Dd screams for hours if she doesn't get her own way

Hi there,
I have worked with children for over 20 years, have children myself.....
Sorry about your predicament, but it's now time for tough love.
Say ' no' , be firm, repetition is key, repeat it 100 times or more, every 5 seconds take a breath and repeat, sit down, say it , and repeat ..you must turn yourself into a ' robot' and do this.
She will scream and shout for hours, but,eventually, her body will give in, even if she's still cross and the anger will turn to tears .
She will cry and shout and possibly stamp her feet etc but this is ' training' her body and mind to eventually realise it is not acceptable.
I'm sure I don't need to tell you that your boundary setting is helping her in the long term to achieve both socially and academically....
It's tough, it may take a whole week if doing this every day, can you take time off? She may relapse and do this again a month down the line , or if there's a change at home/ school etc. but you need to become that repetitive ' robot'.
Consequences may also work in conjunction with this, but only the ' robot' will work first ( you've gone past this stage).
I wish you all the best and be strong, you are the parent ❤️

Then don't put cheese on and if she doesn't eat it then she goes to bed.... if my kids are like this I do that. When they say they are hungry in bed, they then get the option of a piece of fruit. My kids are 2 and 4 and don't scream to get there own way. They answer back but they know when it's time to listen to me. Kids need consequences. She wants to scream. Close her door and walk away. Don't give in.

Hatred and anger don’t sound like the thing to me. Hard boundaries are actually not working here.

You need to be absolutely sure this isn’t a neurological or other health condition or that she is isn’t dealing with some other kind of trauma.

Screaming for hours is exhausting and kids don’t just do that for cheese or even to get their own way.

Speak to her, go out somewhere not too stimulating, connect and speak to her and listen to her. Also the school and maybe the GP.

Poor all of you. This must be rubbish for her too. I hope you get to the bottom of what is happening for her.

Absolutely this! She has been given the cheese. It was her choice to eat it all before the rest of the meal. I would tell her from now one she gets the cheese either on top or she could have some on the side to sprinkle over as she eats but once the screaming starts, give her five mins to calm down and eat. If she doesn’t calmly pick up her plate and say dinner is finished now. Food goes in the bin and she goes to have her shower.
She’ll soon realise you mean business and are back in control of the situation

No. That is just utterly cruel.

Hugs and cuddles are considered a reward for the behaviour and would not solve the problem.

Do you give her (age appropriate) choices*, or do you just tell her what to do? I agree with a PP that all behaviour is communication, and screaming is not a sign of a happy child. Why does she need to be so in control? How else can you set boundaries without making her feel less in control. She is trying to communicate with you, are you communicating with her, or just saying no, then giving in. My ND child used to use screaming as a way to get what they wanted, and shutting them in a room wasn't an option, so I had to stay, and calmly repeat that screaming wouldn't change the situation (sometimes they'd scream for something I literally couldn't provide) and stay with them until they stopped screaming, then we'd talk it through and I'd offer other choices, but not the one they'd screamed for.

Check with school, how does she behave there? It could be that she's pushing harder for control at home because the school day is completely out of her control.

*this means "would you like A or B?" not "what would you like?"

At first my immediate thought was, if she's not understanding no then it maybe she has autism? The spectrum is very broad. I hope things get better for you both. It must be very distressing,draining as well as heat-breaking! The teacher offered some really good advice about consequences in the moment. And another poster maybe the bit about having a reward chart can give the feeling of them being constantly bad, that was also an eye opener. Goodluckkkk prayers are with you both... And yes the posters that are more concerned about the cheese just ✋🏼 have no clue and most likely no kids! P s love how the teacher understood & reassured when said 'eat their weight in cheese'

I don't know if this would work for other kids but when my grandson used to have meltdowns because he'd been denied something I'd put him in a bedroom and he'd scream and scream. After a while I'd go in and start talking in a quiet voice and eventually he'd stop screaming and listen to me. I never mentioned what had caused the problem but offered something else which he would like to do/eat/go see. Obviously we only did anything if he was quiet. Gradually he stopped screaming as much and we got to the stage of being able to negotiate fairly quickly which was much more preferable. He's a lovely boy now.

Make your yes yes and no no. She has learnt kicking off is getting her own way. She’s going to be a nightmare teenager. Nip this in the bud now for your own sanity!

