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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think this is why the high street is failing?

614 replies

MiamiWindMachine · 14/08/2024 11:03

I’m off on holiday in a couple of days, so thought I’d go up to the big shopping centre for a couple of last minute things.

In the massive H&M, all the tills bar one had been converted to self-service. The ones on the floor I was on were ALL closed. I went down to the lower floor and there was a huge queue, because no one could work out the machines. There was a step to remove security tags, and people couldn’t work out whether this was only for those plastic tags or if there was some flag on the barcodes for lower value items. Someone else was trying to process a return via these tills. When a member of staff eventually appeared, she confirmed returns could only be processed at a manned till. The customer pointed out that there were no manned tills. The staff member had no idea who to ask about it, then disappeared to find someone, so the queue was getting even longer.

I was on the way out about 15 minutes before closing time and went past M&S. I thought “I wonder if the Bureau de Change is still open” and went to check. The woman saw me approach and had a pained look on her face, saying “Arrgghh, I’ve just cashed uuuppp!” I was a bit taken aback, but said “Oh well, never mind. What time do you close, for future reference?” She then reluctantly admitted that she was supposed to be open until 8, but said “But I do start cashing up at around 7.30”. I was about to ask why when she started saying, “It’s fine; I’ll do it, I’ll do it”, like she was doing me a massive favour. I tried to pay on Revolut and she said “We can’t take those cards!”, as if it was somehow obvious. I asked about Apple Pay and she said, “No, it has to be a proper bank card or credit card”. I therefore went to pay with my credit card and she said, “You do know we have to charge a fee for these, don’t you?” I said I didn’t have a choice given she’d rejected two other payment methods.

I then went down to foods to grab a ready meal and some wine. I went to a manned till as I had alcohol and the girl said, “Oh, could you go to the self-service? It’s just that I’m closing this one”. I asked about the alcohol and she said, “I can approve that from here; it’s just that it’s easier for me”.

I feel like we’re constantly told in the media “Use it or lose it” re: the high street; how sad it would be if we lost the personal touch. From what I could see yesterday, one store has done everything possible to eliminate personal interaction, while in the other, the staff are more bothered about their convenience than the customers’. Is it any wonder that people would rather click a couple of buttons to get something delivered?

OP posts:
Nanny0gg · 14/08/2024 12:39

notanotheronenow · 14/08/2024 11:56

I thought similar until I went to Boots to buy some makeup sponges and they were security tagged (yes, really).

The only tills were self-service. So I had to hunt someone down and ask what I was supposed to do, then they had to come and take the tag off, so I had to queue for the checkouts and then start another queue for the security tag thing.

I really don't think most people want to bother with that. And generally, it's for high value items that are tagged, not makeup sponges. Supposedly. So the supermarkets are losing money there.

Not to mention that self-scan = smaller basket/trolley of items, as no one can be arsed to do a full shop and do that, not to mention there's not enough space for items or people getting past. So it's a self-fulfilling cycle of getting worse, impatient staff etc.

Edited

That's why the scan and go system is so much better

Uglyandgrumpy · 14/08/2024 12:39

And on top of this... try to get in and out of the damn place without picking up a parking/bus lane fine. Yes I know it's the drivers responsibility but going there for years and all of a sudden there is a new bus route/lane with very little signage. Sooner the town centres are gone and kier builds them into high rise flats and council estates with the new 1.5m houses he has promised the better, then I will never ever need to go there again, bring it on.

NeedSomeAnswersPlease · 14/08/2024 12:39

@GoldenLegend no, ignorant. They're incredibly simple and there's no reason why the vast majority of the population can't use them.

GoldenLegend · 14/08/2024 12:35

NeedSomeAnswersPlease · 14/08/2024 11:10

I think if you refuse to use self checkout/the hand held things in the supermarket, you're just ignorant.

It's 2024. This all has shades of people complaining when the currency system in the UK changed, or when bank cards were introduced. You can do it, you just refuse to learn how to.

"Ignorant"? Do you mean awkward?

MistressoftheDarkSide · 14/08/2024 12:34

Ha.

As an ex small independent retailer with a niche who had to give up my bricks and mortar shop at the beginning of the year, I agree with many points already raised. Just for the record, Fuck Temu for a start, and fuck people who would take pictures of my stock, Google to find it cheaper in front of my face and then exit empty handed while telling me what a wonderful "experience" they'd had.

