Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to insist on details of husbands affair, he can’t / refuses to give and I can’t move on without details.

258 replies

Iwillcomeouttheotherend · 31/08/2024 09:46

NC and apols for long post. PLEASE read and advise me, I’m desperate!

Feels like My whole world has just fallen apart.
Been with DH 30 years, married for 22yr, we have 4 DC age 20, 18, 16 and 15.
I’ve just found out that DH has been having an emotional affair with OW at work for probably the last 4 -5 years and finding out has totally floored me. I had no idea, although now looking back all the signs were very much there. So for up to a quarter of our long marriage, he’s been “connected” to HER and not me. How could I have not known.
I can’t sleep, I’m running on adrenaline and having constant palpitations. The only thing I was ever 100% sure about in my life, was that my husband would always be faithful and that he was not capable of having an affair. 😳 Not in a million years did I believe he would ever do this.
DH is well liked, well respected, funny witty and charming and good at his job. There’s a lot of after work socialising which never bothered me because I 100% trusted him 😡
3 years ago his watsapp shows him / her “turning on disappearing messages” then turning it off again, over a couple of days and then left switched off. He says she was just showing him how it could be done as she’s a Wizz with tech and he so isn’t but loves learning new functions. This would have been around the same time that he switched off the watsapp notification banners from his phone.
From the few messages and call logs that he forgot to delete, I can see that whenever she messaged him, he would respond within minutes. I’ve gone thru my messages over 4 years, most of my messages went unanswered. He attends a lot of big sporting events thru work, she’s always there, in fact she’s arranged many of them. I’ve seen a few pics of them together at dinner or an event in a group (all male except HER). She’s always sat next to DH with a big ridiculous grin on her face, him clearly enjoying himself, I want to vomit.
We have a family app that shares all our locations, I often check it and screenshot it as our DD is ND, I don’t trust her when she’s out, she talks to all people and gets herself into difficult and risky situations (it’s a full time job trying to keep her safe.)
DP hadn’t told me he was going out on particular evening a few months ago (we weren’t talking at the time so I just assumed he was being his usual arsey disrespectful self in not telling me he had an event and would be late home). I took a few screenshots of his location that evening, which changed from a pub to a fancy hotel later in the evening (She lives some distance from work so sometimes stays in town when there’s an event)
Turns out he went back to her hotel room for over an hour at the end of the night (he denied this initially saying he only went to the bar in her hotel to have another drink with her, I’ve visited the hotel, it’s huge, the bar is at the far end of the hotel, his location at every check I made, was at the complete opposite end of the hotel where it shows the rooms are. He denies anything went on and he’d just gone up to look at the fancy room. He can’t remember what they talked about, they get on well, the conversation just flows and they enjoy each others company. He’d been drinking all evening, he can’t remember the details, assumes they had a cup of tea and a chat (He’d been with her at work since 9am that morning but still felt the need to stay in her company for over an hour more at 11pm.) He made 3 short calls to her upon arriving at the hotel that night, he can’t remember why but assumes that it was to arrange to meet her in the hotel, as they probably left the pub (5 mins away) separately so nobody from work would be suspicious. (If they are at that stage then I’m very sure that everyone at work will already suspect/know about the affair.) I feel physically sick and I am struggling to get past this without more information which he won’t give me.
He swore on the children’s lives that nothing physical went on. I am inclined to believe him as he struggles with ED and I don’t think he would have wanted to risk putting himself in a vulnerable position where he’d have no guarantee that he could “perform adequately” for her. I now 100% believe that if he didn’t struggle with ED, then the affair would have become physical also.
The same night DH received a message from HER daughter asking if “he’s with mum, cos she’s not picking up”. HER daughter also works for the company. There’s a few messages over the years from daughter asking about mums locations and asking DH to get her mum to call her. The cosiness of it all makes me feel sick. OW is married, her husband isn’t the father of the daughter.
There was a screenshot on his phone of a different hotel / different event / different day, he thinks it was probably the directions to “walk her back safely to her hotel” on that occasion but “can’t remember.”