1. Set your stall out, tonight young lady you are going to eat your dinner as I have worked hard to make it and we are lucky to have food, then it’s teeth, story bedtime. If she doesn’t eat it. Offer supper- toast nothing else! Stick to your guns! She won’t starve but she does need to show grace for mealtimes. Model this as parents, ‘thanks mummy for dinner’ says daddy infront of her, que eyebrows to prompt her to do the same/ if not say nothing. Just reinforce by modelling good table manners, you could extend this to no elbows on table etc Always a teaching moment in conflict. If she refuses all food give her time on the step to think about her choice and whether she would like a reward or consequence based upon he decision. Eat dinner or supper or bed with out it no.,.. tomorrow. This gives you and her time to calm and refocus and thinking time is not screaming time, you are breaking the pattern of behaviour here she isn’t used to this new approach. Next rewards and consequences have a good list to refer to depending on what she loves. Whatever she loves take off her, toy, tv afterschool you name it, rewards same whatever she loves give her or get extra off. These are simples rules of social, play nice, do the right thing, make the right choice, things go wel, don’t things don’t go so well. Work and in school/ this is something you could explain to her. Such as if you are good at school likely to have a good day feel happy. Do you notice if you aren’t at your best it’s not so good and you don’t feel so great. One day she will have a job she will have to do exactly what her boss says much like teachers at school and her parents at home, tell her.

Tell her to her eyes when she is shouting in a low firm voice. ‘I’m not listening to you when you are shouting so calm yourself down and take a breath’. I shall listen when you talk nicely to me. Dont get into an argument, take a step back. Let her scream the house down all week, get some cotton wool for your ears. Four days in she will crack because seriously you are the parent and you need to teach her grace at mealtimes and kicking off is no way to get your needs met plus she isn’t going to have many friends screaming for her own way. Tell her this she will learn early on she has to sit down communicate better than she is doing. Also tell her when I say no I mean no, badgering and screaming is not going to work anymore you are old enough to understand this is not good behaviour. You are choosing to not listen to me and that’s not good behaviour.

Also when her behaviour is off, do you scream like this at school? Maybe we shall have to speak to your teacher about this if this carries on? Wait for her reaction. This works a treat on my toddler because he’s an angel at nursery.

Also, if you see a police car in the street make it clear to her people shouting and screaming in riots have had to go in that car to the police station you don’t want to grow up to be like that do you now? You’re a nice girl. Reinforce she is a good person and this isn’t her when she’s screaming. She can use her words to talk.

Some of these are old hat from my nana to us as kids but you know what it worked. And yeah the shouting and screaming rioters are now locked up she wasn’t wrong, disturbing the peace is a thing. She also told us about the naughty boys and girls school - ultimately she made us grateful in making out it could be worse so be grateful for what you do have food that other don’t, nice school and friends to play with. She taught us we should behave listen to our mum and dad, teachers, police, drs, elderly and do as parents say because they want to help and our parents want us to be happy but it would make our parents proud of us too. A reinforcing grandparents can really help back you both up too!

Use this conflict to communicate, educate, realign her own way to gratefulness for small things. She may actually turn out to be great person with a strong will to make things better in this world for others with that determination (currently screaming) but she needs you to educate her socially and emotionally. She needs to know how to communicate her needs not wants and recognise sometimes it has to be no and that the same for lots of other children too.
It’s hard I have a strong willed three year old but my ‘no’ means ‘no’ and he knows when the eyebrows come out on mummy he stops, he knows his behaviour isn’t right. You will get there make your no’s no.
You wouldn’t tolerate a screaming demanding adult in your home making your life hell where they have worn you down, don’t feel emotionally guilt tripped by a child. Do the hard work now whilst she’s young so she will know when’s she older. It will be worth it . Big hugs stand firm mama. Also you and dad united front no wriggle room and gentle reinforcement from grandparents may help 👍

I Agree with the poster who mentioned punishments later in the week or at the weekend being unsuitable. Such as the not seeing your friends on the weekend due to something today. The other issue about punishing with not allowing to see friends or attending pre booked things, is the impact it has on the other person, the friend, the organisers of activities. And then the child can become isolated as the friends move on to new friends. Or they lose interest in the planned activity anyway.

