Contributions from (pensioner) MIL to household

I think you can get a discount on certain things like maybe council tax if you have a pensioner living with you.
Might also get priority call outs if there is an issue with the boiler/heating etc should look into all of those.
She may also be able to get someone to help her attend appointments etc all these things are available even taxis. You would need to look into it.
Maybe talk to a social worker or welfare rights local council can't quite remember now.
Might be worth looking into having an annex built.

My grandmother had carers coming daily and a hospital bed in her downstairs room when she became immobile. Her children helped and she managed to stay in her own home with care.. if you had an annex built she could pay for it if she needed carers she would be able to afford it plus you'd also be there to make sure she isn't abused. This way she would use her money on her own care and possibly help cover costs so it doesn't impact on your col.

Feel really sad for old people. They maybe took care of their children while the kids were little and now feels like they get discarded when they get old seeing some of these comments.

Also just because people don't like each other doesn't mean you are a mug for looking after someone! Just shows who the actual well adjusted adult is. Doesn't mean you are a doormat or have to be one!
Surely being an adult means being able to take care of each other when needed not just getting the hump and going no contact all the time.

If you can't afford to heat the place then let her know. If you can't afford the bills then she should be made aware of it so she can understand that things have become more expensive and will be more expensive when they yet again put the fuel prices up!

This thread just makes me hope I die before I get to the point of needing any help from anyone if this is the mindset we are getting to.
Helping out your children but not your parents is teaching your children how to treat you as well when you get to that age.

I agree that it's worth find out out what she thinks she may need the money for eg specialist care. Another way of looking at this is if she intends to her daughter or grandchild to o her it she could pay even more now for the service which would mean it wouldn't get taxed on her death. The money could be kept on a seperate account and used for her needs if this ends up being necessary .

She may be thinking of that, yes, but this is not a gift so should not be a consideration in calculating Inheritance Tax if it is ever applicable..

It goes towards all the costs, rent, food, heating which would be considerably more if she had her own flat and carers coming in.

Wow. No one in my family would charge their own mother for anything other than the actual monetary cost of having her there. Helping with admin, and feeding the woman who wiped your arse for the first two years of your life is just the decent thing to do. You don't treat providing this "service" as a side-hustle and charge extra for it.
If it's too much to deal with, then you can organise help and she can pay for it from her funds. It might be worth remembering that the more you charge her now, the less money she'll have available to pay for decent residential care when her needs get really significant.
I write this as someone who's has lost four older family members to dementia, I'm not unsympathetic to the stress it brings, but you need to separate the stress issue from the cash issue.

Another thirty years of 'treasure'.🙄

OP you have my respect and my sympathy, I did not move parents into my home but did get to a point where their care was taking the bulk of my time, mental energy and peace of mind. Had we done what you and your DP have done I would have seen nothing legally or morally wrong in expecting/accepting money from them. An additional adult significantly adds to the costs, fuel for heating and heating water, more washing to be done, more food and possibly different food. For you there will also be the cost of adaptations you have done and certainly a cost in petrol for driving her to appointments. You are both giving hugely in time and care so her contributing to the household costs is not to big an ask.
AA does not apply where PIP was in place before pension age, carers allowance is usually an income replacement benefit for someone caring so many hours that they cannot work full time. Might be worth going to your local CAB or an age related charity to see what is available locally in terms of day centres, lunch clubs etc. Would give you a break and maybe let her see how much she is getting just now.

OP, I would not go into the realms of pointing out how much more alternative care arrangements would cost - at that point you run the risk of being accused of trying to profit from your MIL, particularly by those who do not understand how costs add up. I don't think you need to, actually.

By all means you can break down all the very real costs you face with her living with you, but I'd start by simply pointing out to her that £600 per month is less than £20 a day for all her food, housing, heating, water and transport costs (together with anything else you pay for). That is an absolute bargain in anybody's terms nowadays. Tell her what the rate of inflation has been over the last few years, and point out gas and electric costs will rise again from 1st October, and again in January. I'd also be setting the expectation that it will need to keep up with inflation in the future, just as her pension payments will rise, otherwise you'll face regular disagreements going forward. I suggest applying the annual rate of increase in her state pension for ease.

