Identity Cards: yes or no?

I expect traffickers would all be fully respectful of the documentary process, yes. Certainly they never use ID falsely now, and nobody has ever been trafficked to a country with compulsory ID cards.

@Summernightsinthe21stcentury I do get why people might like the idea of a helpful ID card, it's just not going to do the things people want it to or really anything different to now.

Those law abiding migrants with their law abiding traffickers.

Those people?

Just trying to clarify here.

Guys you obviously know more than me. I just had a bit of experience, I thought it may have been helpful. Especially for the folks that don’t have/ don’t want passports or driving licences

Perhaps people would be less hard of understanding if you could actually explain how ID cards would be a tool to ensure migrants have the right to be in the UK, in a way that doesn't already exist.

The ones who are staying longer already get BRPs, though that system will end soon. But we still have illegal immigration, so another form of UK government issued ID isn't going to affect that. You appear to agree it would be stupid to give them to visitors, meaning we'd have to just use the tools we have now in relation to them. It also means you were wrong when you said that not having a UK passport, driving licence or ID card means it's likely you're here illegally.

I don't know if I like the idea of ALL my info being stored on one card if it did include passport no, driving licence no etc. Seems a bit risky to have everything stored about me on one device. I realise my phone carries a lot of info about me but it does have Face ID/passcode if lost.

So border control can't manage to tell this by looking at the passport. Why bother checking passports on entry at all?!

So a passport or a driving license is just fine then.

And if you have travelled from abroad you have a passport. Right?

Unless of course you end up in a situation like Windrush where you are legally here and can neither prove that nor get an ID card that's supposed to protect you... Oh shit bummer. Ship em back.

No the countries who use ID cards ask that tourists carry their passports or can provide if needed. There is no need to issue ID cards to tourists. I don’t know how many times and ways to say this 😂. They can also be asked to show their inbound outbound travel for the hard of understanding.

Yes, but the presence of a passport from another country isn't proof that the holder currently has the legal right to be in the UK as a visitor. It doesn't show whether or not the person has overstayed, not when so many are able to enter without being stamped or needing a formal visitor visa in advance of travelling. Additional checks would be needed in order to see whether the person was legally in the UK, just like now.

That's important because @Summernightsinthe21stcentury talked about ID cards as having use in showing whether a person is here legally or not. Actually, unless the country gives one to every single visitor, they don't. It's yet another example of a supposed use that actually would require another process on top.

Same as in other countries - you are supposed to carry your passports with you. Or at least be able to go to your hotel or wherever and provide it.

Countries with ID cards accept that visitors have a passport.

So what do you envisage happening with people who are in the UK legally as visitors? Because for what you're suggesting to work, either we give everyone who comes for a quick mini break an ID card. Or we don't and then we've created a class of people who have more rights than citizens in this regard and also drives a coach and horses through your idea that a person without a UK government ID is likely here illegally.

This is actually a pretty big deal, considering the size of our tourist sector. Millions of people visit the UK every year.

It is mandatory to have ID provided by the government in France

Because there are a lot of people who don’t have passports or driving licences

You mean the French model where they aren't mandatory?

That system.

Great you can pay for a pointless card then if you wish.

And how does this differ from the current situation?

So yes not necessarily about you if you already have state provided id, if we follow the French model.

This.

It will just be another hugely expensive government IT fuck up.

It’s not designed to stop illegal migration, merely a tool to ensure that people have the right to be there. And if they don’t have any id then they need to be processed

So no one ever borrowed or stole a credit card ever.

And then you end up in a situation trying to prove you weren't there when your card was.

You do realise there was a whole scandal recently when the computer said something but the workers hadn't done it. Right?

But I can do that already.

Why do I have to pay an extra fee to prove what I already can!?

The magic of an identity card sees to be invisible and indescribable.

Germany have ID cards and still high number of undocumented migrants?

Does it really solve the issues?

If you know someone who will give you job without ID they'll do it whatever ID you're meant to use

it'a funny how to obtain my first UK passport after naturalisation I need to send in....

my EU ID card 😂😂

But how can they be mandatory and exclusive?

You said people would need to present this when asked. That's what I was referring to, not trains.

I assume you meant the police or some kind of authority rather than passing randoms, particularly as you previously mentioned your town centre. And it's a fact that a requirement to produce an ID card when asked doesn't create police or officials to do the asking and to make people do it when they don't want to. People are entitled to hold the view that it does, perhaps via some process of magic, but they'll be wrong.

Another thing that's not a matter of opinion is the frequency of violent crimes committed when the victim and perpetrator know each other already. ID cards obviously won't affect that.