Contributions from (pensioner) MIL to household

I wasn't suggesting the council tax will increase in this case (it won't, that's obvious). I was using it as an example of the inequality when one adult only pays for the actual increase in a bill. Why should MIL only pay for usage rather than contributing to the bills proportionately, as you'd expect a partner to do?

"MIL was sleeping for most of the day because of her poor lifestyle prior to moving in.Yet the OP sees her as a handy source of income rather than as her partner's loved mother."

Comments like this are so unfair. They welcomed her into their home and for more than 18 months have been taking such good care of her that her health has improved and her mind is sharper than before.

As to admin... the admin involved in selling a long term home and downsizing to move into to smaller accommodation must have been considerable. The OP and family have made a sacrifice of space, time and effort to help an elderly relative.

They've looked after her now for over 18 months, because she couldn't cope on her own and agreed how much bills and expenses would be upfront. They kindly accepted a reduced rate whilst the house sale went through for all this period and now are asking for a fair contribution to household bills and expenses, which is being refused because GD is paying less.

I don't think the OP needs to be pilloried or be accused of wanting to profit from MIL when they've taken on the increased costs for the past 18 months without complaint and the MIL is very well able to pay her way. The OP and partner are also being generous to their DD in her first not that well paid job, to help her save for her own independence - they should be allowed to make that choice without justifying it to anyone else. They are not seeking a profit, but a reimbursement of costs.

From what you’ve said she is currently living with you because she was not managing alone. She needs to pay a fair share or find somewhere else to live, paying for the care she needs from her own funds. Your step-daughter’s arrangement is none of her business. You need to (with DP agreement) take a firm stand, reasonable timescale to move out if that’s her choice. Frankly she could live for decades calling the shots and festering bad feeling could definitely grow.

A partners not the same as an elderly relative who has moved in as they can't live alone, so why make the comparison? And its not just splitting bills, people are talking about charging her the same as a care home or charging her for tasks they do for her. And the Council tax won't increase.

Realised I missed that she gets a PIP payment, think you can’t get that and attendance allowance. I definitely think it’s fair to increase the amount being charged, really not an easy situation taking on all that

I do occasional work for a local agency who provides PAs for people who need a bit of extra assistance around the home. It might be helping with admin (incoming post, emails etc), light housework, preparing lunch, taking to appointments etc., taking them shopping or just companionship. My hourly rate is £15. I don't know what they charge the client.

If you stepped back and suggested she buy-in the level of support she wants, then I guess she would be looking at around 6 - 8 hours a week to cover all your additional running around to support her? I would get paid around £100 for that, so the cost to the client would be more.

This is crazy. In inheritance tax terms your dp’s mum should be giving any of her excess income away equally to her children each month not accruing it. This avoids iht on that amount so if she gives you say £800 in rent and the rest if not used on herself split between your dp and sibling(s).

Well don't worry OP you'll get your hands on her cash once she's dead won't you?

Unlikely. Not a single parent or in-law parent of mine has had anything to leave after death, despite initially owning houses and having good savings. Same applied re my grandparents. I'm an inheritance-free zone, as all needed care that cost well into the hundreds of thousands.

Consequently I'm finding ways to spend on my children now, and help them out where I can. And in OP 's mother's situation I'd be seeing this as an opportunity to be generous to my child and their spouse, who've so kindly taken me in and are caring for me, feeding me and ferrying me about.

I completely agree with this. I don’t like the idea of charging but I wouldn’t agree to providing long term care, so surely OP is doing better than most of us

Tell her it’s much better that the money goes to her daughter now, classed as rent so it would be tax free, rather than to be hit with high inheritance tax charge on it once she’s gone. Make it sound like you’re mitigating the tax situation rather than charging her more. That said, I can’t imagine imposing myself on my child and living in their house, at all, without wanting to make sure they had all the money I had at my disposal!

Lots of people would not agree to have their elderly parent (or their partner's elderly parent) move in with them at all. This is not the norm in the U.K. anymore. So some credit to the couple for this to start with.

Yes I'm amazed by the ageism on mumsnet and other social media.

Older people are vulnerable, just as younger people are. The OP even states that her MIL was sleeping for most of the day because of her poor lifestyle prior to moving in.

Yet the OP sees her as a handy source of income rather than as her partner's loved mother. Well don't worry OP you'll get your hands on her cash once she's dead won't you?

Really really sad post. If we are lucky enough to get old, this post is totally indicative of how society will treat us. Of no value except for our accrued personal assets.

I hope the OPs kids turn out kinder than her.

Would you take the same approach if it was an adult partner joining a single adult household? Eg the council tax increases by 25%, so they only pay 25% whilst their partner pays 75%? Why should the one moving in be subsidised by the other?

From what you’ve said I think there is a decent chance she would get attendance allowance. It’s not means tested, it relates to how much she can do for herself.

I filled in all the forms with my mum who has Alzheimer’s and she got the maximum amount - it’s about £450 a month. I was actually surprised she got that high level, as she can still do things like washing and dressing herself, but she can’t cook, shop etc and needs some help at night and would forget to take medication without being reminded. FWIW the advice I was given by the council was to base the answers on her worst days rather than her best.

