Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To consider reporting him

215 replies

cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 17:25

I have a much younger brother who is now in his late 20s. He had a very difficult childhood as our parents have a lot of problems (disability, mental illness and some substance abuse), and whilst they love/d us, they often couldn’t care well for us. After I left home my bro was quite neglected, physically and emotionally.

I love him to bits, he was a gorgeous child. But I fear has not grown into a very nice adult.

The dilemma is this. He went to uni but having graduated with an ok degree, he has never had a job, ever. He doesn’t want to work in an office (fair enough) and has had various ideas but never settled on anything. However he rents a decent flat (i think a housing benefit scam maybe), always has plenty of disposable income. He travels extensively. He doesn’t live extravagantly but he has nice clothes, and travels well, ie: eats out for 3 meals a day for 6 months of the year when he is abroad.

It’s become apparent to me recently what is staring my family in the face which is there is no way he is coming by this money legally. My parents believe him when he says he’s just very frugal with his benefits money. But I know what things cost and there’s no way people on the dole can afford to be living it up in Thailand for months at a time? When I’ve asked him he’s given various excuses or deflections about investing in crypto but a few questions show he knows nothing about crypto so its obviously not true.

Our family are poor working class, there are no secret inheritances or anything.

So. I have concluded he’s probably up to no good but I can’t be sure. He‘s a gentle giant and i couldn’t imagine him harming anyone but he is a big bloke. He could if he wanted to. And with the amount of money and travel, it feels like he’s not small-time dabbling either. I have this feeling he’s doing something bad-bad. Something that could get him in real trouble. Or hurt. Or others hurt. But I have no evidence.

WIBU to report him to the police to try and force him out of whatever mess he is in?

I know for sure he will not listen even if I beg him to stop whatever it is I think he’s up to. After all he’s living his best life I guess.

OP posts:
Edenmum2 · 18/08/2024 22:05

Does he have thousands of pounds in his pockets every time you see him? Are you 100% sure it's thousands? Does he get it out and flash it around? I don't think I would ever know how much money my siblings have in their pockets....is he showing off with it?

What does he say when you ask him why he's walking around with thousands in cash?

DadJoke · 18/08/2024 22:05

cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 19:06

What would you do? Genuinely open for ideas here.

he is a very stubborn man and I am absolutely certain he will not change just because i ask him to.

if you had a family member you thought was doing possibly bad crime would you just ignore?

Show quote history

I would ask him how he makes a living.

Original poster
cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 22:05

Mintchocco · 18/08/2024 21:54

Also, why do you think most drug dealers end up murdered? They are more likely to end up in jail. Not ideal, sure, but that's on him isn't it. You are obviously not too concerned about the jail aspect as you are prepared to phone the police on him?

Very strange post this is.

I am worried about him ending up in a foreign jail somewhere he could face death penalty. That’s a pretty legitimate thing to be worried about.

OP posts:
Original poster
cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 22:03

Edenmum2 · 18/08/2024 21:59

So in your OP you said:

"i think a housing benefit scam maybe"

And now you're saying:

"I know about benefits because i asked him. He’s scamming housing benefit"

So which is it? Did he tell you or do you suspect?

He told me.

Sorry mumsnet keep filtering my posts where i say what i ‘know’ so i’m trying to be cautious in my language

OP posts:
Original poster
cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 22:02

Mintchocco · 18/08/2024 21:52

You are seriously over stepping.

You also initially claimed it was for your brothers benefit as you were really worried about him but it has now changed to actually you feel it's morally wrong not to report him because you think he is hurting other people.

Your brother is an adult. You have no proof of any wrong doing.

I'm also unsure as to what you would say to the police. That you believe your brother is hurting people? fraud? involved in drug dealing? They will say and why do you think this - you then say what? Because he seems to be able to afford fancy holidays and you KNOW he is on benefits.

My brother does not know everything about me - assume you do not infact know everything about your brother. He could have won it for all you know and does not want to share this with anyone.

Leave it alone.

Well yeah there’s walking round with thousands in cash in his pockets etc. it’s more than a bit of unexplained money it’s sort of too much to ignore. Well i obviously have for years so could continue tO

OP posts:
Edenmum2 · 18/08/2024 21:59

So in your OP you said:

"i think a housing benefit scam maybe"

And now you're saying:

"I know about benefits because i asked him. He’s scamming housing benefit"

So which is it? Did he tell you or do you suspect?

Mintchocco · 18/08/2024 21:54

Also, why do you think most drug dealers end up murdered? They are more likely to end up in jail. Not ideal, sure, but that's on him isn't it. You are obviously not too concerned about the jail aspect as you are prepared to phone the police on him?

Very strange post this is.

Edenmum2 · 18/08/2024 21:53

Also just for consideration but you probably already know that Thailand really is dirt cheap so it is possible to live within modest means there.

Mintchocco · 18/08/2024 21:52

You are seriously over stepping.

You also initially claimed it was for your brothers benefit as you were really worried about him but it has now changed to actually you feel it's morally wrong not to report him because you think he is hurting other people.

