To hate homes under the hammer

Figures for England (UK figures not available, but assume similar proportions)

As of 2023, according to Shelter, about 1/3 private renters were in receipt of housing benefit. That's approx 1.6m households, so they would be unable to buy.

Taking the remaining 2/3 (approx 3m), approx .5m of them are students, so transient renters who would be unlikely to buy just for a couple of years.

Of the remaining 2.5m, just under 1m are pensioners so probably wouldn't buy.

So we're left with approx 1.5m, some of whom will be on low wages or will move around for work - many of these will also be foreign nationals who wouldn't consider buying here.

Even at a generous estimate, that leaves around 1m who might want to buy - how many of them do you reckon would be desperate for that run down terrace in Rochdale?

HUTH is not the problem.

Yes, we own one rental property outright. It's managed properly by a responsible agent and our tenants stay for some years. We've only put the rent up once since we bought it in 2011. Our current (happy) tenant is very elderly and has been there for four years. We don't make much money, possibly not as much as if the money was in a long term savings account or bond, and certainly don't feel that we are depriving a family of a home as it is a small one bedroomed flat.

Well if there was social housing available then the family could live in one of those. In the meantime where do you expect the family to live? And should they be denied HB because it's a private rental that is thankfully available to give that family a house?

The reason I’m only talking about private renting and landlords is because this is a homes under the hammer thread where private landlords buy houses at auctions.

Yes I’m disputing private (not social) rentals are in receipt of housing benefit or the universal credit element for housing

the reason private renters can’t buy houses isn’t because the majority are on benefits. It’s because the sums don’t add up of house prices and wages.

your figures are saying the same thing I am.

53% of households on any benefit includes childbenefit, pension credits, DLA.
child benefit recipients can earn above the average wage and still be in receipt.
pension credits - if your on a pension your unlikely to be able to qualify for a mortgage
disability benefit, plenty of people work and rent privately, they are eligible for this to support them in work and with the extra costs for their disability. again that’s not the reason they can’t buy a house.

So you're disputing the fact that the majority of renters are on some form of benefit?

According to Govt figures for England for 22/23, owner occupation remained the largest tenure group in England (65% of households), with the social rented sector being the smallest (16%) and the private rented sector remaining a similar proportion (19%) since 2013-14. Just under 60% of all social tenants were in receipt of housing support, and 24% of private renters were. That doesn't take in to account those who are on some other form of benefit, which is 53% of all UK households.

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/english-housing-survey-2022-to-2023-headline-report#figures

My points were that you didn't include UC claims either, and that actually there are more private renters in England than social renters. 19% of English households rent privately, 16% social, and I'd assume this would be replicated in RoUK.

Not sure why the grapic didn't render, but here's the source -

https://www.statista.com/statistics/544709/tenants-among-population-uk/

https://assets.ctfassets.net/6sxvmndnpn0s/45LMdOAGpYIJjxc6Wssu2Z/7a0342739b7025a99051f2f9436aef89/Universal_Credit_Alert_March_2022.pdf

it does include the universal credit element.

as I say. Most renters aren’t claiming housing benefit. It’s the disparity between wages and housing cost that’s the issue. Wether that’s saving for deposit, or just the loan to wage value.

I didn’t include social housing. Just the private ones like we see on homes under the hammer.

Totally, I get annoyed with landlords with portfolios, using mortgages to prop up their business. The only landlords I actually know own their properties outright, and haven't done massive rent hikes to cover a mortgage

Those figures are misleading, as they don't include the housing element of UC claims; they only refer to legacy HB claims. There are over 3m UC claims which include the housing element.

The English Housing Survey 2022-2023 figures are below - unless there's significantly more social housing in RoUK I would say your assumptions are incorrect re the split of private/social renters.

The majority of renters are on some form of benefit

not including social housing. 5.6 million privately rent and 1.9 million claim housing benefit.

the issue is more to do with large deposits and loan to wages.
so average house price is £282,000
average wage £34,963

the sums don’t add up.

@housethatbuiltme

Why is it so popular as a rental apparently but so unpopular than no one would buy it?

