Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Matthew Perry- “I wonder how much this moron will pay”

137 replies

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 16/08/2024 12:16

Sorry if there's a recent thread, it doesn't show up in search.

Apparently his doctors took advantage of his vulnerability and discussed things like “I wonder how much this moron will pay.” Matthew Perry: Two doctors among five charged over ketamine-related death | Evening Standard

That's awful. :(

Matthew Perry: Two doctors among five charged over ketamine-related death

An investigation into the actor’s death unearthed a ‘broad underground criminal network’, US attorney Martin Estrada said.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/attorney-lisa-kudrow-matt-leblanc-david-schwimmer-courteney-cox-b1176818.html

OP posts:
New posts on this thread. Refresh page
GoodieMcTwoshoes · 18/08/2024 12:44

I get that people are addicts, but for instance Amy Winehouse, she had so much money she could spend on treatment but still didn't really engage with it, even after she realised she had a problem, rather than believing what her dad supposedly said. If I had that sort of money I would throw a lot of it at getting well.

It seems like Matthew did, but at the end he chose a pretty fringe therapy that probably wasn't the best for him, plus had unscrupulous professionals working with/on him.

OP posts:
GoodieMcTwoshoes · 18/08/2024 12:04

WhyDoesItAlways · 18/08/2024 11:18

I'm not sure that's true. The writing was on the wall long before he was famous. Given barbiruates as a baby and followed by an alcohol problem during his teen years. He was hungry for fame, if he hadn't got it I can see that he would have gone down the addiction path a lot sooner and with less money would have probably taken far riskier street drugs that are often cut together with other nasty things. There are often spikes in drug deaths where bad batches are in circulation etc. I'm actually surprised he made it to the age he did, albeit he'd had a few brushes with death along the way.

He was horribly exploited though and it goes to show that money can't buy happiness or keep you safe. I'm sad to read of the death of any drug addict. I think with perry it's just such a juxtaposition to see him as chandler, larger than life looking healthy to then to know what was going on in his personal life. Same as the guy from Glee. Total shock to see him die as he looked totally healthy and no one had any idea he was a drug user.

I agree, he already had addiction issues at times before Friends. Sad Going by his book, he nearly gave up his drugs permanently (allegedly) towards the end of his life, then got hooked on this 'therapeutic' drug. Sad

OP posts:
WhyDoesItAlways · 18/08/2024 11:18

RedWinePoliticsAndHair · 16/08/2024 22:44

This made me so sad to read. Poor bastard. Being hugely rich really isn't the answer to everything. He would have been far better off never hitting the big time.

I'm not sure that's true. The writing was on the wall long before he was famous. Given barbiruates as a baby and followed by an alcohol problem during his teen years. He was hungry for fame, if he hadn't got it I can see that he would have gone down the addiction path a lot sooner and with less money would have probably taken far riskier street drugs that are often cut together with other nasty things. There are often spikes in drug deaths where bad batches are in circulation etc. I'm actually surprised he made it to the age he did, albeit he'd had a few brushes with death along the way.

He was horribly exploited though and it goes to show that money can't buy happiness or keep you safe. I'm sad to read of the death of any drug addict. I think with perry it's just such a juxtaposition to see him as chandler, larger than life looking healthy to then to know what was going on in his personal life. Same as the guy from Glee. Total shock to see him die as he looked totally healthy and no one had any idea he was a drug user.

oakleaffy · 18/08/2024 08:03

samanthablues · 17/08/2024 22:34

During the 19th century Hong Kong turned into a British colony and opium started to come into the country along with the tea trade, Victorian London had plenty of opium dens run by the Chinese. Plenty of Brits would go to this places and it was also smoked (vaporised, never injected), plenty of photographs and drawings that document these places. Rumour is people have been getting high since prehistoric times.

Opium dens in London weren’t like that of San Francisco ( a friend wrote a couple of books on it - they were more like a back room in someone’s house in London.
There is the Dore engraving supposedly of London, but the pipe looks very wrong.

A great grandfather as a young man worked in Limehouse 19th C as a boat builder ( tall ships back then) and did smoke at Limehouse and said it was “ the closest thing to heaven”

He died long before I was born so couldn’t ask him about it, but it was part of family history ( he had a gambling habit too) so can’t have been much fun for his poor wife and 7 children when money was tight.

In U.K. Laudanum seemed to be the preferred way.

