousin being rude - but a polite smile and a well the food is here and I'd rather focus on that - rather than complaining to his mother may well have been better way of dealing with it. I expect FIL felt he had to defend his DGC from you or defuse the cousin parents losing it at you.

There is a time and a place for everything, don't you think? You are an adult and you could have given him (your son) a LOOK. He would have understood.

It sounds like your fil could have been a bit more polite.
But you need to stop being so controlling. He was interacting with his cousin . And it's his birthday meal. Are they not more important then you being overly controlling about phones.
Would one time at dinner been that bad??
Or is it a case of showing how much power you have over your child?
As for telling your sister or sil to rein in her child. Well you should not have done that .
You will find your child runs for the hills as soon as he gets a bit older. And you can't dictate what he can and cannot do .
Pick your battles with teenagers!

With the teenage years ahead of you, I do think you possibly need to get better at choosing your battles and being a bit more sensitive to the context.

I think your son's cousin sounds like a little shit but you won't convince the rest or the family about that so best to just drop it and not invite him to anything you organise in the future.

Yeah we also have a no phones at the dinner table rule, but I think at a birthday dinner in a restaurant with teens it's not really a hill to die on. There's always a time to just let the rules flex a bit, and this was it. Everyone has been dramatic here and created a storm in a teacup, and to be in survival mode and isolating yourself from your family over this is ludicrous.

Asking her son to put a phone down as food is served is not ‘starting something’. But just to be clear, the cousin ‘started it’ by getting involved with something nothing to do with him.

OP

the cousin is a rude twat. It’s one thing if he had possibly misunderstood and said “it’s ok, I’ve said he can use it”, thinking that you thought your son had taken it without permission.
but that’s not what happened.

the cousin thinks your rule of no phones for your son and then no phones while eating is ridiculous and so he feels emboldened to be directly challenging and defiant of you. He used autocratic as his put down because he thinks he’s clever and tried to shame you into backing down.

it wasn’t remotely his place to try to over rule you but I Suspect you’ll get nowhere with the family as they clearly don’t agree with you and so won’t back you up. Plus are happy to blame you for the scene caused entirely by the cousin getting involved and thinking he somehow had a say.

id be talking to your DH and making clear that you won’t be changing your agreed (with him) rules based on an annoying cousins say so.

Why have you and your teen nephew had less than three words between you? Sounds like a huge backstory. In your shoes, I may have been a bit annoyed but not really angry. And sometimes, especially with teens, its good to back out and let things flow. If you hardly talk to this nephew then you hardly see them so its unlikely their behaviour will hugely influence your son. Oh, and everyone else is overreacting too. FIL, DH.
Just let it go. Life has many other things worth investing emotions in. A phone at the table once in your boy's life is not one of them

I think you need to relax a bit. I also have the same rule. But I don’t see why your son couldn’t just look at someone else’s phone.

Even a young teen can understand, that he might have been allowed then but the rules stand the test of the time.

You then describe what the teen said as ‘an attack’. No wonder you were taken aback. If you blow a teenager making a comment up into an attack you will be shocked a lot.

You are also very about your complaint to the mum. But telling her to rein her own in is, imo, worse than what the teen did and you are an adult.

Given the massive deal you are making about this I am going to guess Fil didn’t tell you to shut up. Or you were carrying on more, just playing down your part in it.

This is what I don't understand, either.

How can there be a rule over something which nobody even owns?

You sound very uptight and old fashioned in your views. I suspect this is one of many behaviours. You were out for a meal with family relax. You started then had ago at the mother about her child and utilmately you didn't like everyone else disagreed with you at the table.

If this has put you into survival mode, god forbid anything really serious happened in your life.

I think you embarrassed your son, and embarrassed yourself by doing so.

We have a no phones at the dinner table policy in our household but I wouldn’t have died on that hill when out in a restaurant for a birthday celebration.

I probably would have tried to give my DS “the look” but if ignore then just left it. I also wouldn’t have said anything to the mum about her child’s behaviour. That is always going to stir up trouble. I would have just thought he’s a little shit in my head and silently seethed.

God, all those rules and enforcement sound absolutely joyless and suffocating. Why don’t your children have phones? They must feel so isolated.

Be careful OP, it sounds like you might be creating the type of home environment your kids wont be able to wait to get away from.

You started it.

YABVU, and sounds like you ruined your son’s birthday meal with extended family.

You told your son not to look at the video on the phone his cousin was showing him. Cousin said it was fine. You disputed that, said cousin could look at his own phone but not show it to your son. Cousin said you were “autocratic” (props for excellent vocab, and he does have a point).

You were so outraged that a young man argued back you told his mother publicly to “rein him in”. (More autocratic behaviour). Your FIL told you to stop it (“basically told me to shut up”) and let your son enjoy his birthday celebration.

Your mood meant the rest of the meal was “awkward.” And then you went home to fight with your husband.

Your poor son! You’ve behaved badly, shown yourself up in front of extended family and ruined his celebration. You owe him an apology.

Your FIL certainly doesn’t need to apologise to you. “Survival mode” is melodramatic nonsense.