So another thing that I noticed - the more I posted online via social media, all upbeat and personal and "building my brand" (retch) the fewer customers I got, - but the more online fawning - even from the community I was catering to. There's a bizarre disconnect between real world and virtual world in retail I find. It's almost like the whole "manifestation" shtick as well - as my takings plummeted my customers were all "Oh, be positive, keep going" and I fucking fell for it.

I tried new stock and opening hours and events etc etc and nothing bloody worked. As a result I'm in debt, and after 7 years mine and my late DPs dream is down the swanny.

I'm pretty bloody bitter actually. I only needed to take 200 a day, five or six days a week to keep myself and run the business. Couldn't even do that.

The main culprit of all this is progress - people's expectations are sky high but for the lowest possible price, and that comes online. Instagram woyld have us believe independent retail is all wonderful and actually it's not. When you realise that people can buy identical products from Temu et al cheaper than you can buy from wholesalers, you realise we're truly in the sodding upside down.

And no, buying from Temu to resell doesn't work because you still have to make a profit to survive because that's kind of how it works, which seems to surprise people.

My town is now dominated by all stripes of beauty shop and barbers, coffee shops, basically only things you can't get online, but even they close down and re-open on a regular basis. Only pubs are coining it. In between are boarded up department stores and a few "emporiums" with little stalls that cannot sustain a full time living after even that rent is paid (I explored that option and would have been lucky to break even).

So, adios retail. Well done fuckwit local council for screwing up parking, favouring student accommodation in central locations over anything else etc etc

M&S bailed out about three years ago and their big store remains empty.

I miss community, creativity etc etc. That's all gone now. I'd love to still be running my shop, but corporations, online and council mismanagement have totally changed retail in so many ways, and frankly at 55 I'm too old for this shit.

Anyway, sorry fir the rant - good to get it off my chest because I've run out if bloody "gratitude" and "positivity".....

GingerPirate · 14/08/2024 12:32

NeedSomeAnswersPlease · 14/08/2024 11:10

I think if you refuse to use self checkout/the hand held things in the supermarket, you're just ignorant.

It's 2024. This all has shades of people complaining when the currency system in the UK changed, or when bank cards were introduced. You can do it, you just refuse to learn how to.

Well, it is 2024 and honestly, it's more shit here than a former Communist Czechoslovakia.
And no, I cannot go back for personal reasons, although I would walk back barefoot. ☹️

Greenbananasoup · 14/08/2024 12:32

MiamiWindMachine · 14/08/2024 11:25

But realistically that’s not my problem. That’s for her to take up with her manager.

That’s a bit entitled. Just go earlier next time.

WorriedMama12 · 14/08/2024 12:31

Izzymoon · 14/08/2024 11:34

The point of Revolut is to have a perfect exchange rate and no fee on your card. By paying in sterling with your card at a high street exchange rate you’re adding several steps to the process and losing out on the exchange rate.

Yea but there are quite a few counties out there where cash is preferred over card, especially for smaller amounts. If I had wanted to pay for a bottle of water in some of the shops I went to in Cambodia, I'd have been met with a confused look and a refusal. Same with a pack of samosas/cup of chai on the train in India.

SlashBeef · 14/08/2024 12:30

RaraRachael · 14/08/2024 11:24

I walked out of H and M Edinburgh at the weekend. One till with a person operating it who speng 10 minutes with one customer. There were 3 people in front of me with massive pest of clothes.

Primark was all self service. I told the h
girl I had no idea what to do - cue much eye rolling.

But what do you mean? You just scan your stuff. She shouldn't have rolled her eyes at you but I genuinely don't understand how you can have no idea what to do. It's basically playing shops.

IDontHateRainbows · 14/08/2024 12:30

I buy 90% of everything online now. I will only buy whwn its free delivery/ returns and have no qualms about adding extra items to my order that I will return, in order to get above the free delivery threshold.

CatMum27 · 14/08/2024 12:28

NeedSomeAnswersPlease · 14/08/2024 11:10

I think if you refuse to use self checkout/the hand held things in the supermarket, you're just ignorant.

It's 2024. This all has shades of people complaining when the currency system in the UK changed, or when bank cards were introduced. You can do it, you just refuse to learn how to.

