Annoyed at MIL

Don't think light-hearted is going to work in this instance as the Mil has already went against op wishes.

Clearly you can't leave, 10 is getting towards puberty it's too old to be bathing with a cousin particularly of the opposite sex. I'd be clear with your dh before the visit and stand your ground when you are there.

Try to be lighthearted but firm "no thank you dc had a shower she doesn't need a bath" "that's kind mil but dd is sleeping with me tonight thank you" Everytime. Teach your elder child to say no thank you too.

FFS it's easy to remedy on your Dh part
Stop putting our daughter in these situations.
His first thought was about the nephew?.
I would be telling him our daughter is not an accessory to keep the nephew happy.

You tell MIL that she and her grandson are not entitled to your daughter's naked bodies. You tell DH the same, just like that. If they try to make out you are being unfair then you say that their obsession with getting your children naked and/or alone is raising red flags and the fact that haven't dropped it when you said no is alarming and creepy.

This has to stop. Loads of red flags here and even if your MIL genuinely believes it’s all innocent fun she is disregarding both your and your children’s (and the other children’s) boundaries. This is extremely dangerous. Many, many of us have experienced difficult or CSA situations that could have been prevented if the responsible adults had paid more attention to how important it is to have clear boundaries and respect for a child’s boundaries as well as teaching children it’s OK to say NO.
Don’t waste another second worrying about MIL or DP feelings, your children are far more important and if those two don’t get it then you’ll have to make firm decisions and show you will stick to them to the point of going no-contact.

Grooming that's the word I was looking for. Yes she's grooming her and that's it makes it so scary and sick

I wouldn't leave DD out of my sight for a second for the rest of the visit. My car could be on fire, I would not step out of that house without DD.

DD sleeps with you, you bathe her, you watch her play. I don't care what you have planned for the rest of the visit, you modify them so DD is never ever alone.

Your MIL is grooming DD. No sane woman would put a naked 10 year old boy in a bath with a 7 year old girl and then insist they sleep together too.

💯

You will probably end up being the bad guy with MIL and your foolish DP, yes. Unfortunately that's the price to be paid for your daughter's safety and dignity. You will have to be very, very firm even if it means falling out with MIL and DP sulking.

I have had to say this too many times on MN because there are so many naïve people, but I was raped (more than once) by a family member when I was very little, in circumstances similar to what you're describing. And an idiot grandmother trusted a boy with me when she shouldn't have done. I've never forgiven the adults who should have protected me. When I grew older I hated my grandmother and mother for letting it happen. I hated them just as much as I hated the rapist. Don't let that happen to your little girl and you.

Your MIL is even worse because she's actively offering up your child to this boy, and deliberately waiting until your back is turned so that she can do it. The nephew has an abnormal and unhealthy interest in being in bed or a bath with a little girl. Boys of his age do have an interest in girls' bodies. She shouldn't be encouraging it. And your partner should be putting his own vulnerable child's safety and comfort first, not defending his nephew. Sadly it's common for men to assert that other men and boys are innocent, whether or not they are.

@pikkumyy77 is absolutely right. And you need to be strong now, not wibble about upsetting two extremely foolish adults who are not putting your precious, vulnerable child first. In the case of MIL I have to wonder if it's actually worse than foolishness, and she believes that men and boys should be given what they want, even if it means harming or upsetting girls. Frankly in your shoes I'd read MIL and DP the riot act, never let her be with my child again without me being in the room, keep the nephew away, and if that angers DP so much the relationship ends, so be it. That's a better outcome than your little girl ending up as damaged as me.

Absolutely.
I (stupidly) tried to bathe my DN8 and my toddler (both are boys) together once when looking after DN and was quickly shown by DN’s behaviour that he didn’t feel comfortable with that. I used to bathe him all the time as I look after him quite a bit. Nowadays he doesn’t even like me in the bathroom with him anymore, so I just make sure he is safe getting in and out and for everything else I am on the other side of the bathroom door as he is big enough to wash himself.

I highly recommend The Gift Of Fear or Protecting The Gift by Gavin debecker about relearning to trust your instinct when it comes to safety for yourself and your children. Your MIL and husband are both colluding in pretending that this is cute/harmless. But even if nothing happens (overtly) they are teaching you and your daughter that your feelings mean nothing and your boundaries can be ignored.

Your dh is, perhaps, just a bit of a fool but he needs to wise up. Your daughter needs to know she can refuse to be someone’s plaything.