Your brother is an adult. You have no proof of any wrong doing.

I'm also unsure as to what you would say to the police. That you believe your brother is hurting people? fraud? involved in drug dealing? They will say and why do you think this - you then say what? Because he seems to be able to afford fancy holidays and you KNOW he is on benefits.

My brother does not know everything about me - assume you do not infact know everything about your brother. He could have won it for all you know and does not want to share this with anyone.

Leave it alone.

Fluufer · 18/08/2024 21:52

If you know he is committing benefits fraud, report him for that. If he is, I'm sure the police will be able to pick up from there if he's actually up to anything.

Edenmum2 · 18/08/2024 21:50

There's nothing you can report him for apart from maybe benefit fraud but you might still need tangible evidence - do you know exactly what benefits he is on?

I don't think the police would be interested nor have the resources to look into someone for spending more money than you think they should have. And do you really want this on your shoulders?

He's not your responsibility, if he is involved in something 'bad, bad' then he will be caught and face consequences. I understand he's your brother but honestly I think you need you need to concentrate on your own life and leave him be.

Original poster
cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 21:48

sandyhappypeople · 18/08/2024 21:44

If you were so concerned by your moral compass you would have confronted him by now.. instead you are trying to cut him off at the knees without knowing anything.. and without him finding out that it was you, it’s not to help him or other people at all.. everyone here can see that, no matter what excuses you trot out.

Unless you have more evidence than him having a lot of cash, then I’d keep your nose out, no good can come from reporting him, if he is up to no good, it will catch up with him eventually, it’s his life to lead not yours.

if you knew something it would be different, but you don’t know anything for sure.

a similar thing happened in my family, the family member was being given money and whatever they wanted in life by their parents because of guilt over their upbringing which included sexual abuse because of their neglect.. there’s always possibilities you haven’t considered, which they would not want to admit to.

Well we have the same parents, who are also on benefits, and definitely not giving him money.

as i’ve explained, a few weeks back we had an interaction in which the scales sort of fell from my eyes and i understood, properly, for the first time, what he’s up to. Until then i was in denial, so yes my moral compass wasn’t really bothering me because i just figured oh well it’s his life, live and let live.

but a few weeks back i had this dawning realisation that he’s up to something properly bad and it made me both worried about who he’s harming and also frightened for him. Drug dealers tend to end up murdered. It doesn’t end well. So I’ve been going over and over whether I can in some way do something to make him stop.

OP posts:
Original poster
cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 21:44

Fluufer · 18/08/2024 21:24

How do you know he claims benefits and has no access to credit? How do you know he's got wads of cash, but have never so much as gently queried it? How do you know how much he spends? How do you know he doesn't have a job? Have you asked him?

Show quote history

Sorry i’ve responded on these points loads but some of them have been filtered by the site as too much detail about crime stuff i guess.

so i know he’s never had a job because we are millenials - we’re on whatsapp constantly, he’s on social media. I find it wild how many people think it possible my brother could have had a whole entire job without my knowing in a world where i know what at least 4 of my not even close mates had for breakfast today.

I know about benefits because i asked him. He’s scamming housing benefit (i wouldn’t report him for this though i do think benefit fraud is disgusting) and gets UC.

I know about amounts of money because i have seen him with stacks of cash and also other things he’s done involving money and not wanting to use a bank account but whenever i include the detail of this it gets filtered out so will leave off. but it’s dodgy stuff.

i HAVE queried as I have said a million zillion times. He gives answers which are clearly lies and gets upset if i press him. I have kept dropping it so far because i don’t want to fight. But recently it’s like the scales have fallen from my eyes and i’m sick of pretending i can’t see what’s staring me in the face.

i know he has no access to credit because he has ccjs. I know about these because he’s my brother. He also asked me for advice on if he could get them overturned and i looked over the paperwork for him.

oh and he bought himself a jetski a few weeks back! a guy on benefits with no job and no credit.

Look I’ve been telling myself for years he’s probably some small time cheeky chappy del boy type who’s hustling here and there, fingers in pies. But I need to face facts. You might make enough from del boy-ing to buy a few rounds of beers extra on a night out. Or to fund the odd trip to aiya nappa. You don’t make enough to go round buying jetskis unless you’re up to your neck in something bad.

OP posts:
sandyhappypeople · 18/08/2024 21:44

If you were so concerned by your moral compass you would have confronted him by now.. instead you are trying to cut him off at the knees without knowing anything.. and without him finding out that it was you, it’s not to help him or other people at all.. everyone here can see that, no matter what excuses you trot out.

Unless you have more evidence than him having a lot of cash, then I’d keep your nose out, no good can come from reporting him, if he is up to no good, it will catch up with him eventually, it’s his life to lead not yours.

if you knew something it would be different, but you don’t know anything for sure.

a similar thing happened in my family, the family member was being given money and whatever they wanted in life by their parents because of guilt over their upbringing which included sexual abuse because of their neglect.. there’s always possibilities you haven’t considered, which they would not want to admit to.

macbookmighty · 18/08/2024 21:40

He's your brother, he's not hurting you but you want to report him to the police? You don't even know what for. That would be such an evil thing to do. Would you tell him it was you that reported him? Just leave him be. He's old enough to make his own decisions even if they are bad ones.

