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She should be provided with an alternative education

164 replies

mychilddeservesaneducation · 02/09/2024 16:24

(NC in case this is outing with links to previous posts).

DD is about to start year 10. Due to trauma relating to bullying, she's been refusing school for almost a year (she has panic attacks and can't cope with being in lessons / corridors / assembly halls etc). When this first started, we asked the school to consider allowing her to work in a small room or something but they refused. It's normal timetable or punishment for 'truancy' (even if she's in school they count it as 'internal truancy' if she doesn't turn up to a lesson, which happened frequently as she was hiding in the toilets crying as she was too scared to go in).

She's basically had no education since almost this time last year, except a few workbooks at home that we've bought. School won't set work if she's not in school, they won't offer small group teaching if she is in school and for the last term, we stopped sending her in as the stress and punishments were making her severe anxiety worse. Their line is she needs to be in school and in lessons and if she's not, it's an unauthorised absence. We've been threatened with court for her poor attendance.

We've had limited support from an attendance key-worker and have tried a phased return to school a few times but failed as she just panics. The GP hasn't been able to help much and CAHMS refused a referral request. We've paid for some private counselling but can't afford to continue.

After so long, should the school (or council?) not be offering an alternative education for her like online tutoring or pupil referral unit (not sure if this is appropriate to her needs)? The school will just not help at all. We cannot afford online schooling and DH and I have to work full time to pay the bills, so home Ed would be difficult too. I'm so stuck as to where to turn and any advice will be much appreciated.

OP posts:
Blueybanditbingochilli · 03/09/2024 07:44

SilenceInside · 02/09/2024 16:27

Is there any other school, smaller, better with SEN/additional needs etc that you could move her to? Do you think a different environment might help, rather than the one where the bullying has happened?

There aren’t even SEN places for SEN children. OP’s child doesn’t have special needs. This sudden clamour for SEN places for children who have emotional upset is overburdening the system and deeply unfair on children who aren’t actually capable of learning the regular curriculum.

There are over 800,000 children currently missing school for non medical reasons. There is zero hope of providing them all with the level of service expected on here because there are so many of them now and there are no resources to do it. Threatening judicial review all over the place seems to have become the knee jerk reaction for almost everything.

I would suggest OP pursues the mental health route to get her daughter back to school. Can you afford private therapy? Can she change schools if you move house? Has she tried sertraline?

Blueybanditbingochilli · 03/09/2024 07:28

ClockwiseHoneysuckle · 03/09/2024 03:01

Can you get the GP to provide a report saying your daughter is unable to go into school for mental health reasons? If so, send a copy to the council and ask them to make arrangements immediately for education other than at school (EOTAS) under section 19 Education Act 1996. If they don't do it, or try to fob you off with 5 hours a week, threaten judicial review and consult SOS SEN who have a scheme under which they send pre=action letters without charge. https://sossen.org.uk/about/jr-initiative-the-pap-project/

And we wonder why councils are going bankrupt.

EHCPerhaps · 03/09/2024 05:53

I second IPSEA for free templates of legally watertight letters to LA.
My understanding from them is that the LA need to provide alternative after 15 days absence. Obviously I have never heard of this actually happening because of how local authorities’ budgets have been slashed by the Tories. This is blighting kids lives. It’s a national scandal. Kids missing years of education through no fault of their own, whether through teams or SEND needs or both.

Anxiety is a medical reason. Keep on that theme with the school. See your GP and ask them to write a short letter to school and LA to explain medically why child can’t attend. Like they would be asked to write a sick note for an adult. It’s important not to make it about DD ‘refusing school’ which sounds voluntary. She can’t help it. Hope things improve for you soon OP.

FancyNewt · 03/09/2024 05:46

And use the IPSEA template letter to apply for an EHCP needs assessment to get an EHCP. The LA will almost certainly turn you down ,but appeal.

An EHCP may provide her with a smaller school that would suit her better, or at least more time in education if that's what's needed.

FancyNewt · 03/09/2024 05:42

And keep pushing for a referral to CAMHs and get your MP involved.