Our relationship over the last 4 years has not been good. I’ve accused him so many times of being “emotionally abusive.” He’s been totally detached, returning from work either ignoring me completely or if I dared to speak to him he would shout at me or hurl insults. If I wanted to give him updates on the children, he’d shout asking why I was telling him that NOW, as “he’s just walked thru the door / just going to the gym / just eaten his dinner/ just going to bed.” Basically there was never a good time to talk to him, he had been getting his “fix” from HER throughout the day and had nothing left for me, she has been meeting all his emotional needs and sharing all the small talk, which should have been shared with me, his wife.
All he ever wanted to do when he was at home, was sit glued to the TV or his phone.
He’s had a few weekends abroad with his friends (I don’t doubt this as I know the friends). On his return he would barely say Hi to me as he walked thru the door, he would never share the details of his weekend away, he simply did not want to communicate with me. I’ve since seen in messages, he and HER would discuss his weekend away.
I took DD away for 5 days, he never called me once to chat or see how we were getting on.
I went away with my friends for a few days, he worked from home, he called her at 7:35am, he must have been waking up thinking of her. He spent 40 minutes on a call to her later that day. He couldn’t even spend 2 minutes talking to me when I returned home.
As things got worse between us over the 4 yrs, I always had hope that one day he’d calm down, stop being so distant, rude and aggressive towards me and the children. I even contacted his GP and asked him to consider changing his BP meds as they were causing mood changes and making him angry all the time ! As he was getting emotionally closer to her he was putting more distance between us to ease his guilt no doubt.
After admitting the emotional affair, He now recognises he “lost focus” and is really trying his best to be a better husband. We’re talking so much more, there’s hugs and we’ve had sex again. He wants to book more holidays, he’s told me to make enquiries about the loft extension I’ve wanted for 10 years and he wants us to renew our wedding vows. He is making a HUGE effort, I’d genuinly forgotten how good we could be together. Unfortunately the big light inside of me has switched off, yes I’m very much enjoying him showing me all the respect, interest and care that I’ve so craved and needed this last 4 years, but I’m struggling to get past all the lies and deceit and every time he shows me respect I’m totally conflicted, it reminds me of the hell I’ve been thru the last 4 years and what I have missed out on due to his selfish infidelity. He continued to lie about the details and extent of their “very good connection” even after I found out. It was only after me putting together the few messages he hadn’t deleted, his location screen shots and checking it all back to my personal diary that he eventually admitted and became truthful about some of their “togethers”. There must be millions of others that I don’t know about because the information is now all deleted.
He’s now refusing to answer anymore questions, says he’s told me everything he can and he can’t / won’t be telling me anymore, it’s too stressful for him. (He told me very little other than answer direct questions I asked about the content of a few messages I had actually seen.) He will show me by his actions from here on in, that he’s sorry and wants to be a better husband. I definitely see him making a big effort to show me he loves me and he’s sorry.
He keeps telling me how much he loves me and is desperate for me to say it back to him. I can’t as I no longer know what love is. I thought I loved him even during the 4 years that he treated me so appallingly and desperately tried to pin his changed behaviour / distance and aggression towards me on the BP meds. How bloody naive and trusting was I.
I am an incredibly strong and resilient woman but I don’t think that I can move on without knowing the details, I cannot process it unless I know exactly what I am processing and the depth of their relationship / deceit.
I’m awake in the middles of the night with all these scenarios and questions bashing my skull. I can’t think of anything else. I really feel I’m heading for a breakdown. I flit from thinking I need to speak to her, to I need to tell her husband, but really what I need, is for him to tell me, and be honest about all the “details”, it will no doubt be extremely painful for me (him too), but I’d like to think that once I know details, I can process them and in time hopefully think about them less, maybe come to terms with it and move on.
AIBU to insist on the details. Pressuring him for more may well tip him over the edge.
Without them, I don’t think we have a marriage if he can’t be honest with me after what he’s put me thru.
Thank you if you’ve read this far. I’m desperate for advice.