LondonFox · 18/08/2024 21:36

cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 21:26

His life is not better than mine or anyone else’s. I’m not obsessed, i’m worried about him. I have way more money than he does, just I earned it the normal way. When we go out, I pay for dinner.

The reasons I was thinking about maybe speaking to the authorities I have made really clear, but as a recap:

  1. i am absolutely certain he is involved in drugs on some form of international level, trafficking etc
  2. i think it is unlikely that he is doing this without hurting people. Therefore, even though it kills me to think it, i need to deduce he is almost certainly hurting people in his line of work. This does not sit easy with me.
  3. drug dealers don’t tend to retire happily to the country. They get murdered or they end up in a foreign jail. Some of the places he’s been he would face the death penalty. By reporting him in the uk he could at least face a slightly kindlier system and save him from himself.

I get that a lot of people don’t think I should report him. I haven’t and on the basis of some of the more intelligent responses on here i don’t think i will. But it doesn’t make me evil or jealous for considering what the right course of action is.

If he ends up killed by some gang in south america or whatnot i’ll always always wish i’d done something to save him when i had the chance.

Show quote history

I get that you are worried but maybe you should just sit with him and tell him that?

I would not feel ok reporting someone without evidence.

knittingandminim · 18/08/2024 21:35

Flights from the UK to Thailand can cost on average £1000 or less for a round trip. Flights within Asia, and especially South-East Asia, are extremely cheap by comparison. I think you are greatly overestimating how much money he is spending. As for the wads of cash, surely it's just easier for him to carry physical cash around if he is going abroad and exchanging it often.

Fluufer · 18/08/2024 21:34

Op get more creative with your wording, it will keep getting hidden otherwise...

cunningartificer · 18/08/2024 21:31

Amazed at the number of people who think it's wrong to report a relative who has committed a crime.

Newsenmum · 18/08/2024 21:30

I don’t know why people are being so harsh on here. Is there anyone else you know who you can talk to? Can you find out some more info? I’d want to find out more too and then decide when I actually know something. my main fear is actually getting yourself in danger.

cunningartificer · 18/08/2024 21:28

This reply has been hidden

This reply has been hidden until the MNHQ team can have a look at it.

Original poster
cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 21:26

LondonFox · 18/08/2024 20:58

Lol why would you report your own adult, mentaly stable brother?
You cannot force people to change and you just sound obessed how better his life is compare to the rest of the family

His life is not better than mine or anyone else’s. I’m not obsessed, i’m worried about him. I have way more money than he does, just I earned it the normal way. When we go out, I pay for dinner.

The reasons I was thinking about maybe speaking to the authorities I have made really clear, but as a recap:

  1. i am absolutely certain he is involved in drugs on some form of international level, trafficking etc
  2. i think it is unlikely that he is doing this without hurting people. Therefore, even though it kills me to think it, i need to deduce he is almost certainly hurting people in his line of work. This does not sit easy with me.
  3. drug dealers don’t tend to retire happily to the country. They get murdered or they end up in a foreign jail. Some of the places he’s been he would face the death penalty. By reporting him in the uk he could at least face a slightly kindlier system and save him from himself.

I get that a lot of people don’t think I should report him. I haven’t and on the basis of some of the more intelligent responses on here i don’t think i will. But it doesn’t make me evil or jealous for considering what the right course of action is.

If he ends up killed by some gang in south america or whatnot i’ll always always wish i’d done something to save him when i had the chance.

OP posts:
Fluufer · 18/08/2024 21:24

cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 21:19

No he wouldn’t.

which is why i have put it out there on mumsnet whether a more drastic course of action to force him to stop could ever be justified.

the general consensus seems to be no though so that leaves me where i was, turning a blind eye and pretending it’s totally normal and kidding myself my brother is a nice guy really who’d never hurt anyone.

btw on cost of living in thailand, i get that but there’s loads of flights etc, there is some other detail but every time i include that my posts get filtered by mumsnet so let’s just say, i am absolutely sure we are talking big sums (tens of thousands) he is burning through, waaaaaay more than he’d have from benefits and with no access to credit

Show quote history

How do you know he claims benefits and has no access to credit? How do you know he's got wads of cash, but have never so much as gently queried it? How do you know how much he spends? How do you know he doesn't have a job? Have you asked him?

Newsenmum · 18/08/2024 21:23

cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 21:20

But what if those illegal things involve hurting people? You’d just let it slide? Because he’s family?

that just feels morally so wrong to me

Show quote history

If you actually knew then yes I would do something

Newsenmum · 18/08/2024 21:22

cantbelieveimaskingthis2 · 18/08/2024 17:47

That’s what I fear.

And if he’s caught in some of the places he goes to, he’d face the death penalty.

If i reported him in the UK and he was arrested here I could prevent that happening at least

Show quote history

Have you asked him this directly?

Swipe left for the next trending thread