Sometimes you have to turn on your inner killer. Just tell your dh in the flattest, scariest, voice you have “No one bathes or touches my daughter without my agreement. Its.Not.Happening. Tell your mother and nephew to get to fuck or don’t tell them. This is not my problem. This is not happening. Deal with it.”

This is so weird. Mils or cousins feelings are irrelevant here. Protect your child. I would never put my 4 year old ds in a shared bath/bed with older children like that. I had already started puberty at age 10 ffs.

Why is the main concern mil's feelings at the expense if the children? Makes zero sense to me.
MIL, I have already bathed my dd. Do not do it.
End of. 🤷‍♀️

i think you need to not make this personal, as it coming across a little that your not keen on dn. Keep it factual and keep asking why ? why is it so important to share a bed, listen and then say no.
Ask mil if shed like to share a bath with anyone? and then ask why dd and dn aren't given the same privacy.
Stick to your guns. Stop explaining and start being annoying, your mil and dh aren't interested in your feeling so stop being worried about theirs

So you didn't put your foot down about the bed thing and now your DC is in bed with an older child but you don't want to say anything or step in and remove your DC to avoid a row? Or have I read that wrong? If that's the case then you're bang out of order for putting MIL's feelings before your DC's safety

You're doing the right thing by your children OP. I cannot comprehend how some adults believe it's ok for children from different families to bathe or shower together.

I think a 10 year old, unless with significant disabilities, should be bathing alone. However, a toddler should have adult supervision. So it's simply not appropriate for them to be in a bath together.

i would emphasise to both your DH and MiL that all the children should be taught body autonomy and the right to privacy. It is important they all learn that they don't have to be uncomfortable to humour someone else. While your children are so young you need to advocate for them.

Agree 100% tell her clearly it’s not happening, it’s not cute. Explain to her you and DH are teaching DDs that their bodies are their own, they are private and they are to say no if anyone asks them to play in water, bed or anywhere else with no clothes, no exceptions, even people they like/love Explain you are teaching them this as a simple age appropriate way of keeping them safe and setting boundaries, and you don't want mixed messages.

Dig your heels in even if ehe’s offended. Aside from anything else, puberty for girls is much earlier nowadays, your 7yo will be feeling uncomfortable in short order with this carry on.

Tbh what your Mil is doing looks very like grooming. Not sayings it is but she is definitely blurring the normal boundaries.

Trust your gut as a mother. I'm just really creeped out by your mil encouraging it. I'd keep an eye on her. I read something really awful in the papers a few years ago and it was actually a granddad touching his granddaughters. They only caught him because they installed a camera and he didn't know.

Don't tell them about your abuse because they'll belittle it like it was just in your head.

When I was 3 an older cousin of mine used to take to me to 'play'. Long story short he would have raped me had it not been another female cousin coming to look for me. He would remove my knickers and make me sit in his lap. I'd quickly get up and cry or shake because I didn't like what he was doing . I tried telling my mum once that he was 'touching my clothes' because as a 3 year old i didn't want to say he's touching my knickers. I felt embarassed.

When I was a teenager i went to visit his house next door to my gran. My gran made sure she sent someone to get me and my sister even though his wife was there. She yelled saying what are you doing there? A cousin said to me it's because then lads do dodgy things stay away (he raped another cousin when she was 12). In my head I think they're saving teens when in reality they should be protecting toddlers and babies. Those that have no voice or are too young. But now 20 years later, everyone's forgiven that guy and no one remembers what he did. The girl he raped...I told her sister what he was doing to me and she told me off saying don't talk about dirty things with my sister. I felt humiliated and embarassed. Shame 3 years later he raped her.

This is 100 percent not ok. And I am an anthropologist so I usually have a pretty wide tolerance for different cultures. This is not only a precursor to sexual abuse but it is teaching your dd that she has no right to privacy if a more favoured person wants to play with her body.

It is completely inappropriate for your dd to bathe or sleep with a cousin who is so much older. Don’t get drawn into discussions about child sex abuse—your mother in law will have hysterics and accuse you of persecuting the favoured grandchild.

Just say “dd is not a toy she is a person. We choose to guard her privacy and are raising her to expect to be respected. She does not bathe or sleep with anyone but dh and me. That is the rule.”

Privately tell your dh “MIL is not doing your nephew any favours as she is not raising him to have good personal boundaries. If he tries to bathe eith or get into bed with any little girls he jnows at school he is going to wind up in big trouble.”