OP posts:
daliesque · 31/08/2024 11:01

Soontobe60 · 31/08/2024 10:31

I really can’t understand why you’re still together, neither of you is happy with the other! You’ve clearly been stalking him for a long time by checking his phone, checking his location, and he’s clearly been sleeping with another woman.
I’d just cut my losses and separate.

This. Your marriage js over. You both need to accept that and move on.
I have to be honest though, affair or not, if my partner stalked me to the extent you have your husband, then I'd be out of the door for good.

StormingNorman · 31/08/2024 11:00

I’m sorry OP but they had sex. He was committed to her and loved her enough to stay with her for four years. That’s a long time.

Honestly, I think he doesn’t want the financial instability of a divorce this close to retirement. Or to lose his housekeeper. Or be found out by the children.

I’m sorry but a couple of holidays, apology sex and a loft conversion would not make me stay.

EasySkankin · 31/08/2024 11:00

Iwillcomeouttheotherend · 31/08/2024 10:28

Thank you for your time to read and respond.
I really don’t think he will talk anymore about it, not just the specific details but in general.
He becomes so stressed whenever I ask him anything about it or bring up the subject.
He won’t leave the job, he’s worked there for 35 years.
Cant imagine she will either, shes been there about 5 years.
He very much is showing me by his actions but im desperate to talk.

I think that @lissom’s advice is really good here.

Is he wedded to the job or you OP?

I once went away with an ex where there was no phone coverage and was able to have the truthful conversation we were unable to have elsewhere. In it I was able to identify deal-breakers for me which were never before articulated by him, I could only infer from his behaviour. To hear the truth out of his mouth, we decided to split up (amicably) because his non-negotiable terms didn’t suit me. After we split, and I fairly quickly got together with who is now my husband, he started making all these overtures, wanting to get back together, but essentially, that could never happen, once I had seen the truth of his terms, that time we were away, my offer was withdrawn, totally off the table.

You need to have a conversation where you discuss what both you will and won’t accept in order to see if you have a future together. Sweeping things under the rug is not a solution you would be able to live with indefinitely, and that seems to be all he is willing to do (in order to go back to how things were before the betrayal).

Lorelaigilmore88 · 31/08/2024 10:59

Im so sorry you are going through this.
I think the marriage is over. You deserve so much more than what you are getting from this selfish prick.
This attention he is giving you now is temporary, it definitely won't last because he's incapable.
My husband and I seperated after 10years of marriage last October, I suspect infidelity with the new gf he got with within weeks, and initially the not knowing killed me. But eventually I didnt care.

Because he's a liar, you have no idea whether anything he tells you now is true. He will likely tell you anything to minimise his own wrongdoing and try to smooth things over. I think you need to try and move forward and reconcile yourself to never knowing the truth.
Personally I would walk after this level of disrespect but I know its an incredibly difficult decision. But the level of attention he is showing you now will not last, don't make your decision based on that, look at how your life was before.

PashaMinaMio · 31/08/2024 10:58

You might be able to turn this around but I doubt it. It’s just a matter of time before a catalyst will drive you over the edge. Meanwhile, he’s fkd you over and stamped on your heart.

Every time he says something “off” or disrespectful to you your thought might be “I bet you didn’t speak to her like that.”

In bed, you’ll be wondering if he did certain things with her that he’s doing to you.

Nah, it ain’t gonna work. No matter what he tells you or admits to. No matter how much he tries to patch things up with you.

The trust had gone. Stop wasting your life on him.

user9578 · 31/08/2024 10:58

@SnowflakeSmasher86 I say then-husband because I left him. He wanted to gloss over it and move on but I don't believe that works. My affair changed me and it would have changed him too. The fact that I had an affair in the first place demonstrated I had checked out of our marriage already, there was nothing left to save. I stayed for a few months to appease him.

But I still stand by what I said, you can't unhear things. He knew I had an affair for 6 months, he knew we'd met up numerous times and had sex. He didn't need to know anything more than that. I wasn't protecting myself, the jig was up and I wasn't asking for forgiveness. It was a proper exit affair for me.

However I do agree, that if the intention is to stay then full honestly is the way forward - but like PPs have said, how can you ever believe you are getting the full truth anyway.

Knittedfairies2 · 31/08/2024 10:58

You can move on without knowing all the sordid details; you have to move on for your own sanity. You need to speak to a counsellor.

Gymnopedie · 31/08/2024 10:56

He keeps telling me how much he loves me and is desperate for me to say it back to him.

Have you asked him (a) how his behaviour over the last few years has shown you that he loves you? And I don't just mean the affair, but the way he's treated you at home, being rude, angry and dismissive. And (b) why, given his behaviour, you should still love him?

Everything you've written, not just that he won't tell you the details, says that he wants you to forget the whole thing and pretend it never happened and then everything will be fine. Well stuff that.

I think this is over for you. He's completely shafted you and now thinks that love bombing (which is what it is) will win you round. I would ask how long the new him will last when he thinks he's got you reeled back in.

OhWell45 · 31/08/2024 10:54

End the marriage and walk away. He's treated you like shit for the last 5 year. He's only being nice because he's been found out and he doesn't want to end up divorce, embarrassed and with 1/2 of everything.

He's cheated emotionally. I don't doubt that he's cheated physically. Why go to the hotel room if not to engage in intimate activity. They've kiss, they've touched, they've done everything. You're kidding yourself to think ED has got in the way. You only know the tip of the iceberg. I'd get an STI test seen as you've had sex recently.

I think you need counselling to discuss this. I think you need to think about why you've allowed him to treat you like shit for 5 years. Why don't you deserve more than this.

I don't believe he's sorry. I believe he's sorry he got caught.

ETA: You can't trust his even to go to work without trifling with another woman. The betrayal is marriage ending and IMO unforgivable.

wadeinthewater · 31/08/2024 10:54

I think you feel like you need more details because deep down you don't believe he has told you the truth about how far it went.

Mickey79 · 31/08/2024 10:53

His role in this now is to give you whatever you need, in order to be able to move on. If what you need is more details, that’s what you get. It shouldn’t even be up for debate, he does as you ask or you separate. It’s just the bare minimum and you should be controlling the narrative, not him. Im another who doesn’t believe that it was never physical. Even with ED. There will be an increase in his viagra prescriptions or there will be some hidden somewhere that he bought on line. When you’ve been with someone a long time, you want to believe in the best of them, But cheating is a selfish act and people lie to protect their own interests.

Miggy2D · 31/08/2024 10:52

Even with ED he can have sexual contact with her in many ways.

I absolutely wouldn't believe it's not physical with all those hotel visits.

And sorry to say that his ED and non performance with you might have been through guilt, disinterest

His penis may have worked fine around her :(

Lemonadeand · 31/08/2024 10:48

He’s now refusing to answer anymore questions, says he’s told me everything he can and he can’t / won’t be telling me anymore, it’s too stressful for him.

This is the bit that stands out to me. Too stressful for him? What about you and the stress you have been facing because of his behaviour?

At the end of the day, you both have choices. He can tell you as much or as little as he wants to. You have the choice about what you do with that.

WhatsitWiggle · 31/08/2024 10:48

OP, I say this as someone who has recently learnt my husband had an affair for 12 years, almost my child's entire life. He won't change.
He's remorseful because you've confronted him. He doesn't want his comfy life with you to end so he's rowing back and trying to get you on side.
As soon as he realises you've relaxed, stopped bugging him, not made plans to kick him out ... he'll start up the affair again. Only he'll be even more sneaky because now he knows how you're tracking him.
He gets excitement from the sneaking around. He doesn't necessarily want to be in a long term relationship with this woman, it's the fun of dating, the attention he gets, and he won't get that from you, you've too much shared history.

Find your anger, end the marriage. Allow yourself to grieve for the man he used to be. Then build your new life.

If you stay with him, things will not improve. And you'll find yourself in 10 years time wondering why the hell you've accepted living with a grumpy man who does nothing for you.

simpledeer · 31/08/2024 10:47

I really wouldn’t believe it wasn’t a physical affair.

You can’t trust him. With no trust there is no relationship. Nothing worth saving.

I would split up.

Hatty65 · 31/08/2024 10:47

For me, I think the deal breaker is that 'he won't quit his job'. I don't care that he's worked there for 35 years, frankly. His utterly inappropriate behaviour with another woman, over a long period of time means that if he wants to continue in his marriage then one of the casualties of this affair HAS to be his job.

He needs to accept that he cannot continue to remain married to you, continue to work with this woman and continue to insist he can't remember/is stressed and won't be discussing things any more. He appears to still be trying to control everything and insisting that you draw a line under it and judge him from today onwards.

Well, no. I'd be judging him on the past 4 years and the present fact that he's not apparently losing anything, despite being the one who has damaged your marriage.

Tell him he has a very frank conversation with you and admits to every single incident - instead of 'pretending' he can't remember and lying about it and in addition he hands in his notice at work. Either that or you file for divorce. Either way, it will cost him.

SonicTheHodgeheg · 31/08/2024 10:45

I understand that you can’t forgive him until you know everything that you’re forgiving him for.

Having been where you’ve been, knowing everything won’t help you move on. He’s only told you under duress some of the story , if he tells you more then you’ll never know if it’s everything or the truth. In typical cheater fashion, he’s minimised what’s happened and not told you what you can prove. I think that there’s a lot more that you don’t know eg physical stuff but he doesn’t want to get into the ED stuff with you do wants to swerve that topic.

I’m pretty shocked that he’s not offered to leave his job. My ex’s mistress worked with him too and when he was at work I’d imagine all sorts during lunch hour and after work. Has he stopped going to all the out of work events ? If sport events are related to his work then moving jobs so that he can do out of work events again with a new bunch of people is a no brainer.

While it’s good that he’s treating you the way he should have done, what changes has he made that prioritise his relationship? Has he stopped messaging OW? Has he stopped trying to escape the group and be alone with her? If he’s doing all that then he’s basically dating you both openly now. I bet his colleagues suspect a full on affair so leaving separately etc is not fooling anyone. Is he still deleting messages ?

Ginandpanic · 31/08/2024 10:44

TangerinePlate · 31/08/2024 10:14

Lots of cheating man have ED with their wives,strangely enough they are like Duracell bunnies on viagra with OW.

Sorry OP but he’s lying,of course he shagged her several times.

As for the length- it’s not a ONS or a few months fling. It’s a new relationship lasting years.

He’s paying you a lip service. If he wanted to save your marriage he’d move the earth to give you the truth,not the loft extension(to shut you up).

I’d recommend reading the Chump Lady book. She explains beautifully the Script of the affair and the tactics of the cheaters including the aftermath.

In the meantime get some counselling just for yourself.Work on you and what YOU want.

Good luck 💐

Was going to say this.
one of my friends husbands had ED with her but not his mistress of 7 years .

I spoke to him about it afterwards he said it was guilt causing the ED with his wife.
he has no problems with his new partner either.

Theeyeballsinthesky · 31/08/2024 10:43

Iwillcomeouttheotherend · 31/08/2024 10:28

Thank you for your time to read and respond.
I really don’t think he will talk anymore about it, not just the specific details but in general.
He becomes so stressed whenever I ask him anything about it or bring up the subject.
He won’t leave the job, he’s worked there for 35 years.
Cant imagine she will either, shes been there about 5 years.
He very much is showing me by his actions but im desperate to talk.

Fuck me he’s got a nerve

basically he doesn’t want to do anything that might heaven forfend make him uncomfortable or god forbid stressed

bluntly he just wants you to shut up about it all even though he’s still going to see her every day at work??

gently OP placating you with a loft extension and having sex is just him wanting it all to go away. I mean lucky him - not only have you not kicked his sorry arse to the kerb but you’re even having sex with him

do you really want him to stay?

Fedupmumofadultsons · 31/08/2024 10:42

Sorry op but you cannot for better word for it be that dim of course they were having sex .it's been a 5 year relationship so a few nights he couldn't get it up wouldn't have put her off not after 5 years suddenly as you caught him he can suddenly have sex with you again .think honestly when did his ed with you honestly stop .no amount of extensions would help this one .don't torture yourself honestly poor you cheating sod

Commonsense22 · 31/08/2024 10:42

Iwillcomeouttheotherend · 31/08/2024 10:28

Thank you for your time to read and respond.
I really don’t think he will talk anymore about it, not just the specific details but in general.
He becomes so stressed whenever I ask him anything about it or bring up the subject.
He won’t leave the job, he’s worked there for 35 years.
Cant imagine she will either, shes been there about 5 years.
He very much is showing me by his actions but im desperate to talk.

Showing you by his actions would be quitting his job and talking.
I'm afraid refusing to talk and staying in his job is showing you by his actions that you are not his priority. He can't do things on his terms.

PeriIsKickingMyButt · 31/08/2024 10:41

He's horrible to you and he's having an affair. What will it take for you to leave him?

PrimalOwl10 · 31/08/2024 10:41

I couldn't read all your opening post it was far too long. if I'm being honest 4 years isn't an emotional affair it's a full blown affair. The fact he went to her hotel room suggests they are having sex op. He's been emotionally distance are all classic signs.

AdviceNeeded2024 · 31/08/2024 10:41

My advice having been there recently is I know how hard this and wanting to know everything, however it does not matter how much you ask you will never get the full truth only the watered down version and you’ll always be left wondering what else you don’t know. It will eat away at you and it will consume you and it really won’t help anything.

You need to decide if you want to move forward or not. If you do, you HAVE to draw a line in the sand over the details of what exactly went on.

I wouldn’t be able to move on from this, I tried and I had just totally lost all trust and couldn’t get over the betrayal. Every time he was on his phone I was wondering who he was talking to. It’s not healthy. To be honest he was a twat anyway and it’s just made me resent him and I’m pleased to have left him behind.

Keenovay · 31/08/2024 10:40

It struck me that by refusing to talk about details, he's still controlling the narrative - just like before, when he'd say this wasn't the right time to talk about x, y or z.

Could you suggest going to couple's counselling together as a mark of his commitment going forward? It would be a boundaried space for him to hear how he's hurt you and what you need from him. And hopefully the counsellor might challenge him to open up a bit more.

I admire you for listening to your authentic feelings of unease despite his new "good behaviour" and hope you will find some peace and resolution, inside the marriage or without it.

Swipe left for the next trending thread