The majority of renters are on some form of benefit and won't be able to buy their own home, so will be destined to a live of living in rented, subsidised in whole or part by benefits.

Lots of people (like my son) need to move to new cities for their first proper job after leaving university (as there are few, if any, graduate jobs in the regions away from a handful of big cities). Not only the fact they can't afford to buy at first, they won't know whether their new job is a "forever" job with that firm in that city, or whether they'll be moving firms/cities within a few years. Most graduates don't have a choice as to which city/which firm they work in/at - they apply for lots of jobs and just have to take whichever they get offered. Very few will get multiple offers and a choice of city/firm - it's not like Unis where 18 year olds typically get 2/3/4 offers and can choose which Uni they like best! Every few new graduates living in a new city and in their first job will even be thinking about buying a home there for the first few years. Likewise lots of other people who move cities temporarily to follow their work or to take the only jobs available. I suppose if you're a teacher or nurse or a retail/hospitality worker, you can get work anywhere, but if you're, say, an engineer or actuary, there are very limited employers in a small number of locations and you have to go where the work is at that time.

@housethatbuiltme

Also landlords are rarely cash buyers.

That's because they either have huge business loans secured over all their properties in their portfolio which they can draw down on, or because they re-mortgage properties already owned to release funds to pay outright for the next, then once completed, they re-mortgage that to release funds for the next, and so on.

They're not getting a mortgage on the house they're buying at auction.

It's all leveraging the "equity" in the rest of their portfolio and releasing funds as house prices rise or every new house is completed and becomes eligible for mortgage or security over their business loans.

Perhaps for several reasons -

If it's a poor/rundown area, people are less likely to buy

Lots of people don't want to buy a fixer upper, they want something move-in ready

We don't know whether it actually gets rented, just that it's put up for rent

Perhaps the person renting doesn't want to buy - they will be in the area short-term or are checking it out before they buy

Perhaps because the LA needs to find rental properties to put people in so they are not homeless? I wonder whether anyone has ever actually done a financial analysis on how much it costs an LA to own, manage and maintain a property for rental, vs how much it costs to put somebody in a private rental - perhaps landlords are actually saving us money in a roundabout way, as they are responsible for insuring and repairing their properties?

Why is it so popular as a rental apparently but so unpopular than no one would buy it?

That doesn't track at all.

Was evicted because the landlord wanted to sell, was literally homeless for almost a year and still don't hate homes under the hammer. In fact I find it a relaxing program to watch for some reason. Some of you need to lighten up

I think the music is the best bit.Whoever picks the songs is a genius they always choose exactly the right one. Brilliant

I used to watch it, it always amazed me they got it done for 10k.🙄 but it's professional property developers on there.

Worst house on the street is much more realistic, and helpful as they do show them buying reclaimed/second-hand or seconds, doing the work themselves and going over budget. I was watching it the other week where they mentioned buying seconds of kitchen appliances(usually returned, or have a slight issue like a small dent), went to have a look on a website and saw the oven and hob I want at half price. When I eventually get round to replacing them that's where I'll go.

Homes Under the Hammer is getting boring now.

They are auction houses that need a lot of time and effort to bring them up to standard. They are doing that then selling them on. I see nothing wrong with it. It’s better than sitting all boarded up and derelict. Yes, sometimes they rent them out but not everyone can or wants to buy. There is no way in earth I’d buy from auction.

I just wanted to comment about all the evil landlord posts. I used to have a flat that I rented out in London. £1500. PCM. When the mortgage was up for renewal I couldn’t get a mortgage unless I was charging £2200 pcm. A local estate agent thought I could get this but it seemed so unreasonable and I would have had to get rid of my lovely tenants and readvertise. I sold it.
buy to let mortgages have crazy expectations.

I always have a chuckle at the morons that purchase without looking.. some still get lucky though... which is a shame.. as they go on to think they are a shrewd purchaser building up that portfolio .. hate this programme .. part of the reason for the housing crisis.. Martin was ok though!

I totally agree. It enrages me and the high rents compared to the value of these properties makes me even madder. I am retired and own my home but my heart goes out to those young people who possibly never will.