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Original poster

Identity Cards: yes or no?

393 replies

Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 20:38

Gerard Darminin, French Home Secretary equivalent, has said that the UK is making itself a migrant target because we have no national officially issued ID card proving entitlement.

I, a very ordinary citizen, already have an NHS number issued at birth, and a National Insurance number sent to me at 16, neither of which has changed. I also have a passport number, due for renewal next year, a driver's license and a Government Gateway number for my occasional exchanges with officialdom.

Why would anyone who has nothing to hide from the authorities prefer not to hold an official proof of identity?

OP posts:
Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:44

I simply want a single document or card that proves my identity and my entitlement to medical treatment in the first instance, and to rent a home and take employment after that. Voting comes third.

OP posts:
TimeFlysWhenYoureHavingRum · 09/09/2024 21:42

It would cost a fortune and achieve very little. Why would ID card's do anything to dissuade people who are willing to risk their lives to get here? (And supposedly dissappear into the "black economy" anyway). ID cards will not make any difference to these people. Those that come to work legally (the vast majority) will have passports and visas and sponsorship from an employer.
Its another rightwing gimmick to make people believe in simple solutions to complex problems.

Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:41

Why do you hold that view @Uptheflagpole ? Please be kind and explain your thinking?

OP posts:
Uptheflagpole · 09/09/2024 21:38

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:36

I am both white and British. And I spent several months in a country enduring a civil war being a tourist. My vehicle was always passed through military checkpoints quickly, but it was always checked. But days before and days after people died in mass explosions.

OP posts:
Uptheflagpole · 09/09/2024 21:31

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yeesh · 09/09/2024 21:31

Greengagesnfennel · 09/09/2024 21:29

I have lived abroad where they have them. In my experience asking for id was used by police in a racist way in those countries.
I was a white foreigner in a Caucasian country and never got asked. In contrast on buses non-white locals regularly got stopped and asked.

Those of you seeing no problem with them - are you white British? That’s probably why it’s ok for you to contemplate. It means that it is illegal not to have it, so ordinary people are discriminated against because they have to do go to the police station if they innocently forget to have it with them.

This 100%

Greengagesnfennel · 09/09/2024 21:29

I have lived abroad where they have them. In my experience asking for id was used by police in a racist way in those countries.
I was a white foreigner in a Caucasian country and never got asked. In contrast on buses non-white locals regularly got stopped and asked.

Those of you seeing no problem with them - are you white British? That’s probably why it’s ok for you to contemplate. It means that it is illegal not to have it, so ordinary people are discriminated against because they have to do go to the police station if they innocently forget to have it with them.

NoSnowdrop · 09/09/2024 21:27

Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 20:38

Gerard Darminin, French Home Secretary equivalent, has said that the UK is making itself a migrant target because we have no national officially issued ID card proving entitlement.

I, a very ordinary citizen, already have an NHS number issued at birth, and a National Insurance number sent to me at 16, neither of which has changed. I also have a passport number, due for renewal next year, a driver's license and a Government Gateway number for my occasional exchanges with officialdom.

Why would anyone who has nothing to hide from the authorities prefer not to hold an official proof of identity?

What a loaded question at the end. You didn’t write the Scottish indyref ballot as well did you?

of course not having ID is not the reason the UK is a destination for migrants. Just about the stupidest reasoning I’ve heard. Of course idiots will lap it up.

DwightDFlysenhower · 09/09/2024 21:26

I think it's quite a good idea.

I agree with a PP that a lot of people use driving licenses in this way, but if you can't drive for medical reasons you wouldn't be allowed one. If you never want to drive it seems a bit silly to keep renewing a provisional license, and I don't imagine the DVLA really want their system for driving licenses piggybacked for ID purposes.

Uptheflagpole · 09/09/2024 21:26

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Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:25

I do favour a biometric element, personally.

OP posts:
Seymour5 · 09/09/2024 21:24

I would support the introduction of biometric ID cards.

Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:23

I think the start up costs of funding it might be necesssary @Kitkat1523 , but once we were a year into the operation, I reckon you'd probably decide to pay a £25 one-off fee to be legitimate and demonstratably legal would be irrestistable.

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Almostwelsh · 09/09/2024 21:19

Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:15

Would anyone want to include/encode biometric information?

When they were proposed it was intended to be biometric. They're of limited use without.

Kitkat1523 · 09/09/2024 21:18

Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:12

Actually, as long as it was a modest charge, I would be fairly relaxed about paying for it.

Absolutely no way would I be in favour of paying for it myself

Almostwelsh · 09/09/2024 21:18

HRTQueen · 09/09/2024 21:14

it’s about time we had them I can’t even remember the arguments against was it something about infringing our rights to privacy 🙄

had one when living in two other countries it’s very useful

A lot of the arguments were to do with cost. People who had already paid for a passport were annoyed to pay yet again. People who couldn't afford a passport couldn't afford an ID card either

Clearinguptheclutter · 09/09/2024 21:16

I don’t quite get the correlation with migrants but I think it’s quite incredulous that every other developed country can manage this and we apparently can’t

yes I have a passport and driving licence but many have neither

Pippifer · 09/09/2024 21:16

As long as I can add it to my Apple Wallet, I have no issues.

Almostwelsh · 09/09/2024 21:16

Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:12

Actually, as long as it was a modest charge, I would be fairly relaxed about paying for it.

Going by the uproar last time it was proposed I suspect you are in the minority. I seem to remember they were going to cost about the same as a passport.

Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:15

Would anyone want to include/encode biometric information?

OP posts:
UhHuhHuH · 09/09/2024 21:15

Not everyone has a passport or drivers license. The rest aren’t cards or don’t have digital holograms or whatever to ensure they’re not fakes.

I’d have no issue with an ID card.

HRTQueen · 09/09/2024 21:14

it’s about time we had them I can’t even remember the arguments against was it something about infringing our rights to privacy 🙄

had one when living in two other countries it’s very useful

Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:13

So in the UK, it would probably be your NHS number, which is issued at birth.

OP posts:
Original poster
Papyrophile · 09/09/2024 21:12

Actually, as long as it was a modest charge, I would be fairly relaxed about paying for it.

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