It is illegal for the LA to not provide your daughter with an education.

FancyNewt · 03/09/2024 05:40

OP. I work in this area.

You need to send the Local Authority a letter to request they arrange alternative. IPSEA have a template. It is the LA who are responsible but the school who normally do the referral.

The alternative education needs to be 'suitable' and full time ,unless it's not in her interests to be full time.

You may qualify for transport to the alternative education if it's done onsite somewhere.

If you PM which LA you live in I will send you a link to the Local Offer website where they explain what alternative provision is in your area. Every LA has to have a Local Offer website with all information about children and young people with SEND.

I also suggest that you speak to your local SENDIASS.

Chrsytalchondalier · 03/09/2024 03:39

CrochetForLife · 03/09/2024 03:33

Wow. You really have no idea. Read OPs posts. It's clear there is more than anxiety going on with this poor girl. And, as OP herself has said, two other children in the same situation at the school have committed suicide.

You don't think any of this warrants the OP pushing harder in that direction, to get whatever help she can? Just going with 'anxiety' is doing nothing at all whatsoever ever at the moment, is it? What solutions do you have, then? Lets hear them!

Tbh, if she's at risk of suicide then she shouldn't be going anywhere near that school and bullies. She needs to change school.

CrochetForLife · 03/09/2024 03:37

giggly · 03/09/2024 03:28

I’m curious as to how you have diagnosed major depressive disorder?
I hope to god your a psychiatrist providing this and have actually assessed this child otherwise your advice is not only wrong but dangerous as well.Suicide watch, what on earth do you mean, do you mean the child is on 1/1 24 observations in a hospital because that’s actually what that means.
Got to love the mumsnet experts

OP says: *mychilddeservesaneducation · Yesterday 17:01
Yes. You've written exactly how I feel. Sadly at least two children from the same school have ended their lives in the past year.

Did you miss this from the OP? Should OP wait for a third - her daughter?

CrochetForLife · 03/09/2024 03:33

giggly · 03/09/2024 03:28

I’m curious as to how you have diagnosed major depressive disorder?
I hope to god your a psychiatrist providing this and have actually assessed this child otherwise your advice is not only wrong but dangerous as well.Suicide watch, what on earth do you mean, do you mean the child is on 1/1 24 observations in a hospital because that’s actually what that means.
Got to love the mumsnet experts

Wow. You really have no idea. Read OPs posts. It's clear there is more than anxiety going on with this poor girl. And, as OP herself has said, two other children in the same situation at the school have committed suicide.

You don't think any of this warrants the OP pushing harder in that direction, to get whatever help she can? Just going with 'anxiety' is doing nothing at all whatsoever ever at the moment, is it? What solutions do you have, then? Lets hear them!

giggly · 03/09/2024 03:28

CrochetForLife · 03/09/2024 03:09

I agree with ClockwiseHoneysuckle but I think the GP is letting them down by writing it off as mere 'anxiety'. This poor girl has way, way more than mere anxiety. GP needs to diagnose her with Major Depressive Disorder and Suicide Ideation. Anything else you/GP can think of and come up with. And that she is at severe suicide risk and is on Suicide Watch. Just saying she has 'anxiety' aint going to get them shit, sadly. It needs to be really serious, hard hitting and direct to be taken seriously. No council is going to give a child extra help for 'anxiety'. It just won't happen.

I’m curious as to how you have diagnosed major depressive disorder?
I hope to god your a psychiatrist providing this and have actually assessed this child otherwise your advice is not only wrong but dangerous as well.Suicide watch, what on earth do you mean, do you mean the child is on 1/1 24 observations in a hospital because that’s actually what that means.
Got to love the mumsnet experts

giggly · 03/09/2024 03:23

Treeinthesky · 02/09/2024 18:27

Get a referral for autism i say this just based on her Social anxiety, staying in etc. Usually school have to do this however with her.been home schooled GP can maybe refer?

Get an echp and you will hopefully get funding and extra support or special school you should get one due to length of time had off school. You can do this yourself just google apply for an ehcp and your area.