I shop at my local Asda and always use the hand held scanner. Or at least I try to. I go once a week for the big shop and in the last two months every time they have either been out of service, not enough charged handsets available or they have failed as soon as I’ve picked them up. As I’m logged into the system I can’t get another handset for 30 minutes by which time I could have completed my shopping. I’ve downloaded the app which does the same thing but it either refuses to connect or drops the signal as you’re going round. This results in missed items and your whole shop having to be rescanned and repacked. Several times the scanner has failed to connect to the till at the point of payment which means it all has to be scanned through the self scan checkout.

Except that these checkouts are also often slow or not working. And if they are “working” then they seem to want to check every third item in case you’ve not placed it perfectly in the bag and the weight is off. Or someone has to come and check that you are old enough to buy alcohol or medication. I really feel for the single member of staff they have who has to deal with all this. Interactions at these tills seem to take twice as long as shopping at a manned till ever did. I notice that they are now opening more in-person tills (which always have an queue) and there is a notice saying that the number of self scan tills will be reduced so there is clearly customer demand.

So no, I don’t think refusing to use these things is ignorant. I think installing absolutely loads of them without thinking through the business model is ignorant. I think not listening to what your customers want is ignorant. These things are great when they work but there seems to be little contingency if they fail. Have them as an option but if they’re all you offer and people don’t like them will vote with their feet and take their cash elsewhere.

pgtips2 · 14/08/2024 12:28

Retiredearly61 · 14/08/2024 12:21

I went in a well known sports shop for some swimming shoes, men’s were two for 18 and women’s two for 16. I wanted one of each so they wanted to charge me 21. I asked to speak to the manager to try to get both pairs for 17, not a chance!
I put them back and got two much nicer pairs on Amazon for 17. Time and time again I try and support the high street but end up online, mainly due to availability.

I think there have always been people who can't think out of the box and show initiative.

But it seems to be much more common now that people just go 'no'.

Another pet hate is when people - who clearly are either not the driven kind or inexperienced - don't offer to ask someone else?

The number of times I've said, can you please ask someone else and then they've sorted it on the spot.

Why on earth wouldn't you ask your colleague first before you say 'no can do'!!

OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon · 14/08/2024 12:27

I was in the largest Boots in my area a couple of weeks ago.
There used to be 5 till points, which could be staffed.

Now 4 of these tills are self service, and the one that is staffed is for collection of parcels and returns etc.

WE need to put our unhappiness in writing, prefer by letter, to the store/s and Head Office.

and we should fill out these blooming customer satisfaction bit on the back of our receipts - yes ' we ' are supposed to be saying how wonderful it all was and to name helpful members of staff ( who often get an instore ' reward ' if mentioned x times ) but we really do need to let the store know how it is really !

Willoo · 14/08/2024 12:27

If companies aren’t paying staff after finishing time then the staff needs to report them. I threatened this once and we started to get paid after that.

dutysuite · 14/08/2024 12:24

I feel for all the people who are losing their jobs because of it, and if no one is working how do these stores think they will survive in the long run.

WearyAuldWumman · 14/08/2024 12:24

Abra1t · 14/08/2024 11:36

Same with banks. I have banked digitally for years and years. I don't need telling that online is convenient--I know.

In the weeks following a recent bereavement, I needed to go to an actual branch to sort things out, things that can't be done on the app and which they tell you you have to go to a branch to do. Ours is 18 miles away. They meet you aggressively at the door with an IPad and demand why you're there, why you haven't used the app (because I'm having problems with the app), what your problem is (the day after a bereavement I opened an account and accidentally used my maiden, not married, name. 'Why would you do that?' Because I hadn't slept for days and my mother had died the previous night).

An elderly couple, hunched over, moving with obvious discomfort, were asked why they weren't using the app. 'Because our eyesight is bad and we have bad arthritis in our fingers.'

Same with the post office. 'Why are you here?' Because I have a complicated postal query. 'Why aren't you using the machine?' Because I have a complicated postal query. It's like being in a Soviet-Era store.

I'm sorry you went through that.

My own bank has people standing there encouraging you to do everything digitally/on the machines, but at least they have people ready to jump in and help you - they're honestly lovely.

When my husband died 3 yrs ago, I went into his bank in another town. I fully expected to have to make an appointment - that was what happened with the Building Society when my mum died. God bless them, while I was speaking to the girl at the desk the manageress overheard, came straight out and told me to come into her office. Sorted everything out there and then.

A week ago, I saw an article in the newspaper telling us that the branch is being closed down but (Good news!) there will be a banking hub. Useless.

