To ask if you couldn't imagine leaving your baby and then young dc with strangers?

And people who don't have grandparent support? You know, because of living a distance away or the fact they've lost their parents or their parents simply don't want to help?

Do you have any grasp on a reality outside of your own bubble?

Oh, so should I be choosing to downsize from my 2 bed property so I don't have to go to work? Or choosing to live in an area where my daughter will have to go to a much worse school than this area, despite it costing us more.

The sacrifices we have made are to ensure she gets the life she deserves. We also did a lot of research, and she's in an amazing nursery setting, which is part of developing her into the amazing little person she's becoming, and then beyond that.

You don't get to decide what the right approach is for all children because of three months nursery experience and some reading. You get to decide the right life for your family. I'll decide mine. OP can decide for hers. And every other parent on this thread can make the right call for their family.

You should stop being judgemental, though. Because you're not setting a good example to your children by acting like you're above other people.

@PutOnYourRedShoesAndLetsDance hi what job do you do? I'm planning to go back to work but worried I won't have the freedom to do drops offs and pick ups.

I think most people can trust the child’s dad and or grandma (who are most likely to be the other people caring for the child) not to abuse the said child. If not, then those families have far bigger problems than whether a child should attend nursery or not.

This.
Your child is far less likely to be abused by someone known to the famijy than in a childcare setting. Unless you intend to not leave them with absolutely anyone?

Also we are not talking about those people who have absolutely no choice but a lot of people who claim they don’t have a choice, do. People don’t want to make any sacrifices these days. For example, we chose to stay in our 2 bed property for now so that I don’t have to go back to work once my mat leave is over or go back very part time.

I said earlier up the thread that my eldest went to nursery for a few months while I went back to work full time. Then I did my research.

No, we are both higher rate tax payers and get zero help from the government. We put in way more than we take out. My taxes pay for all those children who are in nursery when they don’t have to be- for example when the mother is on maternity leave with the next baby.

Not all kids get ill a lot at nursery. Mine has had one illness in two years, and she'd likely have picked up one in two years even if not at nursery.

Also, if you don't believe in nursery, what's your experience?

How many times do you need to be told that for many people it’s not a choice.

How many times do you need to hear that the number 1 indicator of poor outcomes for children is poverty. If parents do not work and force their household in to poverty that is hugely more detrimental to the outcomes and development of that child than working parents.

You do not live in the real world and like many other people have asked, who is paying your bills for you to sit at home in judgement? Is it my taxes!?

Also to posters who say “what about the fathers”. There are many studies that show a mother plays a unique role when it comes to healthy attachment and for children below 3, it is more beneficial to have the mother as the primary caregiver.

What that means is that you can’t dedicate yourself to both your job and your children at the same time. If your child is at nursery 8 hours a day and you only see them briefly first thing in the morning and then for an hour or so before bedtime during the week then you will be missing out on a lot of their childhood. People will say it’s about the quality not quantity but doing a morning nursery rush and then quick dinner and bedtime routine is not really quality time. In my experience they also get ill all the time when at nursery so the little time you have left with them, they often don’t feel themselves. You either choose to spend the majority of your time at work or with children, you can’t have it both at the same time- that’s what is meant by that phrase.

Nursery fees = £1.5K a month
My wage = £2.5K a month

Nursery fees did take 60% of my wage. Pension, NI, student loan etc did take even more. But even with £300 left, that £300 can be our food bill for the month. It also builds my pension etc. And means I can continue to progress in my career.

When cost of living is so high, even £100 more for working and putting baby in nursery has to be done. That can be the difference to scraping by and getting into debt. It can be the savings that saves your ass if something happens.

@IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos 👏🏼 👏🏼

Can they trust women either then? If we're just looking at "life"?

So many of the baby deaths or abuse cases that you hear about may be at the hands of men, but their mothers did nothing about it. They knew. They participated.

If I look at my own life, my father and my uncles looked after me regularly. And they are amazing men. They showed me what men are supposed to be. And that meant I wouldn't settle for less than the same.

At the same time I have an incredibly strong circle of women around me in my family. They won't put up with poor treatment, from anyone but definitely not men. They stand up for themselves and the ones they love. They're independent but part of a team.

That's what kids need. They need to see female role models who don't accept shit and make their own way. And male ones who are gentle and loving and protective and build them up in the world. And for those two role models to be able to come together as a team.

What they don't need is mother's who choose partners over them. Or parents who are too scared of the world to let them experience any of it. Or mothers who can't even be certain that their father is able to look after them.

Ridiculous thing to say. My daughter's keyworker as a young toddler was a man and she adored him. My husband taught primary school for a while and he was everyone's favourite teacher.

Not going back to work wasn't an option for me, even with nursery fees which dh paid my hourly rate made it worthwhile financially. Working isn't for me just about money, we knew two in childcare even if it was mornings would be expensive but I was able to add to my pension and the continuity had helped my career. Now I earn much more and that benefits my family. We were able to get a mortgage because of this and I saved a deposit on my earnings. My mil was kind enough to volunteer to have my older two for two afternoons a week (she fed them lunch and then down for a 2 hour nap) for 2 years. She was not up to having them all day so I did use nursery for the mornings. It was hard to leave them especally dd1 who was 10months old and not crawling at the time. She wasn't willing to help beyond this. I haven't needed to use childcare with my 3rd child but dh is further on in his career now and was able to compress his hours. I work around him and we feel this is in the best interests of dd2.

I know of plenty of sahms who have family support and send their kids to the grandparents for sleepovers every week and use babysitters regularly. I don't do this, work for me is a necessity but otherwise I don't choose to spend extended period of time away from them. It doesn't mean I love my children any more or less than they do.

My DD was left with strangers (nursery and childminders) because I had very little choice. I had her at 17, and we lived in pretty extreme poverty. I had no choice but to better our prospects with study and work. My own family were actually not fit to take care of her, so it was my only choice. I feel quite extreme guilt that was our life, and I had no choice, but it was the making of us.

Middle DS, has only ever been cared for by a friend who is a CM and his grandparents, or his sister or us as his parents, I feel really comfortable with that. I was SA at a similar age as DS is now, and I'm feeling less comfortable, especially given that no one was ever going to care for him until he was verbal..and it will be a long time until he is

Really glad my children benefited from great female and male role models

Look at life
Can they trust them?

Horrible post OP. Made me feel like crap.

I did prefer living in a small house and living within our means. But if a single mother had to work that's totally understandable

But what about the huge areas of this country where to live in anything beyond a shared house, you need two incomes? Letting agents and mortgage providers have income tests, they won't let you stretch yourself and "live within your means". Rent in the south east can easily be £1500 a month and many agents won't rent to you if that's more than 40% of your income after tax.

This absolutely. My OH quit his job when youngest was one and moved to get a more family friendly role. He was very clear with his employers why he was leaving. If more men demanded flexibility and shared childcare then policies would be more family friendly.

We need for there to be more male nursery staff, children’s nurses, early years teachers - men can be equally good at caring professions.

Absolutely.@IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos One wonders what that poster would do if encountering a male primary or pre school teacher. They are around! If you think all men are predators.of small children then you probably do need therapy!