Even if she’s deemed as qualifying for the minimum level it’s at least £300 a month.

I’d think if you or your partner took on the job of making the application it would be fair for that money to go towards her keep. It’s a long form but I don’t think it took more than an hour

www.gov.uk/attendance-allowance/what-youll-get

If she thinks she can find somewhere else and manage for cheaper then tell her to do so. She is a grown up and no one lives rent free. It is not making money off her, she is just paying her way. She shouldn’t be aware of how much DSD pays as the two are not comparable. Your DSD is completely independent for a start.

Christ, she’d be lucky to rent anywhere for £600 a month let alone be cared for 24/7.

You ought to be charging her nearer £1000 as you’re currently losing more than half your leisure time to caring for an elderly person. You could be spending your spare time doing other fun stuff, that no doubt the other daughter is enjoying.

Could you book her into somewhere for Respite care for a week to give yourselves a break and let her find out how much the cost of care is in the real world?

I'm of an age where I have to worry about the point where I might need help and not be able to live independently. And there's no way in hell that I'd live with one of my daughters and NOT ensure that the financial side of it was more then fair to her. In fact I'd ensure that it was more than generous, because it's a massive tie and responsibility for offspring taking in an elderly parent.

So ignore the holier then though posters. Your MIL can more than afford to be fair or generous (it would be different altogether if she couldn't) and as her needs and your responsibilities are only going to get greater, this needs sorting now.

I don't think the OP is saying he wants to charge MIL for admin and services...He's just saying that he's currently subsidizing her living costs and it's a struggle, at a time when her bills have gone down by two thirds and she can easily afford to make a more reasonable contribution but is refuses on the grounds that she wants to pay the same as her GrandD who is just starting out and saving to move out. All he's saying is that he would like her to contribute fairly to actual bills.

It's also not a question of helping his DD and not his MIL. She's already been living with them for 18 months and in that time her diet, health and living conditions have been considerably improved. The fact that he's helping his child has nothing to do with whether his MIL should contribute to her share of household expenses.

OP, I think you probably need to butt out of this one. This is your partner's mother, not yours. Would you expect to charge your mother the going rate for accommodating and looking after her in her last years? I looked after my mum for her last years (sharing the work with my sister) and neither of us expected her to pay us because she was our MUM and she'd brought us up and sacrificed a lot for us when we were young. I wonder whether your partner feels the same way?

Oscar Wilde defined a cynic as: 'A man who knows the cost of everything and the value of nothing.' I'm getting those vibes here. I'm also getting some pretty uncomfortable 'I'm the man of the house, my DP's a wuss and can't think straight so I'm going to take this on and get rid of MIL or make her pay' vibes. Maybe your DP is avoiding saying anything because she's not comfortable with your accountant-style approach to the situation. Maybe she's factoring in how her sister might feel if your mum contributes more generously to your household. Maybe she's playing the long game, hoping that she'll inherit half her mum's estate and will be able to help her DD out, and fears that if her mum ends up in care all the capital could be lost.

Talk the whole thing through again with your partner taking into account her feelings, not just the bottom line of the accounts. If she wants to look after her mum at home then perhaps she can change her work or go part time so that she's more available to provide care. Just don't reduce the most important relationship of her life — her mum — to a monthly payment.

£600 is a great deal. Tel her to find somewhere else and she will soon change her tune when she realises how much it will cost to live elsewhere. Or just tell her she needs to buy her own food and transport from now on.

if she is saving all their money then when the time comes the care home will just take it all anyway.
the dementia might make her decision making about money difficult.
doesn’t matter what children pay to live there. They can take care of themselves.

do not put yourself in debt
and get partner to sort it out as it’s not your mum. What happens if your parents need support ?

This.

Also consider Power of Attorney both financial & medical.

I’m not sure why you can’t charge extra for helping/ doing admin, driving her to appointments. Running a car isn’t free and there is an opportunity cost, loss of revenue from reduced working hours, less capacity for paid overtime ( also good luck getting a promotion at work whilst you are juggling caring responsibilities) as well as actual time spent. Time is often undervalued but it’s a precious and finite resource.

I think a better starting point would be to look at what costs could mil shoulder to help. A carer? A cleaner? A prepped meal service? I think looking after elderly relatives tends to take over your life whereas if you build in additional help at the start it’s easier to scale up as necessary. So often we wait for a crisis.

There are so many threads on here concerning elderly relatives who’ve needed looked after. People are often advised to tell social services they can not return and they can not provide care. This will be OP years down the line when they’ve run themselves ragged dealing with ever increasing care needs.

I agree with this too. We had my DM living with us part of the time and she insisted on contributing to food and the extra heating needed but the mortgage etc would have to be paid anyway. I wouldn't have dreamt of charging her for her care, in fact she used to get upset sometimes and say she hadn't had me to care for her in her old age.

If you are struggling financially, PaterPower please do investigate the possibility of your MIL being eligible for Attendance Allowance and you could then be able to claim Carer's allowance if you look after her for 35+ hours pw.