Agree both sides need to sit down and look at the costs on paper.

@PaterPower "We haven’t discussed what that would cost if provided by an external agency. Perhaps we should be blunt, but it feels mercenary as she’s family"

You've already shown your family care by taking her in. She's gone back on the originally agreed deal. It's like saying that your care is not worth as much as originally thought? You mentioned that her household bills alone added up to £600 a month. She can and should afford to pay her way. She is now well cared for, more healthy and living in a secure and familiar family environment.

All emotions aside. It is not sustainable for her to consciously leave your household out of pocket, given the time you are sacrificing out of your own lives and the high level of care you are providing. There is an unseen cost to all this care. It's not mercenary to show her what the alternative costs would be if you weren't there to provide it.

It's important that you both need to care for yourselves and your DC as well as MIL, because this is a long-term situation.

This has to be sustainable or it will cause resentment, because she is putting you through hurdles that don't need to exist, and that is not going to be a happy environment for anyone, particularly her. If she pays her way, and it doesn't sound like you are asking for an overpayment. you can all live together, without resentment. She could for eg, afford to get an occasional cleaner in to take up some of the extra chores. Things like this would provide that bit of easement that would make the situation easier and less time pressed for all of you.

Her attitude is that she doesn't want her nearest and dearest to benefit from her staying there, whilst not even acknowledging the benefits she gets from this.
I think some cost comparisons on paper of what was previously paid, what is now available as a result and what the household costs currently are might alleviate any worries she may have that she is being short changed by someone who in reality is subsidising her. For example, she's been there 18 months, during which we have had rising energy bills and a cost of living crisis.

From the sound of it, having struggled in early life, she is a bit afraid of finances running short. But it can be illustrated to her that they won't. Obviously do it in a kind, but a factual way. It is your DP's and DP's DSis role but I think you could probably help them as they may find it hard to talk finances to a parent.

Its a very good idea to make a plan going forward of how this is going to work so that you can all live happily together and it is all transparent. Eg for the next year at least in the first session. It might help her to see that the facts are available for her to consider and that you are all happy to answer any questions she has. Eg plan/suggest having someone to come in and help MIL if you want a weekend away or something. Plan a bit of extra help around the house. A cleaner for her areas of the house. An account with a friendly local Taxi firm so that she can come and go as and when she pleases without 100 percent relying on lifts from you or where and how she could have a holiday or day trips.
You are obviously doing a lot but don't let her become overly dependent on only you and DP, each side needs to retain a bit of their independence for this to be sustainable. Talk to Age Concern or similar, they must have come across this situation.
Hopefully she will see that you DP and Dsis are helping her to make workable plans for her future well being in an open transparent manner and that will reassure her and you. Best of luck

Honestly, im more horrified and disgusted by your situation. Sounds like you've had to tell yourself a lot of lies to back up your martyr complex as you can't face the reality of what you put yourself through. You let a woman move into your home even though she treated you like dirt. You didn't outsmart her daughters, you were foolish. They got all the money and didn't have to run around and slave away for an unpleasant person. Your children would have known that their grandmother didn't like their mother and they would have seen you desperately trying to buy her affections. That's not a good environment for them. She didn't choose them, her daughters just didn't want her.

Charge her more. If she lived elsewhere it would be a lot more expensive.

My uncle has just died meaning his dementia care home fees of £8K / month have finally ended.

I think what your dsd is paying is not relevant. She shouldn't be judging her own contributions based on this as her circumstances are different. I dont think 600 is alot for living expenses, I don't know about factoring in your time unless you are losing money to manage her care and you are acting as her official carer. Also just wondering why it bothers her paying 200 more.. is she saving for something else.. is she going on a cruise and needs the money herself?

I dont understand you saying you've added those details for context, if they aren't costing you money what context are you referring to?

Surely she's moved in because of her age and health issues and not for you to charge her for daily tasks? How much in bills and food does she actually cost you? Charge her that.