Is she on the SEN reg at the school she was attending. If not why not? She has anxiety and maybe autism. She also doesn't attend school.

please don’t go down the autism route, there appears to be no reason for this and I say this as a clinical specialist in autism. Your daughter has school based anxiety from school bullying from what you have said. This is not a CAMHS criteria but one that education should be supporting you with.
I do not live in England so can’t help much with local information however in Scotland all school nurses have been trained in anxiety management and they are expected to provide this support.
Inhave to say that you and your DH are going to have to work round supporting her which will probably mean a reduction in both your hours/sick leave/ special leave depends what your employer would provide.
Id also suggest that you stop paying for a counsellor and use a CBT/EMDR therapist with qualifications in working with children, anyone can be a counsellor as long as you have the mo eh to buy the training.
Unfortunately if school do not help as they should I’d be moving my child in an instant and work around the disruption that this will cause. You have no other options

CrochetForLife · 03/09/2024 03:16

Just thinking more about this, (and I feel for this as I too was very severely teased and bullied at my high school and rural town itself where I grew up, and I have Major Depression, so your daughter's plight strikes a nerve with me), can you contact your local newspaper about this? They're always after scoops and new stories, stuff for their paper. Or go onto your local current affairs tv programme (if you guys have them in the UK) and seek help via getting your story out through the media? It's a public interest story for the public to know that a local school is not providing Duty of Care for a student, and allowing bullying to flourish while punishing the victim and depriving the victim of an education.
This is about Duty of Care, and a taxpayer-funded state school failing in it's Duty of Care to it's students.

CrochetForLife · 03/09/2024 03:09

I agree with ClockwiseHoneysuckle but I think the GP is letting them down by writing it off as mere 'anxiety'. This poor girl has way, way more than mere anxiety. GP needs to diagnose her with Major Depressive Disorder and Suicide Ideation. Anything else you/GP can think of and come up with. And that she is at severe suicide risk and is on Suicide Watch. Just saying she has 'anxiety' aint going to get them shit, sadly. It needs to be really serious, hard hitting and direct to be taken seriously. No council is going to give a child extra help for 'anxiety'. It just won't happen.

ClockwiseHoneysuckle · 03/09/2024 03:03

Also ask for another referral to CAMHS and consider applying for an EHCP. That will probably take time but may ultimately get your daughter better support in school and possibly referral to a more suitable school.

ClockwiseHoneysuckle · 03/09/2024 03:01

Can you get the GP to provide a report saying your daughter is unable to go into school for mental health reasons? If so, send a copy to the council and ask them to make arrangements immediately for education other than at school (EOTAS) under section 19 Education Act 1996. If they don't do it, or try to fob you off with 5 hours a week, threaten judicial review and consult SOS SEN who have a scheme under which they send pre=action letters without charge. https://sossen.org.uk/about/jr-initiative-the-pap-project/

CrochetForLife · 03/09/2024 03:00

I'm not in the UK but don't they have correspondence schools? There used to be such a thing where I am called School of the Air for rural kids that live hundreds of Ks from a school where you attend phone-in lessons and online/email/ zoom etc. Correspondence school also called Distance Education. Same thing as above. That you are threatened with court is horrific.

I think you need to go back to your GP and have him/her write a letter specifically outlining the seriousness of the issue and that your daughter is AT RISK OF SUICIDE. It needs to be spelled out in the strongest, and I mean fugging STRONGEST possible terms. Just saying 'anxiety' is far too weak. That means absolutely nothing, considering every single high school child has anxiety. She has severe/major Depression. Major Depressive Disorder. Suicide Ideation. Etc. That, is what needs to be said. Not 'anxiety'. GP needs to state she is on Suicide Watch. And you need to contact the school and say that you are withdrawing her and doing homeschooling. Send a copy/copies of all this including GP letters to the school and notify the school you are sending them to SS and to your local Member of Parliament. And that if the school continues to harass you, you will go to the media. They won't want the bad publicity.