Bizzarely in U.K. law it’s still technically illegal to own an opium pipe and lamp and yen hok - no other paraphernalia is “illegal” here, just specifically Chinese opium smoking stuff.
( Roots in a century old racism?)

samanthablues · 17/08/2024 22:34

oakleaffy · 17/08/2024 22:25

Iranians use opium as one might have a cup of tea, according to an Iranian I know.
Taryok (?) I think he called it. Edit : Taryak
When Iranian revolution happened, a new wave of “Smoking heroin” came in, as many fleeing Iranians smuggled it in to London 1979

As it was smoked, ( vapourised) it appealed to people who naturally were wary of injecting .
In those days there were no needle exchanges that far back.
( worked in a drugs charity )

Edited

During the 19th century Hong Kong turned into a British colony and opium started to come into the country along with the tea trade, Victorian London had plenty of opium dens run by the Chinese. Plenty of Brits would go to this places and it was also smoked (vaporised, never injected), plenty of photographs and drawings that document these places. Rumour is people have been getting high since prehistoric times.

oakleaffy · 17/08/2024 22:25

samanthablues · 17/08/2024 18:58

Fentanyl has substituted heroin, at the present time finding organic heroin in the American streets is very difficult because it’s all fentanyl, why? Because it’s made in labs, much cheaper/easier to produce and way more profitable, problem is that it’s 50 times stronger than heroin so the risk of overdosing is massive (hence the reason junkies are dying in masse in the US last ten years and the infamous “opiate epidemic”). This said fentanyl is entering Europe slowly, mostly in the western countries. In a few years heroin will be something from the past, vintage stuff only available in Eastern Europe, Arab countries etc…where the poppies are grown.

Edited

Iranians use opium as one might have a cup of tea, according to an Iranian I know.
Taryok (?) I think he called it. Edit : Taryak
When Iranian revolution happened, a new wave of “Smoking heroin” came in, as many fleeing Iranians smuggled it in to London 1979

As it was smoked, ( vapourised) it appealed to people who naturally were wary of injecting .
In those days there were no needle exchanges that far back.
( worked in a drugs charity )

samanthablues · 17/08/2024 20:31

YankSplaining · 17/08/2024 19:20

What were you having done at the dentist?

I was given oxycontin every time I had some sort of "major" dental work such as a root canal, tooth extraction etc.. My dentist would hand me a small plastic bottle with 10 pills "just in case you're in pain the next few days", truth is I was never in pain but I ended taking the pills just for recreation purposes. Yes, I was young and foolish.

Valeriekat · 17/08/2024 19:57

Thepeopleversuswork · 16/08/2024 12:28

Terrible. There seems to be an industry in Hollywood of dodgy medics preying on rich and desperate addicts like this to sell pharmaceutical grade versions of street drugs.

Not dissimilar to the guy who was sourcing strong anaesthetic for Michael Jackson (forgotten his name).

Wonder if this happens in Europe or if it’s particularly US syndrome?

not just Hollywood!

Valeriekat · 17/08/2024 19:43

Yeah it is the USA you can always find someone willing to prescribe dodgy medicine!

YankSplaining · 17/08/2024 19:20

samanthablues · 16/08/2024 14:54

While living in the US every time I went to the dentist he would give me a tube of painkillers (strong opioids), something that has NEVER happened to me in Europe, yep... doctors in the US give them away like candy so no wonder people get addicted to prescription drugs. In the UK NHS protocol will not prescribe opiates unless you're literally dying of cancer, so getting hook on them is way more difficult in this side of the pond. It's really great we have a not- for-profit public healthcare that stops the system benefitting from people becoming ill.

What were you having done at the dentist?

Marine30 · 17/08/2024 19:03

It’s totally awful and sad. Complete case of avarice and self-serving behaviour by all those around Perry. Yanbu. They all sound awful - from the Ket Queen to the slimy assistant.
Hope they all go to prison for a long time.

samanthablues · 17/08/2024 18:58

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 17/08/2024 18:33

I think that we are fortunate in the UK that we've seen what's happened in Canada/the US with Fentanyl and that's meant we've managed to avoid it being a worse problem than it could've been, because doctors try to prescribe it cautiously.

We've seen what happened over there and also we know what happened with valium etc and how many people ended up hooked on that, so these two examples have meant doctors try to prescribe opioids carefully.

But the reality is they're still used quite a bit, because they work. Most of us may be on them at some point in our lives.