The agreement was always that she would pay more once she no longer had her own house bills - how is it unfair to enforce that? I don't see why you thinknits taking advantage- just her food bills alone could easily be £200 a month. Then add on the extra electricity, gas, maintenance, driving to multiple appointments etc. £400 probably isn't even covering her costs.

As a partner I think you are very kind to have agreed to your MIL moving in.
For many it simply wouldn't happen.
It is not unreasonable at all for her to fully cover her costs when she is more than able to.
You own part of this house and it is not on you to subsidise your partners parent with a healthy income.
What your DSD is asked for is none of your MIL's business.
Speak up and make your position clear or suggest to your partner assisted living elsewhere might be best.

Sorry if mentioned already but you can potentially get a reduction, and back pay on your council tax if someone in the household has a diagnosis such as dementia. Have a look on your own Council website or on Martin Lewis Money-saving site for guidance

Yes @sleekcat it would be hard for most people. Only possible for me as DH and I WFH fairly flexibly. I think I might choose to go into assisted living when the time comes.

I always think @5128gap has good advice and her logic seems sound!

I think you need to separate out the things we do for our family from love and care for them, (which for me would include help with admin, serving them a portion of the family meal we'd be cooking anyway and taking them to medical appointments they can't access themselves) from things that leave you out of pocket. Your MiL should be covering the extra expenses incurred from her living there, her food, utilities usage, petrol for her errands etc, basically anything that you wouldn't spend if it weren't for her. If cleaning and laundry for her is onerous, then maybe buying in that.
Then, to ensure the arrangement is mutually beneficial, an element of 'profit' for you at a rate that doesn't leave her short, but compensates you for the compromises of the arrangement.
If the arrangement is also saving care costs that will result in a greater inheritance for your partner, you need to remember that too as if so anything you do and spend now will be repaid to some extent in the fullness of time.

I don't think anyone will think you are a mug. It's a nice thing to do if you can manage/afford it. But I could not have other adults in the house and afford to pay for the extra costs. I also would not find it easy to take a parent to regular appointments - wouldn't have the time off work. Anyone who moved into my home would literally be on their own all day, five days a week.

Is there likelihood she will need residential care in due course? If so, she’s probably thinking about funding and having some savings for this.

Also, how involved is she in household decisions? Maybe she wants to feel less like a paying guest

@EI12 I am Asian and making plans to move my mum into my house in a couple of years. I am not going to be charging her anything. And I will be taking her to appointments and cooking/caring for her if needed. So will my DH.

Asian values are different though. They are not better or worse; just different and I wouldn't presume to call OP disgusting.

I am also not going to be charging my DC anything for living with me. No doubt people will think I am a mug. Everyone has to do what's right for them.

But she has an assisted living environment living with you. It's just in your own home and costing her a lot less.

While I quite see that the amount she is paying isnt covering costs and should be increased. I do feel sorry for her! She is old,in poor health,no longer has any autonomy over her life, is dependent on other people for basic needs like food! Nobody here seems to be able to imagine how frightening and disempowering this must be for an adult who has lived in their own home, brought up a family and possibly had a career. As you get older so much is taken away by age and ill health! dignity autonomy and a sense of being valued in the world and in addition she has lost her own house and is now living under other peoples good will and auspices. She must be scared and feeling alone. We often as a society dismiss the feelings of older people as annoying or ridiculous and patronise them and speak down to them and yet these are other adults who have lived full and often useful lives like ours. From what you say i think assisted independent living might be her best option giving her autonomy and removing the financial burden on you and your partner. Relationships are often damaged when there is tension over money and it might be better for all if you if this is no longer a factor

Did you agree for her to live with you forever? That is quite a commitment. Especially as her health will decline and her physical needs increase. Rather than asking for more, it might be time to arrange for her to move out.

Sounds like you've had to do a lot of convincing yourself that that was okay.

Personally, I think you sound like a boiled frog.

LadyGabriella · Today 11:51

No I think £400pcm is fair. Anything more and you would be seen to be taking advantage of MIL. She is not requiring care home levels of care from you. We are supposed to look after our elders. Either stick at £400pcm or ask her to move out.

Mother in law wouldn't get anywhere near the support in a care home that she is receiving from OP and partner!