Chrsytalchondalier · 03/09/2024 02:16

Surely the best option would try and find another school so she can thrive and make some friends? Does she have friends or do anything else where she meets people like a sport? I'd be concerned about this aspect if she's not socialising as being isolated will surely just make her anxiety worse

ItsAShame2 · 03/09/2024 01:56

I would contact a local martial arts school and explain the circumstances and ask if they would consider her doing a term at a reduced rate. Doing martial arts is wonderful for confidence as the person learns how to stand etc in authoritive confident way which deters bullies. We did this for my cleaners son who was being bullied (like an evil kid put a plastic bag over his head type of bulling) and it was wonderful for his confidence.
Do you think maybe it’s better she stops down a year to a new cohort of kids?
concentrate on maths and English

Chrsytalchondalier · 03/09/2024 01:55

mychilddeservesaneducation · 02/09/2024 17:09

@carrotcard - no!

Surely you need to change schools if the bullies are that bad, you need to move if you can't work out transportation

RedWinePoliticsAndHair · 03/09/2024 01:42

Why did CAMHS refuse referral? I'm a SENDCO and that's highly unusual. I don't think ever had one refused. Did they give you a reason @mychilddeservesaneducation ?

HelloMiss · 03/09/2024 01:25

So what's she doing whilst you are both at work Op?

Livinginchaos · 03/09/2024 00:57

Section 19 of the education act 1996 says that all children not in school for whatever reason, should be provided with alternative provision. The local authority will likely try to wriggle out of this. I had to go to the Local Government Ombudsman to get mine to do it. But your first step is to write to Head of Children's services to request this.

Make sure you email in any absences as off sick for mental health reasons, and ensure its being logged as illness. They have to log as illness unless they have reason to.doubt the voracity of it, in which case they should inform you and request details from Go. Try again with camhs. Go back to gp and explain she cannot attend school due to her mental health difficulties so at very least it's logged in her notes. Also write to the school and say they are not meeting her needs and suggest she needs a formal plan of action (ie and Additional Needs Plan).

Notfineinschool is great. Also join local SEN or EHCP Facebook pages. Other parents who have been there are so helpful at guiding others. Work fast, put everything in writing. And don't be afraid to make official complaints. I also recommend IPSEA for advice.

Personally I would also write to my MP and county councillors, especially in light of the suicides and bullying issues.

Theunhappiestchild · 03/09/2024 00:18

I'm so sorry you are in this situation OP. I have a DD the same age (just starting year 10) who has missed big chunks of school since starting secondary due to extreme anxiety. She hasn't been in school since Christmas.

Our experience has been very different though. School have been very supportive and once it became clear back in the spring that she wasn't going to be able to get back to school anytime soom, they referred her to our LA who put in place a total of 7 hours weekly 1-2-1 online tutoring across the core subjects, all arranged within a week. There is frequent communication between us, the school and the LA, and the school are always open to trying whatever we suggest in terms of trying to support her back into school, including her coming in just for break time and lunchtime from time to time to see her friends.

I hope that we will be able to get back into the classroom over the next year, but the school and LA have reassured us that the online tuition can continue all the way through to GCSEs of needed (and they will up the hours next year) and that they will provide her with a private room for her exams if needed.

It is still and utterly shit situation and my heart breaks daily for my DD. But reading some of the responses here I'm very grateful for what we have.

She doesn't have an EHCP btw, this was all put in place off the back of how she was presenting in school coupled with me filling in the gaps. The school knows she has had both NHS and private support but they haven't required any formal evidence or diagnosis.

I really hope you find a way to get your DD the support she deserves.

MeanderingMeercat · 03/09/2024 00:11

www.redballoonlearner.org/

I'm not sure if this has been posted but Red Balloon will give you advice. They have an online school for learners who cannot access their centres in person.

They are excellent.

Therapeutic70 · 02/09/2024 23:57

She is entitled to an education. Speak to IPSEA. This might help enquire.org.uk/parents/attendance/missing-school-due-to-anxiety/

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