To think we should go as a family to lunch with my boss

I think it's absolutely dreadful to expect spouses to be supports in this way. Kathy Lette , who generally isn't funny, was spot on when she described this as being a "human handbag" draped over the succesful spouse's arm.

I’d insist on everyone going. It’s in his best interests too. It’s about putting on a united front. Looks shitty for him not to go and looks odd if the kids don’t go. He’s invited you for a family lunch. Your boss means ‘the family’.

Not asking you to agree, just not to call different opinions "faux".

Right, most people may have partners who will support them in this stuff. But what about the ones who don't? Should they suffer in their careers because of it? Or the people whose partners really can't for whatever reason. Or the people who don't have partners who would make a good impression.

You're ok with the way this stuff works because you're clearly suited to it and have benefitted from it. And like anyone who's benefitting from a system, you're talking about it like it's some sort of law of the universe that can't be changed. It could be changed, if the people within it resolved to change it. And like anyone who benefits from a system, you've got a giant blind spot on how it can disadvantage others.

Your boss is so weird for even inviting you. Unless you have made a separate friendship outside of work it is inappropriate to mix business and pleasure.

Well they have a cleaner and op does a fair amount of housework so apart from school runs he doesn't seem to bring much to the table. I would think the same if the sexes were reversed. I was a sahp for a while and found it much easier than working but that's an unpopular view on here.

@LyingWitchInTheWardrobe

Unless there are only two employees in the company the boss is making a point and being a twat about it.

Why do you see inviting someone to lunch as “being a twat”?

I just can’t see how anyone can square that circle. In what universe is extending an invitation “being a twat”?

I get that some people may find that level of intimacy with an employer pressured and awkward. I get that sometimes people might not want to do it.

But to interpret it as hostile seems such a leap. Who would go to the hassle of preparing an elaborate meal for someone they didn’t like?

It’s such a paranoid way to see the world…

When you call him an "ungrateful twat" you imply that his role is somehow beneath that of his wife. And also that being a SAHP is only beneficial to him and not the whole family.

They have a cleaner and the kids are at school. The husband still expects the OP to do the housework. I think calling himself a SAHP is pushing it. He's not exactly run ragged.

They would probably be quite upset if they knew that at least some of their invited staff would feel obliged to go

Of course they are obliging their staff to attend. Why else extend the invitation? It's not a nice and friendly thing it's a work event in the boss's home. The nice thing would be for the boss to offer to take staff out to dinner once in a while, to a restaurant/pub/whatever. All staff, not this. Unless there are only two employees in the company the boss is making a point and being a twat about it.

and to keep on top of house stuff if the kids are at school/nursery for part of the day.

Which he is not doing.

I wonder if I am the only one who is feeling sorry for the OP's boss and his wife? The company that @OopsyDaisie works at does not sound like some enormous conglomerate where the only important factors are making money and speed!

The OP's workplace sounds much more like a company my dear departed mum used to work for. It had an owner/managing director, his secretary/PA, and then a few departments that had their own department heads. One was where the manufacturing took place, another was a smallish warehouse, then there was the accounts department - where my mum worked (they still used calculators, and some sort of small machine where you input numbers and they came out on a role, they weren't called computers, but then this was the 1970's) - then the last proper department was the filing department, which was a smallish room filled with rows of files, and just one member of staff who did the full-time filing there. Everyone knew everyone else's names at that firm, and at least a potted history of most of their colleagues.

If the OP's work place is similar in size to the place my mum worked, and just as friendly, then her boss is probably trying to do a nice thing for his staff, and not for networking reasons for goodness sake, just for fun - hence them being invited as families, to just relax and enjoy themselves. His wife may also feel a little stressed about providing the lunch. I know that my mum's old boss's wife used to enjoy holding these occassional events, but as she was a normal human being, she would get a little stressed in case something went wrong! As I mentioned before, they were not some large corporation, who when holding events would employ outside caterers to provide the refreshments etc.

So in my imagination OopsyDaisie's boss and his wife are just trying to do a nice and friendly thing. They would probably be quite upset if they knew that at least some of their invited staff would feel obliged to go, and that some of their staff's spouses and children were trying to think of ways to get out of going! Please go with your children OP, and have an enjoyable time, which by the sounds of it will be much better without your selfish husband's presence.

@Screenshotted

Covid made being antisocial fashionable. It is all over social media, ‘introverts’ bragging about how much they hate other people. Very few people are true introverts.

I agree and it’s my absolute number one bugbear. Apart from the fact it’s an inaccurate characterisation of being an “introvert” it’s just really really negative and self sabotaging.

If you look at all the data, people who age well are people who maintain a healthy degree of contact with the world outside their families. There’s evidence that maintaining a social life is a protective factor against dementia among other things. Particularly for women, who tend to have fewer opportunities to socialise anyway.

That doesn’t mean having to be a bon viveur out drinking every night of the week or a professional networker. It just means keeping a healthy perspective, keeping your social skills alive and having more to talk about than your family’s immediate needs and priorities.

It depresses and frustrates me beyond belief that people celebrate this awful retreat into the family bubble. Having watched my mum disappear into this bubble of loneliness because she didn’t keep her networks up, it makes me want to shake people when they see non family life as a negative.