Fentanyl has substituted heroin, at the present time finding organic heroin in the American streets is very difficult because it’s all fentanyl, why? Because it’s made in labs, much cheaper/easier to produce and way more profitable, problem is that it’s 50 times stronger than heroin so the risk of overdosing is massive (hence the reason junkies are dying in masse in the US last ten years and the infamous “opiate epidemic”). This said fentanyl is entering Europe slowly, mostly in the western countries. In a few years heroin will be something from the past, vintage stuff only available in Eastern Europe, Arab countries etc…where the poppies are grown.

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 17/08/2024 18:33

I think that we are fortunate in the UK that we've seen what's happened in Canada/the US with Fentanyl and that's meant we've managed to avoid it being a worse problem than it could've been, because doctors try to prescribe it cautiously.

We've seen what happened over there and also we know what happened with valium etc and how many people ended up hooked on that, so these two examples have meant doctors try to prescribe opioids carefully.

But the reality is they're still used quite a bit, because they work. Most of us may be on them at some point in our lives.

OP posts:
mathanxiety · 17/08/2024 17:52

sunburnandsangria · 17/08/2024 07:51

@mathanxiety

Erm ok. I disagree.

I worked on stuff relating to opioid epidemic and litigation.

If the tv advertising didn't work in the US, it wouldn't happen. Manufacturers spend millions on it.

It wasn't a point about Perry's case (as I already said) but the US healthcare system in general which is set up in a way which gateways patient access to addictive meds.

There is far less of an issue with prescribed pharma becoming opioid addition in the UK because physicians prescribe more carefully and review more regularly. I didn't say it doesn't happen at all but the epidemic won't happen in the UK.

Hold that beer.

I'm sorry to say that there is already concern about opioid addiction relating to prescription opioids in the UK, whether prescribed or sourced elsewhere.

Prescribing guidelines have changed since 2016, with effects being monitored.
The vast majority (over 75%) of people abusing opioid painkillers in the US received their drugs from friends or relatives for free, stole from friends or relatives, bought them on the street, or received from more than one medical prescriber. A tick over one-fifth was from a single HCP (doctor or PA).
www.samhsa.gov/data/sites/default/files/report_2686/ShortReport-2686.html

A DC of mine is a doctor working in an area of the US that is medically underserved, and it is common knowledge among doctors there that the vast majority of opioid addiction cases from thensurrounding counties that are seen in the local hospital system are the result of PAs having prescription privileges.

With the spread of PAs in the NHS, it will be very important to keep prescription pads away from them and to ensure that they do not as a body fall under the umbrella of any powerful lobby within the medical profession that will hamper strict supervision.

Saschka · 17/08/2024 17:26

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 17/08/2024 16:45

Cupid is not saying anything controversial- anyone who's had much to do with a healthcare setting will know how some patients/clients act towards HCAs etc, and that a response to/relationship with medication might be part of it, makes perfect sense.

Maybe your clients need a medication review, have the doctors or district nurses reviewed their pain meds recently so that they are not left in pain.

@MissMoneyFairy Sadly there's only so much that can be done, before the dose of a med would have a worse impact on the person's health than the pain. It's a delicate balance the whole time.

Plus some people genuinely are drug seekers. It's not necessarily their 'fault',' there can be all sorts of reasons for it such as loneliness, mental health etc.

Edited

Not 30-40% of all patients though… I think that is what people are taking issue with.

mathanxiety · 17/08/2024 17:09

Grandmasswagbag · 17/08/2024 08:21

I though that opioids are only used here for end of life care and short term chronic pain. Obviously there are a lot of people addicted to OTC painkillers but they are no where near as strong and lethal as something like oxy. I've never heard of people being prescribed strong opiates in the UK for chronic pain, because it's not effective treatment. 'Breakthrough pain' is simply a marketing tool that the saklers came up with when patients complained that the effects didn't last any where near 12 hours. They knew the time release stuff was essentially BS. It was all lies to make Drs feel comfortable prescribing in a way they never would have before.

They are absolutely prescribed (and widely prescribed) in the UK for chronic pain.

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 17/08/2024 16:45

MissMoneyFairy · 17/08/2024 14:20

Really. Are you a doctor specialising in the treatment of chronic pain. What do you mean they get nasty.

Cupid is not saying anything controversial- anyone who's had much to do with a healthcare setting will know how some patients/clients act towards HCAs etc, and that a response to/relationship with medication might be part of it, makes perfect sense.