So far my own bank is staying open.

Toastcrumbsinsofa · 14/08/2024 12:21

LakieLady · 14/08/2024 11:56

I don't prefer shopping online.

Food shopping online is shite for people who live alone, you end up with 5 days worth of food that all has to be eaten by the day after tomorrow or it goes out of date, and you can't hand pick the leanest/freshest/least manky items. And my shopping rarely comes to enough to get free delivery. Plus I'm promiscuous when it comes to food shopping: I get all my basics from Tesco, most of my fresh stuff from Waitrose and a few things from Aldi.

Clothes shopping is even worse. Every pair of shoes I have ever ordered online has had to go back because they don't fit, clothes are never as nice as they look in the pics, or the fabric has a horrible feel/is a completely different shade from how it looks on my screen/is just generally shoddy, and I hate buying bras without trying them on because of inconsistent sizing.

Ocado and Waitrose tend to be much better than Tesco, Asda or Morrisons for longer dated fresh items when buying online shopping. I know they are more expensive, but I found it was a false economy to buy from the other online supermarkets.

Retiredearly61 · 14/08/2024 12:21

I went in a well known sports shop for some swimming shoes, men’s were two for 18 and women’s two for 16. I wanted one of each so they wanted to charge me 21. I asked to speak to the manager to try to get both pairs for 17, not a chance!
I put them back and got two much nicer pairs on Amazon for 17. Time and time again I try and support the high street but end up online, mainly due to availability.

EvangelicalAboutButteredToast · 14/08/2024 12:20

Add to that having to pay for bags, so I’m hoofing about a load of bags just incase. Parking is also expensive and frustrating

SilverGlitterBaubles · 14/08/2024 12:18

It is very sad to see our town centres are becoming more and more empty and run down. Shopping used to be an enjoyable experience but now it is frustrating, with no sizes in stock, little staff and zero customer service. Then you have boarded up premises with homeless people camped out, concerns about crime in larger cities is it any wonder people just shop online.

EvangelicalAboutButteredToast · 14/08/2024 12:17

Young retail staff are so rude that’s enough to put me off. Not every young person I will accept, but a vast portion of them. Sarcastic, distracted. Lots of rolling of eyes and tutting.

pgtips2 · 14/08/2024 12:16

MiamiWindMachine · 14/08/2024 11:19

The woman cashing up at 7:30 probably doesn’t get paid past her shift so why wait?

Because the service is supposed to be available until 8.

Yes, agree with this.

Also, I used to work in shops when I started out, paid a pittance. I'd always - like I think most of us then - would ensure that you do what you need to do even if it means staying on for a few minutes. I remember working OT for no money lots. I think you do need to go the extra mile sometimes but not everyone is that driven I guess.

Also, some of those self service tills are soooo annyoing. One Lidl store I go to, the self service tills keep malfunctioning for virtually every third item you put in the bag. Not just me, everyone the same and only one staff (if you're lucky!) to sort it out. Obviously some issue with the calibration of the weight but really annoying.

Planttreeseverywhere1 · 14/08/2024 12:16

The hight street is dying because this country has zero active transport infrastructure or decent public transport. If you have to rely on every person bringing with them a 2 ton lump of metal then you will never get the volumes you need to make a vibrant city

WearyAuldWumman · 14/08/2024 12:15

NeedSomeAnswersPlease · 14/08/2024 11:10

I think if you refuse to use self checkout/the hand held things in the supermarket, you're just ignorant.

It's 2024. This all has shades of people complaining when the currency system in the UK changed, or when bank cards were introduced. You can do it, you just refuse to learn how to.

Ignorant? Maybe.

I'm 64, so not that old. However, since I lost my husband I find myself becoming easily muddled. I hope that that resolves, but real old age beckons, so....

There's also the fact that - for some of us - the only human interaction that we get all day is a greeting at a checkout desk or shop counter.

I've been through umpteen changes in my life: decimalisation, credit cards, ATMs, computerisation.

I choose to use the "normal" checkouts because I don't want to get muddled, I want human interaction and I'm hoping that if we keep using those checkouts it might help keep someone in a job.

I'm ignorant. Shoot me.

BunfightBetty · 14/08/2024 12:13

Nanana1 · 14/08/2024 12:00

@BunfightBetty obviously, but as I said not unrelated.

Yes, it will be a part of it, for sure, it is a bit chicken and egg, as pp have mentioned.