I only read the OP's first post but reading further then she has a decision to make. If a parent is staying at home then it's up to them to run the home and take on the lion's share of tasks, whether they are male or female.

If OP's husband isn't pulling his weight then he needs to start doing that - or go out to work and the pair will pay childcare as needed.

What if one of OPs children has an accident at the bosses house then op feels uncomfortable working there so has to leave?

What if they get food poisoning?

What if op chokes on a chicken bone?

What if the boss only has fizzy drinks and ops children only drink water?

What if op is running late and gets a speeding ticket?

What if lightening strikes as they are walking from the car?

What if they have a great time so they get invited back?

Yea, best off not going op. Too many things can go wrong at a lunch.

I’ve just re-read this post and can’t work out how to edit it so my apologies for the autocorrects 🥹
really sorry
your career aspirations
whether we like

Nobody should be 'smooching' their boss. The only people who do this or need to, are brown-noser types who are not good at their jobs.

Take your children if you want to, OP, but I'm in agreement with your husband on this one. My view is that if I were asked to do this I would politely decline citing prior commitments. But then I'm very good at my job.

Just a quick point on your husband 'not working'. He doesn't work outside the home as he's the stay at home parent. You work outside the home because he facilitates this. Your salary covers your family. I would be incensed to be thought of and disregard as 'not working' if I were a stay at home parent.

Maybe the weekend should be for the whole family to be together and this sort of event is where you need to draw the line and say to your boss, “Sorry, no can do. Let’s have coffee or even quick bite after work on X day. But can’t do weekend, we have plans.”

There are 51 other weekends in the year. I’m sure OP’s husband can suck it up once.

He doesn’t seem that bothered about the whole family being together on the other weekends when he’s playing sport. I’m not saying parents shouldn’t have hobbies - but it’s a bit pathetic to take time out to do that, but then get all po-faced saying “But the weekend is family time!” when expected to put yourself out in a very minor manner for your spouse.

Yes, it's his self-esteem. He's terrified that someone will smile across the table at him and say 'And Tom, what's your line of work?'

Actually, I'm beginning to think that given that he's a 'to the point' sort of person perhaps it's best if he doesn't go with you, OP.

Take dc to the lunch and enjoy yourselves. Is dh is concerned that he will be somehow lesser perdon because you are top family earner... its his self esteem thats the problem here

"Whatever your DH's motivations, it sounds like he has been enabled to opt out of a fair amount of what he should be doing to support your job as the main earner. Sadly, this is very much in keeping with far too many SAHP's I have known, particularly the male ones".

I don't think a sahp 'owes' this kind of support tbh. No partner does, regardless of whether they woh or not. A sahp supports by taking care of the children, so the wohp has an easier work life, without the stress of nursery pick ups, school holiday care, having to be home when dc are unwell etc. Having a sahp saves on childcare costs and means the dc have a parent who is on hand. That's the sahp's job, and to keep on top of house stuff if the kids are at school/nursery for part of the day.
It's the woh persons job to manage their work and expectations around it.

Personally I don't like the bleed into personal time - the relationship between OP and boss can't be a true friendship because there's an imbalance of power. I totally get why the dh wants to opt out, but also why OP feels obliged to go.

But the dh sounds problematic outside of this issue tbh - he shouldn't be badgering OP while she is at work events and he really ought to be doing more of the house stuff.

Why can't you build relationships at work, or at events in work time?

Sometimes to progress in your career you need to be flexible and willing to build relationships by doing things outside of the traditional 9-5.

It's always been the case but in the past it was male orientated activities such as golf, bars and strip clubs.

A family lunch is the modern equivalent.

You have a cleaner and the kids are at school and he still expects you to do the housework. Him hassling you to come home from work dinners is just jealousy. I think SAHP title is pushing it and I'd love to know what he'll be doing in 10 years time. Probably not a lot!

"What if the boss's children are unpleasant to the OPs children, but the boss thinks a lovely time was had by all, so next month let's go for a weekend away together! Do OPs children get told to suck that up for mummy's career?"

This is so telling, this automatic assumption that it will all be horrible and people will be nasty. I guess it comes from a place of fear. I do hope the poster who wrote that isn't bringing up children or grandchildren in this spirit. No wonder so many young people seem to have difficulty with basic social skills and resilience.

There are times in every adult's life when, actually, the wise and adult thing to do is to suck it up. Teaching your children that sometimes they have to just get on with stuff and show them how to make the best of it is one of the most valuable lessons you can offer them.

Covid made being antisocial fashionable. It is all over social media, ‘introverts’ bragging about how much they hate other people. Very few people are true introverts.

There are however many socially anxious people who are fiercely protective about their own tiny lives. They don’t want to share their time with anyone. it becomes a problem when that includes the children they have. Every weekend is spent glued to each other and nobody is allowed a look-in, even family. It feels like a very claustrophobic existence to me.

When I look at my elderly parents and their friends, the ones who are doing well are the ones who have always led busy and sociable lives. They now have a network of friends to turn to. Their adult kids may be in different countries or they may not have had children. However the friendships they have invested in doing their adult lives have paid off.

You never know when you might meet someone new whom you like and who might enrich your life. I met my best friend aged 40! Why close yourself off?

I look at some people on here do not envy the way they choose to live their lives.And I feel sorry for the kids.