Punishments/consequences - if given - need to be fairly immediate and relevant to the what has happened. I say consequences as not all situations need a negative consequence such as loss of privileges or loss of toys etc. But a natural consequence can mean you’ve run out of time for something that day. But not everything needs a consequence. They might need more of a reflection and discussion once things have calmed down and an agreement made together about how to prevent it happening again. Or just a hug. Or why certain things are non negotiable - where safety is involved. Some children actually need a sleep after such an epic meltdown. I also agree that food shouldn’t be made into a bargaining tool or used as a punishment or reward.

One thing that helped us years ago around screen use was something I had read about PDA - pathological demand avoidance. It’s already been mentioned. But without suggestion this is what the OP is dealing with, the strategies can sometimes help. My DD had issues transitioning from one thing to another. Especially off a screen. If I told her it was finished we got the tantrum. Even with pre warnings and count downs. However we set the tablet to count down and switch off itself and this seemed to help. The tablet said it was finished and not mummy. The same way same timers can sometimes work. Something that’s not mummy has said the time has run out. With clear expectations as to what follows. The choices thing can work well too but also some people with PDA find the whole choices making super stressful and it can trigger more behaviours. But definitely worth a try. My child doesn’t have PDA but some strategies really help.

Behaviour is usually a form of communication and trying to find out what the child is trying to say with their behaviour needs looking into. It could be that they have learned that screaming gets what they want. It could also be something else.

Sometimes you also have to pick your battles which looks like giving in to others. Or teach compromises. I parent both my children slightly differently as they need and respond to different things. One of my children can be bribed offered rewards to motivate them. The other this doesn’t work. They could be offered a million pounds and if they don’t want to do something they wouldn’t. But I can also now pre plan to avoid situations blowing up or to get things done. It takes practise and consistency. Consistency is key to whatever you try.

Was the thinking step for mine. With a giant egg timer - 1 minute for every year of their age https://amzn.eu/d/blpxCjD
I think watching the sand probably helped them calm down … & then the opportunity to talk about what they’d thought about during the six minutes diffused the situation & changed the dynamic of them running the show.

If she screams again, leave the room for 5 minutes, tell her u r going to do this so she calms down. Maybe it'll shock her to do it. Keep doing it. Another 5 minutes if she starts again. Of u can hold yr nerve it'll take a week. If she doesn't respond to this then seek help for some kind of autism. Been there done that. Mine screams at 14, or wails like a baby til she gets her own way, always has and always will. Boarding school,is a gd option. Bt seriously, trust me, do as above and remove yrselves from the situation, it'll take a week I promise

My child's therapist advised against videoing them because of the extra distress it caused. It's great that it works for you but just a word of caution that it can cause even more distress/trauma/screaming/meltdown.

You have to deal with it now, it will only get harder as she gets older. I suggest you video record her next time. My boys started doing this, I started recording and they stopped almost immediately. After a few months, they started again, so I video'd again, then played it back on the TV to them. Peace again for a few months, then same again, so I played it back when their friends were around the next day. We've had about 8 good months, but they know next time if will be posted on YouTube Snapchat etc.
Kids bad/controlling behaviour can be exhausting beyond explanation, and does cause family breakdown. You can go looking for a diagnosis for ADHD or autism or Asperger's, but in the end a diagnosis of some syndrome or other doesn't move you forward towards more considerate/reasonable behaviour. There had to be consequences, and we found that showing them what they look like to the outside world has worked pretty well, and gave us enough time to regain energy. Don't let her rule your home, she isn't old enough for that amount of responsibility - that's your job. Hours spent explaining why she should stop won't work, she won't understand and when the red mist comes down, she is incapable of processing information or making good decisions, so you need to keep it very simple. Video her. Best of luck.

Have you read The Explosive Child OP? (sorry if it's been suggested previously, I haven't got time to RTFT).

Some children just don't/can't respond appropriately in these situations. I had a child like this and we'd spend ENTIRE DAYS with me 'setting boundaries' and 'not backing down' which would only end when she sobbed herself to sleep - the following day she'd have forgotten the boundaries/the point of the situation - or at least not conceded to do anything differently and the next time she was defiant the whole thing kicked off again.

I would recommend the above book. It doesn't approach the issues from the perspective of assuming additional needs/neurodiversity but the methodology works regardless.

It also understands and explains why the 'take her to hand' 'she is ruling you like a tiny terrorist' 'be the adult' 'show her who is in charge' type advice just won't work for some kids.

I have two kids. Same parents, same upbringing but require very different parenting styles. Please read this book, sometimes it's not the parent's fault and you just need to find out what will work for her. Good luck.

OP, don’t be bullied into doing a drastic cold turkey approach starting right now today, just because a load of posters seem to want you to, as though your life was some kind of reality tv show for their entertainment

How ridiculous. Not to mention, a tad dramatic 🙄

The OP and her DH/DP have created a problem that only they can fix. They can start trying to remedy that whenever they want to but there is no way around it unfortunately. Today, tomorrow, next week, I'm pretty sure there was enough good advice provided to allow the OP to take the approach she feels will work for her 🤷‍♀️

Other posters have just confused the issue by adding irrelevant information that doesn't really bring anything. And the fucking cheese? They're the worst 😂
Not to mention the diagnosis that isn't even a real diagnosis. Who's making it into some kind of reality tv show? Hmmm.

The OP has created a monster and they will need to commit to working together to stop it. Educating themselves to do that in the best way they can but, ultimately, it has to STOP. And cold turkey, with built in strategies and boundary building is fine. We don't need to know the when or how. The OP either does it or continues on to raise a child who will ALWAYS believe they should have what they want and will become more sophisticated in the way they manipulate those around them

Former teacher here. I used to work in a school for children with emotional and behavioural difficulties. The trouble with consequences like not seeing her friend on Saturday is that it's a.) not obviously related to her behaviour and b.) it's too far into the future to be meaningful. At that age children tend to be immersed in the here and now, so warning about a consequence or promising a reward that is several days away is unlikely to help. The average six-year-old doesn't yet have the sense of time and perspective that will allow them to think, "I want to see my friend at the weekend more than I want to eat my body weight in cheese now." You need to make any rewards or consequences more immediate. They should also be linked to her behaviour in a concrete way. "You need to stay in your room until you calm down, because it's not kind to yell at people" is clear. There's an obvious cause and effect there. "If you keep screaming like this, you won't get any sweets next time we go shopping" is more likely to produce a negative reaction, because to a small child that just seems arbitrary.

From what you've written, it sounds as if she has particular difficulty around transitioning from what activity to another (e.g. going to school, leaving school, bedtime routine). Am I understanding that right? If that's a pattern, what might help is for you and her teachers to start using a 'now and next' strategy with her. As you're driving to school, talk with her about the lessons she'll be having that day and then say something like, "And when you come home, you could do some colouring or help me make a fruit salad." If she demands sweets from the shop when you collect her from school, you can then remind her, "We're going home now to make that fruit salad we talked about. Then we're going to..." Basically you don't want to let her demands control your life, but you also don't want everything to be a confrontation, so you need to find ways of diverting her gently but firmly rather than getting into a tug-of-war.

That’s terrible advice

I would pick my battles and prepare for them. In the example you've given, she asked for more cheese with dinner - this would be an easy 'yes' in my house to keep the peace. No drama and same conclusion. But then very firm with other things so when you do decide to fight the battle, you play it out until the bitter end. Will take a while but she will get it.

Exactly and the amino acid tryptophan present in milk actually promotes sleep.😴

You may need to tough it out,both you and your husband.
it may take a couple of weeks and then it will settle but often after that there is what is called ‘extinction’
where your daughter tries the old tactics and you’ll feel it’s all been a waste of time,but it hasn’t!do the same as before and within a couple of nights it will settle again.
It may be helpful to talk to her about a new routine so she knows what to expect,even if she kicks off about it.
she must feel very frustrated.
A good calming bedtime routine will help,bath,a couple of bedtime stories and quiet time.

I really like all the answers from @ArabellaScott I wouldnt be able to put in that nicely but agree with her approach.

This is a parenting problem and not a child problem. It is glaringly clear that you are not able to set and enforce boundaries. Sitting up and reasoning with your child at bedtime is ridiculous. She is 6. She is, in her own way, begging for the grown-ups in her life to be grown-ups.

have you had her tested for adhd?
if you don’t mind me asking ?