Husband made lists about what I have done ‘wrong’

Stay strong, OP. You're right about not wanting to model an unhealthy relationship for your kids to see. After you're through the tough part, it will be much better.

You are actually doing really well OP.

If you can't face counselling, who is going to berate you for 'not making the effort'?

Divorce can be no fault now. You don't have to prove anything and it will give him a cudgel to beat you with if.

Oh and if you do ho to counselling with him, absolutely mention that you absolutely feel that he took advantage of you, he was 8 years older and he introduced you to drink and drugs.

Make a fine long list yourself of how awfully lazy he is.
Also stop doing ANYTHING for him.

OP, pls be kind to yourself and get through these weeks.

He is vile and, controlling and abusive.
You will soon realise that finding that list was a blessing.
It gave you the push to get out.
Please call Womens aid for a chat.
Also you can ring 101 and have a marker put on your house as you are trying to leave an abusive relationship.
Should he burst into your room again, call the police.
Let him see you are very serious.
I think you have been abused and controlled for years and are coming out of a fog.
That is why you cannot look at him.
The scales have fully fallen from your eyes and he knows this.
THAT is why he is back tracking.
He knows you are really done.
He is utter scum and he absolutely targeted you as a young girl.
Its what controlling abusive scum do.

Don't be sad, be glad that you are going to get away from him.
Tell family and friends the truth.
Take support from where you can.

We are here for you.

You are doing amazingly. You are bound to feel low with such awful things happening but I’m in awe of your strength in taking action and not letting your vile husband walk all over you. Don’t put any pressure on yourself to be fun mum- just survive the next few weeks.
I think you’ve done the right thing agreeing to counselling- the likelihood is he’ll never bother to arrange it. If he does, then you still have nothing to fear- just tell the counsellor about the lists and there’s no way they could side with him!
sending strength - you can do this.

Woah! This post has really made me see red. You can absolutely feel the entitlement. It would be a dealbreaker for me, I'd be getting ducks in a row - and would probably have my own list to hand to him as me and the kids walked out of the door.

I think deleting them is irrelevant. He made the list on the first place. I wonder if he'll suggest that you're crazy and that thre was no list.

Of course in order to expedite this as an option he’s deleted the list, acknowledges that it was a heinous thing to do and apologised profusely.

The counsellor can’t make you talk about his list of all your failings if you don’t want to, you can just say something like

“ I understand that John wants to talk about all the things I’ve done wrong and what he thinks will fix our marriage. But I have already decided that I’m leaving so I don’t think it’s helpful to discuss the past. I want to use this time to agree way forward, how we can make our separation as amicable as possible and cause the least harm to our children. the more we can agree here, the less we will spend on legal fees ans the quicker we can move on to co parent amicably”.

Im sure you can work out how to say this better.

his ideal outcome at this point is that I pretend it didn’t happen at all and to go back to doing everything.

He can fuck right off with that. And you will feel so much better without him.

I'm glad you're feeling a bit better.

I love a list but this is shocking.

I admire your strength even if you don’t feel strong at the moment.

Hang on in there.

This is the toughest part - making the decision then holding your ground.

He won't leave, so it's up to you to dig your trenches and learn about emotional detachment so that his emotional blackmail washes over you like water off a duck's back.

Once you start divorce proceedings, the log-jam will start to clear and the wheels will be put in motion.

You will be divorced in a few months, and the admin aspect will begin to fall into place.

Stop doing anything for him. All domestic niceties stop now - cooking, washing, blah blah. Separate from him emotionally and practically so that anything to do with him is his own responsibility.

Keep a tidy life for you and the kids. Make your own routine that doesn't include him.

And keep your eyes on the prize: a better life for you and your children without the giant man-baby dickhead who tried to steal your life.

@IfIwasablackbird can you imagine anything that he could do that can change your feelings?
When was the last time you were talking to your husband heart to heart?

Based on your updates I actually don't think that couple counseling will go well, it feels like it will just be a waste of time and money with him trying to defend his position and him thinking that he is paying the counsellor to show how unreasonable you are. Also good professional counsellors are a rare breed.

What do you think will be the best outcome for you from this situation? Can you ask him what will his ideal outcome of this situation be?

Please remember that yes a divorce will take way too long versus what you deserve which is immediate freedom BUT you survived 20 years with this man and really sound very sane and balanced for someone who has gone through that, you are clearly resilient enough to make it through a divorce. Say what he wants to hear for counselling and keep quietly pressing on with the admin of the divorce. You are completely entitled to feel sad and upset but keep the logical part of your brain on as well and remind yourself that this period will pass and better things lie out there for you in the future.

I'd like to say a few things about a child arrangement order. I'm no legal expert , this is merely my experience just under 20 years ago.

So I had no choice but to get one as I had to remove the children from him due to threats of him taking them away from me if I dared to attempt to leave him. I had to get a a prohibited steps order so that he couldn't carry out his threats , then go on to hash out a child arrangement order in court. He used that child arrangement order as a stick to beat me with , he neglected those children , they cried when I had to send them to him , but I had no choice as it was all there in black and white. He also would try to physically intimidate me during handover. It was torturous for the kids and myself.

My advice is to avoid this order unless he is making threats. If he's not interested in the children then just let it be. That way you're not packing them off for a weekend of chaos every other week then having to pick up the pieces when they return.

@IfIwasablackbird yes , once the love has gone you just don't care any more.

Exh had a new 'partner' about 3 months after I left him. She was one of his friends. I'd even met her a few times at gatherings.

Hopefully you'll have some space soon too. These types are all the same really.

I think you just need to see the solicitor and file for divorce. You are done. You don't need his permission or his agreement to move forward with the divorce. When you see the solicitor it would be worth discussing a child arrangement order.

I think individual counselling will benefit you far more than couples counselling.

I wouldn't be happy about this at all it's utterly unnecessary and I wouldn't accept that sorry you found that