Maybe your clients need a medication review, have the doctors or district nurses reviewed their pain meds recently so that they are not left in pain.

@MissMoneyFairy Sadly there's only so much that can be done, before the dose of a med would have a worse impact on the person's health than the pain. It's a delicate balance the whole time.

Plus some people genuinely are drug seekers. It's not necessarily their 'fault',' there can be all sorts of reasons for it such as loneliness, mental health etc.

OP posts:
MissMoneyFairy · 17/08/2024 14:53

Maybe your clients need a medication review, have the doctors or district nurses reviewed their pain meds recently so that they are not left in pain.

ByCupidStunt · 17/08/2024 14:38

MissMoneyFairy · 17/08/2024 14:20

Really. Are you a doctor specialising in the treatment of chronic pain. What do you mean they get nasty.

Are you a doctor specialising in the treatment of chronic pain

No, I'm a home care assistant and have been for many years.

What do you mean they get nasty.

I mean that if the carers arrive late at their house to administer medication and that medication is pain relief then the clients often complain about the carers arriving late. They are rude and agressive towards the carers who arrive late, usually due to traffic problems. It's because they've become addicted to their pain relief and are sat anxiously waiting for their next dose. It's very common and very sad.

McSilkson · 17/08/2024 14:29

beeloubee · 17/08/2024 10:16

It's worth reading the medical saga of elvis presley to get a better understanding of it

I know quite a lot about Elvis. His "doctor"/drug-pusher, Dr Nick, was so notorious that he had a Simpsons character of the same name based on him. His medical licence was eventually permanently revoked for a history of mass overprescribing. Elvis naively trusted him because he was a "doctor" and therefore saw the drugs he was taking as "good" for him.

MissMoneyFairy · 17/08/2024 14:20

ByCupidStunt · 17/08/2024 10:51

Yep

You've only got to spend a few months working in home care to see how attached people are to their pain relief.

It's the reason they get so nasty when carers are late through no fault of their own.

I'd say 30-40% of the elderly I go to are drug addicts.

Really. Are you a doctor specialising in the treatment of chronic pain. What do you mean they get nasty.

Username75184 · 17/08/2024 11:26

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 17/08/2024 10:54

ketamine is highly addictive

Years ago, Ketamine wouldn'tve been viewed as addictive. In the 90s/early 00s, people took it with the expectation of getting a lot of very convincing hallucinations. They weren't taking it for relaxation (surprisingly, as it's an anaesthetic.) I never took it thankfully, but that's what people described.

Maybe the dose people take has changed a lot.

Also he was an addict, he shouldn'tve been prescribed anything that can give someone any kind of 'hit.' But I suppose if anything made him feel better, he might've got hooked on it.

Ketamine is highly fashionable at the moment and a lot of young people are having serious bladder issues as a result.

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 17/08/2024 10:54

ketamine is highly addictive

Years ago, Ketamine wouldn'tve been viewed as addictive. In the 90s/early 00s, people took it with the expectation of getting a lot of very convincing hallucinations. They weren't taking it for relaxation (surprisingly, as it's an anaesthetic.) I never took it thankfully, but that's what people described.

Maybe the dose people take has changed a lot.

Also he was an addict, he shouldn'tve been prescribed anything that can give someone any kind of 'hit.' But I suppose if anything made him feel better, he might've got hooked on it.

OP posts:
ByCupidStunt · 17/08/2024 10:51

Yep

You've only got to spend a few months working in home care to see how attached people are to their pain relief.

It's the reason they get so nasty when carers are late through no fault of their own.

I'd say 30-40% of the elderly I go to are drug addicts.

GoodieMcTwoshoes · 17/08/2024 10:46

Grandmasswagbag · 17/08/2024 08:21

I though that opioids are only used here for end of life care and short term chronic pain. Obviously there are a lot of people addicted to OTC painkillers but they are no where near as strong and lethal as something like oxy. I've never heard of people being prescribed strong opiates in the UK for chronic pain, because it's not effective treatment. 'Breakthrough pain' is simply a marketing tool that the saklers came up with when patients complained that the effects didn't last any where near 12 hours. They knew the time release stuff was essentially BS. It was all lies to make Drs feel comfortable prescribing in a way they never would have before.

As Username said, yes people can get them for chronic pain here. And they can grow very attached to them.

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread